Well, then take 2 shots and we'll talk some more tomorrow. Well, the "clay" may be a non issue after all. You see, I didn't have a tiller when I did my first garden plot last year and I was bringing up some more red type stuff from down around 8 inches. So, based on some other land around the house (pines are planted on) I just was thinking that it was clay in my garden (I was trying to not turn over the soil because I was concerned about mixing in the clay at the time). Well, I ended up purchasing a used tiller (don't hate me for it (har)), and well, after breaking up down to around ten 1nches or so, it's NOT clay where my garden is, but it's some sort of other material that's probably not pure sand. So, now I have the pine bark fines tilled in and it looks pretty "good".... whatever that means. Not pure sand anymore anyhow. So, what would be the distinction between how sand with a clay layer (say ranging from 6-10 inches beneath the sand layer) would be treated? I'm going to be running into that soon enough in some other areas I'll plant. Also, you keep alluding to problems with the vetch. Spit it out. What's the big deal with vetch in he south vs elsewhere? I don't technically have neigbors (1.5 miles away), so my biggest concern is encroaching into my yard, the pinelands or the hardwood land? I'm seriously interested in your take on this because you've lived here. So, did anyone guess right?

Peter- Wow. Sounds like you're getting into my head. Had some questions a while back about whether people only tended/tilled their rows, or tended/tilled their entire garden. I was thinking that it could be more cost/labor effective if you only tended rows year after year and let the aisles kind of be... with some sort of cover crop. Sounds like it can be done. I'm very interested in that. Is the white clover you mention, "dutch white clover"? When it creeps, will I be able to bring it under control when I till as normal for my fall/winter garden, and my spring/summer garden, or will I need to do additional spading/ edging of some sort then, and throughout the growing season? Can I plant it now, along with my winter garden? The book sounds interesting. I'm going to pick up a copy. Thanks for the clarification on the fact that, yes, I can grow hairy vetch and cereal rye now and still have organic matter to till in, in the early spring. Great news for me. I'm being thick headed here, but I'm still not understanding how the cereal rye affects seeds/seedlings. You say "cereal rye will suppress small seeded vegetables, but will not kill healthy transplants". Do you mean that ANY healthy transplant will not be harmed, and that only small seeds sown in place may have issues? Or do you mean by "small seeded vegetables", even transplants that are grown from small seeds can be affected? No till eh? I might be interested and your experiment suggestion is certainly something I'd be interested in trying. Do you think that even with the poor soil conditions that I have currently, it would be worth experimenting with that right now? Or, as I'm thinking maybe better to bring up my organic matter by tilling in pine bark fines, bring up my potassium levels with sulfate of potash (currently very low), add alfalfa meal to supply nitrogen needs, plant the garden, mulch with either shredded leaves or straw or hay.... Then next season try the no till part of the equation? Frankly, I'm just a little unsure about how the whole no till thing is going to work for me. Don't know a whole lot about it, but kind of thinking it might be better to do "next phase" because my soil is so poor. Please feel free to argue this to me, offer suggestions for no till on poor soil conditions viability. Do you (or anyone reading this) have a good source for cover crop seed? I was going to purchase from Johnny's selected seeds, but they are out of some of the varieties I was interested in.

All green manure crops need to have growth stopped just at blossom stage since that is when the plants have the most nutrients, just when they are getting ready to set seed. A mulching mower could be used, a lawn roller might be an option (although that could be heavy), or in small plots I have simply walked around, taking very small steps, and knocking the plant stems over. Those stems are then left on the soil as mulch. Given a bit of thought I'm sure someone could make something similar to the crimper used at RRI.

I have grown it for years and it seems to me that mowing is more effective on mature plants. My crop this year was planted with Austrian peas and I began cutting it off in early March. I did not mow it but I used a sharp round-point shovel to try to skim it at the soil line and then removed the top growth to add to a layered hot compost pile. I mixed alternating layers of last fall's leaves, the cover crop tops, wood chips and finally a liberal sprinkling of rabbit food. The kill was relatively good although I still have to eradicate the occasional plant that is re-sprouting from the base. I wanted to leave the massive amount of roots in the soil to feed the organisms there and I didn't want to till the soil and harm the structure or the biological order that has developed. For setting transplants I inserted a garden fork downward fully and then pulled back on the handle to loosen and slightly uplift the soil. As I do this I can hear the fibrous roots of the rye tearing. I insert the transplant and then firm the soil. My logic is that the roots would stay in place and feed the soil, I could utilize the top growth to get a quickly finished compost and I would not disturb the soil structure to any great degree. The compost pile yesterday reached 156 degrees and I will turn it to prevent material in the middle from becoming ash. My cover crop was so dense that I feared that the top growth remaining on the surface following mowing would slow my ability to plant. I am mulching then between rows and plants with fresh wood chips from a local arborist.