Nuts. The link was pic was working. Try this:

http://image60.webshots.com/660/3/30/7/2669330070015790651rvxSwP_fs.jpg

or this:

http://family.webshots.com/photo/2669330070015790651rvxSwP

-Glenn

I have had many, many Granny Smith on M7 and you can easily keep it to 12 feet. and that is a nice rootstock for it. Granny on M26 is also very nice, and I would definitely prefer it if I could keep it from getting crown rot. M26 will fireblight and M7 will give you some tolerance. It just never seems to get as bad.
You would really like Honeycrisp on MM106. Plant it on a little rise, only as little as six inches would be helpful. Just makes a nice, manageable and productive tree. I can keep mine to ten foot tops on MM111. HC is not vigourous. It can be, depending on how it is grown, but not compared to other varieties. IME M26 crown rots as much as 106, and fireblights to boot.
Years ago I had some trees near a broken pipe that never got fixed. Long story and there is more to it than that. Anyway, those trees produced the biggest, best looking, apples I had and very heavy production year after year. They were Reds, Goldens and Jons.

Glenn,

My Winter 2008 ToA catalog indicates that all those varities are on M111. I know some more experienced folks (than me) here don't like M111, but Vintage VA Apple recommended it (and I think that's what their 100's of commercial trees are on) to me for my windy site with heavy, somewhat loamy red clay. My trees were planted as 2 year whips and have been in the ground for 3 years and I haven't had any problems. I like the fact that M111 doesn't require staking and is drought and wooly aphid resistant (and somewhat fireblight resistant?). Also, as you probably know, it is very tolerant of a wide variety of soils (both wet and dry, as well as poor quality soil), so it sounds like a safe bet for your site. As others here have warned, you'd have to prune more and worry about burr knots, though (a fair trade for the above benefit, in my case).
djofnelson

I am a big fan of MM111 for a number of reasons:
- most drought tolerant of all the rootstocks
-deals very well with most climate extremes, both heat and excessive soil moisture, although not the cold hardiest rootstock
- robust root system
- induces preciciousness but for some varieties it can take several years to come into full bearing

Most of my apples are on mm111, I have had very good luck with this rootstock and I highly recommend it.

Hey, Glenn.

Just wanted you to know, IMO, based on my experience with my two Korean Giant pear trees, you can forget about a vased shaped or spreading tree. Both of mine are EXTREMELY vertically oriented in their growth patterns, and have turned into tall, almost columnar shaped trees with short, horizontal laterals off of the main vertical trunks. I did try to prune the second one to a somewhat shorter and more open shape initially, but it would have none of it, so I eventually gave up, and it's now becoming a carbon copy of tree #1 in shape.

Actually, there are both advantages and disadvantages to this growth pattern. It makes for a compact "footprint" to the tree, so its actually a bonus if your space is limited -- the area under the dripline of my mature tree is small, since the longest vertical branches project at most about six feet from the trunk.

The disadvantage is that the mature tree is probably close to 22 feet tall, or perhaps a bit higher. I was not able to reach the highest fruits with a pole picker with about 12 feet of useable extension handle, I had to shake them down and take my chances (about a 50% survival rate after the fall).

My two trees are on OHxF rootstock, so that may have an effect on the growth pattern, who knows? Perhaps a different rootstock would have different results.

But, as I told you before, you've GOT to grow this tree. The fruit is SO good. I have a whole bunch in cold storage. I made a coleslaw last night with shredded Michili Chinese Cabbage, small chunks of pear, small slices of yacon root (another crop I highly encourage growing, it's REALLY good), dried strawberries, pecans, and a light mayo-based dressing with some buttermilk, honey, ginger, garlic, onion, and cinnamon. That was a big hit with the family.

Dennis
SE Michigan

Hi Everyone, thanks for all the great info!

So, it looks like Ill go with Geraldos advice and stick with my EMLA7 choice on the Granny Smith, and switch to the EMLA106 on the Honeycrisp. I was originally worried about the 106 making my HC too large, but now that I know that HC isnt as vigorous, it all makes sense. Im glad I posted!

