What old rose might this be?
A little background - in October 2012 I took some cuttings from a very old rose at my local cemetery. Two of the cuttings were successful and so last July (mid-Summer) I planted them both in the same hole because they weren't particularly large and I thought that the two of them might grow into a reasonably-sized rose bush.
The 'reasonably-sized rose bush' is now just under 1 metre in height with a similar diameter. It is smothered in buds and blooms and appears healthy (apart from a touch of powdery mildew). I think it may be an old tea rose but I really have no idea. I've put a folder of recent photos on Dropbox and am trying to work out whether this link might work -
https://www.dropbox.com/sh/3ddrotxtu8gd6dv/sNh_XYq2K5
I apologise in advance if the link doesn't work - I've not tried to do this before - fingers crossed
Tricia
PS I just copied and pasted the link above into my browser and it worked - hopefully, it will work for anyone interested in seeing this beautiful rose!
Comments (46)
nikthegreek
10 years ago
tuderte
10 years agoRelated Discussions
Can anyone help me ID this rose? Old rose on old homesite.
Comments (17)Your rose looks similar to a rose in the Sacramento Cemetery, our found rose, "Dr Peck's 12th Avenue Smoothie" is thornless, once blooming. Very fragrant. This found rose is thought to be the same as the Charles Lawson in commerce. Below is a link to a photo I took in the cemetery a few years ago. I liked this rose so much that I propagated it and planted it in my yard even though it is a once bloomer. It is quite vigorous and now takes up the back corner along the fence. Here is a link that might be useful: Dr Peck's 12th Ave Smoothie/Charles Lawson...See MoreWhat variety of Rose might survive in Mid Coast Maine?
Comments (2)Yes, there are roses out there that will survive well below -20 but I don`t know what kind of humidity you have in the summer. That can often create problems with powdery mildew and blackspot. The Canadian rose series Explorer, Parkland and Canadian Artists groups are pretty tough for the most part. Any shrub roses(Hansa for example are also very tough - I grew it in the Northwest Territories -40 below and colder and it did fine) I would think that Quadra, John Cabot, Felix LeClerc, Henry Kelsey, Ramblin` Red or William Baffin could work for you. Some of these are REALLY thorny but vigorous. Hope that helps....See MoreWhat might this rose be?
Comments (6)Oh, thank you all for your replies! It's about 2.5-3" fully opened and does not repeat. It's about 5-6' tall, depends on where it's grown (in my friend's garden it's slightly shorter as hers is in more shade than mine). I'll have to take a photo of the leaves and repost for you to see, mad_gallica. Thanks again!...See MoreWhat rose is this?--Very old belongs to my 80 year old neighbor
Comments (11)Hi, all! My own garden is winding down, as I'll be moving the old roses to the cemetery when places for them become available. My landlord had to have work done in the front "yards" of my house and next door -- we're on the same lot, both owned by him -- and that meant ripping everything out from there. Roses went to the cemetery in Autumn, and I've been waiting for him to replace the sidewalk before putting things back together there, but then all the COVID-19 stuff happened, so it's just sitting there looking barren. The back needs attention and simplification, because spending so much time and energy on three gardens is wearing me down. Again, because of the COVID-19 stuff going on, I haven't been able to get it mulched, and it's not "picture-worthy" at the moment. Eventually, as the last of the roses move to the cemetery, I'll be making it a simpler garden, probably filling the gaps left by the roses with edible things. Since I'd like to move in the next couple of years, I want to leave nothing behind that I can't easily replace, and also leave it simpler for the landlord to maintain. The cemetery is moving along slowly now, being as I changed jobs and don't have overlapping time there with Mark, who would drop wood chips for me to spread in the garden areas. When I was starting this, I had off on Mondays and Tuesdays, so we were better able to coordinate things. But this will be changing, since Ellie has asked if I'd be interested in working there part-time, and leaving my one-day-a-week restaurant job. This would mean that I'd be listed on the cemetery's employee insurance, and that would allow me to use some of the equipment to get things done when I'm there on the weekends, while Mark is off. Once the paperwork and finances are finalized -- again, delayed because of COVID-19 concerns -- I'll be able to do things like use the Kubota cart to move mulch myself, or use the pick-up truck for moving