Tuesday,July 14, 2008

andie_rathbone

15 years ago

last modified: 9 years ago

Old Tom certainly was prescient, wasn't he?

Gas still between $3.92 & $3.95 depending on the station here.

meldy_nva

15 years ago

last modified: 9 years ago

Local gasoline is 4.07 - 4.19 here.

The sad part is that so few people a) really believe that there is a finite amount of oil left; and b) are doing anything about actually using alternative sources of energy.

Apparently we still haven't made worthwhile progress since Edison's time.... it's been over a hundred years and yet very few use the sun's energy for anything more than the occasional garden.

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Josh, I started on a web tv. The very first day i started on a Little Rock Newspaper and ended by links to the Dept of Foreign Affairs for the Middle East and a page that said anyone could be investigated for coming to that site. There was a place for e-mails and i wrote them I was a little ole lady,my first time on line, and sorry about that. Never did hear from them. But was'nt worried anyway. Have many faults, but lack of patriotism is'nt one of them. I still have a MSN2 and i'm always getting side tracked to heaven knows where.But the things i learn both useful and useless!! seems like i remember the useless most. I wonder, if i lost my ability to learn would i lose my ability to know i could'nt learn? I know ,silly thought. It is great to have my MSN2 fixed and be back on line again after so long.

Quote Tuesday July,29 2008

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Thoughts on Elie Wiesel... A few years ago, on our (11-hour) drive to ND for Thanksgiving & bird hunting, I checked Night out from our local library on CD so we could listen to something engaging during the radio-station-challenged drive. As we were listening to the book (which I heartily recommend) on CD, Steve mentioned he had met its author several years prior. I've heard most of Steve's stories 20 times or more, but had never heard this one: Steve had been asked to write a chapter in a science textbook on an area of his expertise. He was writing about the infectious mechanisms of some virus I no longer remember (I think it was a flavor of Hepatitis, but I'm not certain of this), and there was a discovery that had changed our understanding of the virus in an important way. As a scientist, Steve is methodical about documenting his sources, and documenting our evolving understandings of science so future scientists can re-evaluate them objectively as they add to and change the body of knowledge... the ugly reality about this particular revelation was that it was uncovered by German scientists... during WWII... in a manner that was both scientifically pristine and morally abhorrent. Steve's instinct was to include the discovery, and to accurately describe the manner in which it was made so that it respected the truth of the science, but shone a light on the people who made the discovery and the manner in which they operated. He was not condoning it. In science, one cannot assert that one knows something without documenting how one knows it, and the discovery was pivotal to today's knowledge base. The editor of the textbook, who was Jewish, was understandably outraged by Steve's choice. It is easy to understand how the repugnance of the methodology could cause one to reject the knowledge of the outcome. So Steve met with Elie Wiesel and a few others to seek guidance on a morally acceptable way to proceed. After hearing his arguments, they agreed that the methodology was morally reprehensible... but ignoring the results did not serve the victims, and careful documentation did not glorify the victimizers. Ultimately though, the editor did not budge his ground, and while Steve did not agree with him, he understood and respected his position. The textbook was not printed in the way Steve would have written it. Though no one can be "blamed" for not being "rational" in the wake of an irrational and unthinkable atrocity. So, thinking about the book Night and the experience it recounts, thinking about the author's thoughtful manner in the face of a difficult moral and scientific dilemma... well, the quote is making me think again... in a very non-indifferent way...

Sun Sept 14th 2008 Plant Sale at Whitehall House Louisville

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Hi Linda! No I haven't. The Kentucky Daffodil Society will have a booth there selling bulbs. I recently joined the society and will be there volunteering, though I will just be pretty well learning the ropes. I asked a local member I will be carpooling with if I should let the society know I am available to work, and her reply was that it was not necessary. They knew she would be there and that she and I could then take turns browsing the many booths there. She mentioned that in past years Munchkin Nursery has been there. I wish I could find more info on line about what all will be offered there. I've got some plant and bulb buying money burning a hole in my pocket. I wonder what will be offered up in the Live Auction. It's going to be an exciting day. Are you maybe going to make it? Maybe we can browse together a bit, without me being a total flunky volunteer. Sue

2007 Official Rose List & MR 12 Supplement, February 2008

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endorphinjunkie

15 years ago

last modified: 9 years ago

Edison, the great elephant electrocutor, invented an energy hogging light. Only 10% of the energy used to light an edison bulb is visible light. The other 90% is given off as heat.