Thanks for the info Dennis! Im glad you spoke up about not easily being able to Open Vase the Korean Giant easily. From what I have read about the nature of pear trees, I knew it would have been more difficult (than an apple), but after reading your post, Ive decided to take advantage of your experience. Yes, perhaps my mileage would have differed a bit, but I dont think its a huge deal not to open vase it. Also, being a open vase newbie is probably all the more reason not to attempt it with a pear. Now that I know that, it affects where Ill place it in my orchard. If you hadnt spoken up about that, Im sure I would have tried it for a couple years, and then ran in the same struggles that you did. Thanks again!

I am interested to see if my non-standard/modified clothespin technique of spreading apple limbs will work on the Korean Giant. It works so well for me on the apples, Im interested to see how its going to fail on the KG. With an apple, I can really get any angle I want by starting so very early in the laterals life. In the past, Ive actually probably over done it by getting perfect, almost espaliered-like 90 degree angles. Im determined to spread the KG out!

Thanks djofnelson & axel_sc for the info about the 111. I already have my espaliered Liberty on EMLA111, so it sounds like the new ToA semi-dwarfs will have company! (Actually, its possible that I have more on EMLA111, but my early trees from my local nursery just said semi-dwarf)

Anyway, thanks again for taking the time to read, and post!
-Glenn

Dennis, that is the way you wan to grow a pear tree so that if one leader gets fireblight you can cut it out and still have much of the tree left. The leaders are as you describe, very vertical with short horizontal limbs.
And thanks for the recipe, I will try that. Modified as I don't have yacon, whatever that is.

I don't know where you would find true yacon either, but I am almost certain the name is sometimes given to jicama, a tuber that is now found in many grocery stores in the produce section and would be good in coleslaw.

I'm going to hijack your thread for just a bit, Glenn, and provide some Yacon information.

Yacon is a tender perennial related closely to dahlias and sunflowers. It's native to middle elevations in the Andes from Chile to Equador. I grew it for the first time this year. Plants look sort of like a Jerusalem Artichoke with wide, spade-shaped hairy leaves. They get small, yellowish sunflower-like blooms in the autumn, according to the catalogs, but mine did not bloom.

The plants grow these amazingly large, sweet potato like tuberous roots underneath the crown. Mine ranged in size from about 4 ounces to well over a pound, and most were probably in the 10 to 16 ounce range. From six plants, I got probably about 2/3rds to 3/4ths of a bushel (didn't measure them exactly, just threw into a box).

The tuber has a dark brown skin, which peels easily but which can also be eaten. Texture of the flesh is similar to waterchestnut or jicama, but is more "delicate." Flavor is a very sweet, mild carrot flavor with fruity overtones. I've found it really good in both salads and stirfried dishes.

The plant also grows round, inedible, vegetative tubers that look like small Jerusalem artichokes. These are carried over (hopefully it will work for me) to replant the next season.

I ordered my three plants from Nichols Garden Nursery in Oregon last spring. They came as nice potted plants about 4 inches tall. Each one had two distinct sprouts, so I separated them at planting and made 6 total. I grew them in large barrels in good soilless mix, kept them well watered and fertilized. The plants got about 4 to 6 feet tall. I dug them in mid-October. So far, the tubers appear to be storing well -- catalogs and internet sources claim that they will store for 6 to 8 months in cool, semi-humid locations.

Seeds of Change, I believe, was also offering these plants in their catalog last year.

Over at Idigmygarden.com, in either the Heirloom Gardening or General Digging messageboards, there are a couple of yacon threads, and I posted some photos of my plants and crop taken on the day of harvest back in October. I don't have an exact link searched up, but you can find it pretty easily by doing a search for "yacon" if anyone is interested.

OK, now that I've put in my plug for Yacon ... back to your regularly scheduled program.

Dennis
SE Michigan

Actually, it looks like I do have a choice in rootstocks for my Korean Giant (Olympic) at Adams County: Betulaefolia or OHF 97. I was leaning towards OHF 97 because it looks like its more Fire Blight resistant. Both rootstocks look like theyre producing full size pear trees. So, is this tree going to be much, much taller than my other 4 apple trees pruned to 12 feet or so? Will I be able keep this tree pruned to about the same size without too much trouble? Or will this guy really stand out? Which rootstock do you like? Thanks, -Glenn