other things. Over Winter, I ordered many, many packets of seed for date-appropriate perennials and self-seeding annuals, but, again, COVID-19 has delayed me getting that started. It's not for lack of time -- it's more because I'm leery of venturing into stores, but I found someplace nearby that carries the seed-starting mix I want, and allows for requesting and paying for it over the phone and drop-off at my car in the parking lot. I will be doing that tomorrow. In the meantime, bulbs planted last Autumn have been blooming in the beds I made in 2018 -- if you're on Facebook, I posted pictures in the album for the cemetery, and took some videos which seem to all go into the same "videos" album regardless of subject. I haven't uploaded them to the cemetery thread on the "other forum" -- maybe I should get that done this week. Last year I started working at a public park, taking care of the rose garden there. That's my "work garden" -- 1 acre fenced, in a formal layout, with HTs, Floribundas, and Grandifloras in central beds, and various species, OGRs, and shrubs in the outer beds. One of my tasks at the end of 2019 was updating and reorganizing the garden's inventory, which is linked as a PDF on the rose garden page. I also put everything onto the HelpMeFind listing for the garden as well. If you look carefully, there are a handful of discrepancies -- the PDF file contains everything actually there, whereas the HelpMeFind listing reflects a few things that will be replaced, and a few new things that were ordered for this year. Since the latter is easier to update, I use that as a reference for the annual update of the PDF on the park page. Working at the park has been a joy, even if also a bit exhausting. There are about 3,000 roses in there, and because my position wasn't filled for a couple of years, some big old species, OGRs, and shrubs in "the back forty" were in need of some work. They looked fine from the public's perspective along the paths, but when I'd get up close and personal with them, I saw things I wanted to clean up. My boss is amazing, and she had my job before me, but after being promoted to supervisor, she simply wasn't able to be in there as much as before. She did a great job of keeping it beautiful, but one has to prioritize when one isn't able to spend eight hours a day in there because there's so much else that needs to be done as supervisor for the team. And so now that there's one person dedicated to the garden again, those lower-on-the-list things have been getting checked off, bit by bit. I'm actually rather proud of several areas in there which I've attacked, but unfortunately COVID-19 has come into play again -- the park was closed to the public as of last weekend, and the annual Rose Day Festival for June was cancelled, along with all other programs. On the one hand, this means that I have more time to focus on the picky stuff that might otherwise be lower on the list because I have to do things like keeping the paths clear after a storm, planting and tending to the annuals that won't be coming now because the park commission lost revenue from the closed golf courses and cancelled programs, or other considerations I'd have when I know people will be walking through the garden every day. But on the other hand, it means that what I get done won't get seen by the public for the big first flush, since it's possible the garden will stay closed until well after that. Right now at my "work garden", the first of the early roses have buds that will probably start opening when I return on Monday -- things like the Spinosissimas and 'Canary Bird'. All the bedding roses have been pruned, thanks to the rest of my team and our one dedicated volunteer helping me out. I, of course, still want to be my fussy self and touch things up as I have time, but in terms of being "ready", the garden is there. Since I finally updated my cell phone, I'm once again able to take pictures regularly -- and they're much better quality now. I'll make another album of my "work garden" on Facebook and post them there. Posting pictures here has still been a bit of a headache for me. Sorry to hijack the thread with this post, but I just wanted to answer what was asked about me. :-) ~Christopher...See Morejacqueline9CA
10 years agotuderte
10 years agoHi Jackie,
I just went out to see if I could get a decent photo of the leaves and prickles but it's 7.45pm here now and quite windy so I didn't really have any luck. If it's of any use here is a photo of a stem from last year with a couple of prickles.
Perhaps it's of some help to know that there aren't really many prickles at all on this rose.
I'm not here during the Winter but I don't recall seeing any hips at all even when I came back in February. Do all tea roses have hips?