LED lights are so much more energy efficient. More and more lights are going that way, as the supply of LED's goes up and the price goes down. Most of my lighting is done now by energy saving fluorescence bulbs.

Will make the move to LED light bulb as the need arises.

Just won't use them for grow lights.

Pidge

15 years ago

last modified: 9 years ago

Marda, I paid 4.09 yesterday, too, and thought it was a bargain compared to prices at other stations I passed.

I love that the remark about solar energy came from Thomas Edison. Wouldn't he be shocked at the profligacy of most Americans--including me, probably.

As for using alternative sources of energy, that's very difficult if not impossible for most of us. Got any suggestions--beyond solar panels on the roof--that the ordinary American could implement? I would seriously like to know what I, as an individual, can actually do.

sheila

15 years ago

last modified: 9 years ago

$4.41 yesterday. Down from $4.47 last week.

I'm just glad I don't have to commute and I live in a small town. I'm trying really hard to cut down on my driving - choosing to shop more carefully and cut down the number of days I get into the car. Ordinarily I would drive somewhere every day. Not now.

I'm scared to think what's going to happen to people who rely on oil fired heating this next winter. I fear we'll be hearing of deaths of the elderly who couldn't afford to heat their homes.

Decades of Government have dropped the energy ball and we haven't cared enough to demand otherwise.

calliope

15 years ago

last modified: 9 years ago

Foresight, a gift I suspect more than a few historic leaders and inventors shared. Edison certainly nailed it with that quote. I worked for the company old Thomas E. founded, in one of their engineering labs for awhile. It's very true what Dorph said about the wastefulness of the incandescent bulb, both in terms of energy and the resulting light pollution but..........given it's basic design has been in use as the major source of lighting since people rode around in horse and carriage, we can't blame him however for its wastefulness, because we've had a more than a century to come up with alternatives.

I do local historical research, and it used to be a popular habit for counties to publish what amounts to a yearbook. In it you'll find biographies of prominent people, geological information, agricultural and industrial statistics and information on resources. In several of those books published at the turn of the century before last, people were already discussing how many years a certain veins of coal would produce. IOW they were aware even then that fossil fuels are finite. So, why does everyone seems so surprised to learn that now? What is even scarier is that those old estimates on how long the coal will last were based on consumption of people who lived far simpler lifestyles than those today. Our consumption has increased less based on population than on increased per household demand.

Sheila's statement "Decades of Government have dropped the energy ball and we haven't cared enough to demand otherwise." sums it up pretty much in a nutshell. Even now, as it's pretty danged obvious we are facing a crises down the road, we continue to demand housing outside of cities, buy our goods from a country halfway around the world and ship them to save a few cents, and think we need five bedroom homes for two people. We, ourselves, us........expect a government to solve this problem for us somewhere in the background and hand it to us on a platter. We are the fiddling grasshoppers and not the ant.

meldy_nva

15 years ago

last modified: 9 years ago

If you live in a house that has about 6 hours of sunlight daily, learn about "batch" solar water heaters. Not very complicated to set up, not awfully expensive, can re-use the tanks from discarded old heaters, actually works! Will save from 50% to 100% of the gas or electricity presently used to heat the household water. Even cloudy days will preheat the water an amazing amount. Just beware that today's technoguys will try to sell you a $7000 unit that does the same thing, only often not as well. My local power company notes that more than 25% of the bill is for heating water. [FYI learning can start here: http://www.builditsolar.com/Projects/WaterHeating/water_heating.htm>;

It is impossible to say how much you will save if your house has top-notch insulation, but it's quite a lot! Regardless of climate, there should be a minimum of R40 in ceiling and floor, and no less than R25 in the walls. In cold weather, windows should have window quilts for insulation (transparent bubble wrap also works well, and lets light through). If at all possible, use an "air-lock" system between indoors and out; the inside air is expensive to heat/cool, so don't let it escape each time the door is opened.

