Hi LavenderLass-
For me, I love my thornless blackberries and really have no desire to ever go to the thorny ones. I'm growing Chester, Triple Crown and Doyle. I'd recommend looking at Triple Crown, but I'm worried that your zone 4 will be too cold for them. What varieties is your u-pick growing?

I don't know of any thornless black raspberries. I do grow "Joan J" which is a thornless red, but I've found their flavor to vary widely... sometimes they're good. Other times they're terrible, and therefore I wouldn't recommend them. But, red/yellow raspberry thorns are not all that bad, and my 2 & 4 year old girls have absolutely no problem picking them. In fact, they do so every day after school. I can see why you want to stay away form blackberry thorns, or even black raspberry thorns, but you may not want to limit yourself when it comes to the reds/yellows.
-Glenn

The purple raspberries I'm planning to add are in a great location, away from the kids' area, so thorns are no problem there. I'm deciding between purple royalty and brandywine. The red raspberries (I've read can be very invasive) so I guess that's why I thought less thorns might be better. Where do you have your red raspberries? It's good to know the kids can pick them no problem, even with thorns.

The only plants I really want to keep thornless are the blackberries. We used to have them growing wild on the west side of the state and they could be a terror! I have a "peter rabbit potager" planned for the kitchen garden this year (just four small beds for the nieces and nephews) but I thought a few thornless blackberries nearby, might be kind of cute :)

Whaddya mean they "used to" grow wild on the west side of the state??? Trust me, I live on the west side of Washington, and they're everywhere! :)

So I take in you're in eastern Washington? If so, I'm not sure what I'd recommend you grow, as I couldn't be sure that the canes would survive the winter. If you do plant some, Chester is the hardiest thornless type, but the flavor kind of sucks unless it's totally ripe.

Hi Lavender-
Some of the flavor reviews here on GW for the purple royalty weren't great, but I planted some last year anyway. We'll see how they do. But, you my want to search these forums for that variety and perhaps that will sway you in your decision between Brandywine and Royalty.

If you click on my "My Page", you can see a little of where I grow my raspberries. (But, in there, I really don't have any great shots of my mature beds at harvest-time... I'll have to do that this year).

Red raspberries can indeed be invasive, and containment is an important consideration. For me, I find the easiest containment simply to surround them with grass. Then, when you mow the lawn, down go the volunteers. In some other areas, I have them up against the 90% buried 12" tall wooden border next to my sand volleyball court. In other areas, I have my beds surrounded by terrible gravel dirt with a small plastic border. When they do venture out there, I just pull 'em out.

I actually don't mind my Chester blackberries, but that's probably because my Triple Crowns and Doyles haven't produced for me yet. They are a little on the tart side (though just wait as long as possible before picking), but the girls and I enjoy tart things. (We eat wild grapes, cranberries, lingonberries, tart apples from the yard.) I'd say that Chester blackberries are certainly much better than no blackberries at all, but perhaps you'd be best to find out what your local upick is growing.

-Glenn

I've grown Chester and Triple Crown, but Marionberry is a better choice for flavor.IMHO Marion berry has thorns but not like the Himalayan Blackberry you are worried about. Not sure about Marion berry in Zone 4.

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Eric

Yeah, I've always wanted to grow Marionberries here in 6b, but most places I look say it's only hardy to zone 7... nevermind zone 4. Nice pic! -Glenn

Fruitgirl- I meant we used to have them growing by our house. I'm sure they still grow like crazy over there :)

I'm in eastern Washington, five miles from Idaho. Green Bluff (north of Spokane) has several u-pick fruit farms and some carry up to four types of thornless blackberries. I'm thinking of waiting until they're ready this summer and trying them before I decide. Same goes with the purple raspberries, if they have them.

I wish I could find someone who carries Valiant or St. Theresa grapes. Our summers are hot, but short and I doubt Concord will ripen in time (my first choice) but I hate to buy fruit (especially grapes) without knowing how they're going to taste!