Tricia
nikthegreek
10 years agotuderte
10 years agoHi Nik,
I planted the two cuttings in mid-July last year - they immediately put on lots of new growth and by the end of August were flowering - they continued to flower prolifically until I left in late November. For all I know they could have flowered through the Winter because this year it wasn't really cold here.
I didn't deadhead any of the blooms and didn't see any hips on the plant when I returned (unlike the dog roses in my hedgerow that were still covered with hips).
The flowers last year had quite a different appearance from the flowers this year.
I'm attaching a photo I took of one of the blooms on the 4th September last year.
I have another photo from late October which is different again but I don't see how I can upload more than one image at a time :-(
Cheers
Tricia
tuderte
10 years agoThis is a bloom from late October 2013 - I think it's fascinating the way the blooms change so much depending on the season.
Tricia
Embothrium
10 years ago
AquaEyes 7a NJ
10 years agoporkpal zone 9 Tx
10 years ago
jannorcal
10 years agonikthegreek
10 years agotuderte
10 years agoHow exciting to wake up this morning and see so many replies and so much interest. I see I have a whole new vocabulary to learn, too.
First though, my sincere thanks to everyone who has taken such an interest in the rose and for being so incredibly helpful.
I've taken some more photos this morning that I hope will be more helpful. Unfortunately, I seem to be able to only upload one image at a time, so I'm attaching an image of the pedicel of a bud that I cut off this morning for the purposes to trying to provide more information.
In the image you can see the little protuberances along the pedicel and it definitely does feel like sandpaper. However, to me, the receptacle feels smooth.
I will upload more photos - if anyone can tell me how to upload more than one at a time I would be very grateful.
Tricia
nikthegreek
10 years agodmny
10 years agotuderte
10 years agojacqueline9CA
10 years agonikthegreek
10 years agomelissa_thefarm
10 years ago
ingrid_vc so. CA zone 9
10 years agojaspermplants
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10 years agojaspermplants
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10 years agomalcolm_manners
10 years agonikthegreek
10 years agotuderte
10 years ago
portlandmysteryrose
10 years ago
SouthCountryGuy Zone 4b-5 SE BC
10 years agotuderte
10 years agoportlandmysteryrose
10 years agojannorcal
10 years agotuderte
10 years agomelissa_thefarm
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10 years agojohn_hook
9 years agotuderte
9 years ago
jerijen
9 years agotuderte
9 years agoHi Jeri, yes, of course you're right.
It's very hard to know exactly how old the 'Vecchio Cimitero Urbano' (Old Town Cemetery) is here. Todi has been an inhabited hill town since pre-Etruscan times! However, I understand that this cemetery has been used for a couple of hundred years - it is now 'closed' for burials but, as many of the graves are actually family tombs, then when someone dies whose family has a tomb in the old cemetery that still has space in it, they can be buried there.
There are some wonderful old roses in this cemetery - I've now managed to successfully grow cuttings of three different roses.
Some time ago you posted a 'Guide to Identifying Roses' by Mrs. Keays which, more recently, another member re-posted. I'm diligently reading through it so that I may be able to be more specific when asking for help identifying my other two unknown roses from the cemetery.
Perhaps, though, you might be able to tell me how to describe the form of this particular rose - it doesn't seem to 'fit' any of the forms in Mrs. Keays' article?
BTW, this is another one of the roses from the old cemetery that I managed to get to grow -
Tricia
luxrosa
9 years agojerijen
9 years agoLux is right. That's breathtaking.
Maybe there's a description for that form, but I can only call it "muddled." And to be more accurate, a WONDERFUL Muddle.
It's what U.S. rose judges (at least, those I've encountered) really, truly loathe about Tea roses -- and I absolutely love. Try sometime explaining that that is what they're SUPPOSED to look like. And therefore, it is correct, and perfect.
I did want to show you what new growth (and new prickles) look like on 'Mme. Lombard.'
Jeri
ingrid_vc so. CA zone 9
9 years ago
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