Damaged Asian Persimmon, trim branches?

13 years ago

(Let me know if anyone want me to post a photo to see what I'm talking about.)

Hello,

I am looking for recommendations on trimming my small Asian persimmon tree. I don't have the cultivar name with me, but it is a low height, sweet-while-firm variety. It was planted 2 years ago and has grown to barely 6ft now. I'm just glad it recovered from getting its trunk snapped at 3ft from the ground last winter. There were no side branches left at the beginning of growing season, but now there are 4 branches growing side by side. One branch seems to have assumed the role of main trunk, sending out small side branches of its own. I want to know what to do with the 3 other branches. They all have nice big leaves. Should I trim them to the main trunk? If so, when? I am seeing axillary buds at the base of leaf petioles now.

Also, there seem to be a pest and/or disease problem where the leaf edges are curled up. Uncurling those edges revealed spiky white scale insects and tending ants. I got some neem oil concentrate and made dilution for spray today. I read that there is a disease specific to persimmons that makes the leaves curl. Is anyone familiar with this disease and how can I tell whether my persimmon tree has it in addition to scale insects?

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Comments (8)

Scott F Smith
13 years ago
yanggers, I would let all the shoots grow this year to invigorate the tree after the loss, and then trim back to the main one this winter.

The white curly leaves is the persimmon psylla. It is hard on young trees but once they grow up they don't get bothered so much by it. Neem oil does little. Mineral oil will wipe out any exposed bits, but if the leaves are curled the oil can't get there. If you spray the oil in one hand while uncurling the leaf with the other you can set them back pretty good. A poison will also work a lot better, e.g. malathion. I did a lot of control on them when my trees were young but now I only do oil sprays early in the season to set back the first couple generations. The easiest time for control is before the leaves start curling, so next year keep that in mind. If you want to keep them completely away they need to be hit about every week with oil, or every month if you are using a poison.

Scott
creekweb
13 years ago
My advice would depend upon the variety of persimmon and the location of the new growth. Some of the dwarfing nonastringent varieties tend to have low vigor (especially after a bad winter) and I keep my pruning to a minimum with these - it sets the tree back during a stage in its growth when a top priority goal is to increase the mass of the tree. But I would dormant prune branches coming off lower than 2 feet from the main trunk.
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yanggers
Original Author
13 years ago
Thank you Scott. I will do as you wrote. The leaf curls are only at the tips and sides, so I tore off all the curled parts. I will spray oil tomorrow.
yanggers
Original Author
13 years ago
After oil spray, I see dead ants on the leaves. Looks like it worked for them. I hope psylla met the same fate.

I found a swarm of ants gathering around where the main branch meets the trunk. They seem to be drinking sap that is exposed by cracks in the bark. This branch base is expanding too fast for the bark. Is this harmful? Will the ants start chewing the tree to get more?
yanggers
Original Author
13 years ago
creekweb,
Thanks. I will take care to let the tree have as many branches as it wants, above where the trunk snapped last winter.
Scott F Smith
13 years ago
yanggers, I had thought from your description that all shoots were growing right next to each other straight up. If that is the case they are too close and you need to trim them back. That is why I was suggesting to remove all but one. You never want to have a tree with four leaders all right next to each other. If they are bending out then you can keep all the ones which are not close to another one.

Ants are no problem to the tree itself. They are probably around your tree to feed on the psyllae. They move them around to new spots and in return the psyllae let them eat their poop which the ants think tastes pretty good.

One other thing you should learn to look for is the fly stage of the psylla, they are the ones that lay the eggs. When you see a bunch of teeny flies on the leaves, that means you will have more leaf curing in several weeks so its time to spray. Thats how you can keep ahead of them.

Scott
creekweb
13 years ago
Scott,
I think you're confusing the roles that ants play in the spread of persimmon psylla with that of mealybugs and aphids. Ants are not involved in the spread of psylla though they may harmlessly eat the honeydue. The psylla nymph forms can't survive outside of their rolled leaf enclosures, so ants cannot transport them to advantage as they do mealybugs and aphids. But aphids are not important pests on persimmons; I rarely see any on my trees. So I would say the issue of whether to control ants hinges on whether mealybugs are concurrently causing problems.
Scott F Smith
13 years ago
Creekweb, I was told by someone that the ants were moving the psyllae around but I have to say I have never seen it, and the psylla flies are laying lots of eggs all the time so I could believe the ants are not causing additional problems.

Scott

Damaged Asian Persimmon, trim branches?

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Scott F Smith

creekweb

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Scott F Smith

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