Â§ Plant deciduous trees to shade the south and west sides of your house. And/or plant vigorous long vines such as grape, clematis or big mama limas; Run the supporting twine from roof eave to the ground... the wall temperature behind the vine will be 15Â° to 20Â°F cooler than if in the sun.

I'm not into big gadgets... a lot of energy-cutting is simply re-thinking the obvious.

Â§ When baking, most of the energy is used to pre-heat the oven [only small amounts are needed to maintain the heat). So only bake once every week or two, and then do a lot of it... roast plus pies plus rolls plus casseroles plus cookies, etc... fill the oven up! On a day-to-day basis, it usually uses less energy to use a small toaster oven than the big oven to bake one small item. Either way, see if your power company offers a cheaper-rate time and do the baking then.

Â§ Solar ovens do work, but require your occasional attention and about twice the usual time; excellent for casseroles, crock-pot type meals, and muffins. I've used the windshield type even before there were plans; you can make one easily: http://solarcooking.org/plans/

Â§ Group-shop. Even if only with one other family, that will cut the use of transportation-energy in half. While on the way to the grocery, do all the other errands such as dry-cleaning, library, etc. This saves whatever gas would have been used if each errand has been run separately. Do I need to say to use re-useable bags? Use a picnic cooler to help keep cold foods cold until you get home.

Â§ Unless you have a recirculating system, a tremendous amount of "hot" water is wasted while turning on the tap and waiting for it warm up to wash your hands. It's sufficient is to clean with cold water and soap (unless you've been handling raw meat which requires very hot water and soap for cleansing); next most efficient is to save that not-warm water for cooking, dishwashing, laundry, or other uses. BTW, DH experimented with this --and he had thought himself thrifty-- he saved about 30 gallons of water each day, just waiting for it to "warm enough" to wash his hands.

Remember that no one single person can change the whole village to make better use of energy, but if every villager makes changes, the world will be improved.

oakleif

15 years ago

last modified: 9 years ago

What an awesome thread. I would never have beleived Edison would have been so right on, about the future.
I payed $3.98 for my gas today. Last week i payed $350.00 for hopefully my winters supply of Butane. I have a wood fire heater and fully planned to use it this winter. But was immedietely vetoed by whole family. Maybe one day we'll have to use it. We've plenty of forest to supply wood. I wonder about the elderly and and other lower income folk too. oh i hope things don't get so bad for them.What can we do, for ourselves and others
I've energy saving bulbs in most of my lights. my security light has an on off switch and i rarely use it anymore. We have the deciduos trees all around our house. so shade in summer and sun in winter,which helps the fuel cost. Last winter i kept temps down and wore warmer clothes. I live 30 miles from town but have cut trips to town to once weekly or less and have always done all errends in one trip.

my Sci American came today.The first Article was about global water shortage.
MY biggest problem is wasting water. Dad gum it and i know better. I am working on saving more water and we do have a well for back up. i am looking for some barrels to save run off water in. DD is going to look for some tomorrow.

Doing an oven full of baking is a given. Also use crockpot alot Since my GS is here,seems like i do alot more baking and he makes a lot of peanutbutter cookies.yummm yummm.

calliope

15 years ago

last modified: 9 years ago

People are resilient, and can and will make adjustments as they are obliged to make them. But, and this is the sad thing, it's human nature not to do those types of things until somebody forces it upon them. And when people start making the adjustments, it will be mostly those people who must out of economics.

We can go a long way toward helping the earth if we do something as simple as just stopping our wastefulness. We don't have to all immediately go into survivalist mode, though some of us have already been close to that definition for decades in some respects. After we address that in our own lives, then we go on to step II and that is going from passively not wasting to actively looking for more ways to pivot our lives around quality and not quantity. Sadly, the people with the most resources, are often the people who use disproportionate amounts of everybody else's. ;-) If you and your spouse make a quarter million dollars a year, to voluntarily live in a more austere manner is strictly a personal decision. And getting back to the McMansion thread......you can see why people make value judgments about the those who continue to build them. We are, for the most part, victims of our own short sightedness when we allowed urban areas to go into blight and fled for the outskirts....then based our lives around the need to transport ourselves around in vehicles to do the most mundane tasks, like mail a letter. Then let our public transport systems go extinct.

Tuesday,July 14, 2008

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andie_rathbone

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