This bonsai guy doesn't like Turface
alan_oz
10 years ago
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JoppaRich
10 years agolast modified: 9 years agodrew51 SE MI Z5b/6a
10 years agolast modified: 9 years agoRelated Discussions
Sepiolite/Attapulgite as Turface subs in Als mix in Spain
Comments (14)A quick update and a question: I've located Calcined Sepiolite in Industrial Absorbent format, apparently the local fire department uses it on flammable liquid spills. Unfortunately, the particle size it's available in is tiny -- fine sand (The bonsai crowd appears to have ruled out all the Sepiolite kitty litters, as none of them are calcined and they all break down eventually. This leaves me with the following options -- I'm having a hard time picking which one to use as a Turface replacement in Al's gritty mix and would appreciate your opinions. I've not yet completely given up hope on finding a Turface equivalent but things are looking grim. On the bright side, I've been able to locate coarse silica sand for aquarium use, 2-4mm. It's a bit pricey but available within walking distance and I don't have to screen it. One ingredient down at least! Still trying to hunt down pine bark fines in the right size range, the cheapest chipper I've been able to find is a whopping 700! No rentals available. :( Closest fines so far are in the 10-45mm range, way too big. The search continues... Option 1: Calcined Attapulgite in industrial absorbent format, available in "4/30 grain size". Still trying to figure out what size that is exactly, though I know 15/30 is 0.5-1.5mm. Option 2: Mystery clay! A Calcined Kaolinite/Montmorillonite mixture (5-10mm) used in ceramic production as grog. (Learned a new meaning for an old word!) Grain size seems a bit big, no idea if the stuff breaks down or is phytotoxic -- I was unable to find anything on Kaolinite in agricultural uses except as a pest control agent. Montmorillonite percentage is uncertain. Seems they only sell it by the metric ton, trying to get my hands on a sample. Option 3: The same company produces LECA/Hydroton in small grain sizes, so-called "mini LECA". Available in 3 formats and 3 different densities: 350 ± 50 Kg/m3, 550 ± 50 Kg/m3 or 750 ± 50 Kg/m3. I'm guessing lighter = more porous = more water retention, so I'd opt for the lightest of the three densities. The formats are ground (0-6mm), sand (0-4mm) or fine (3-10mm). Pictures in the link below. Option 4: Our final contender is raw Attapulgite (non-calcined) in kitty litter form, mentioned in previous posts. Conflicting reports from the bonsai folks on whether the stuff breaks down or not over the long term. If you were faced with these options, which would you choose?...See MoreCan I use Turface All-Sport instead of MVP?
Comments (16)OMG, I can't stand up straight or straighten my fingers anymore! I've been outside all day and haven't eaten a thing since breakfast. I made one batch (6 gallons) of gritty and ran out after re-potting about 2/3 of my succulents. I made a 2nd batch of gritty, but ran out of daylight before I could pot up the rest. I learned one thing today - sifting sucks! Maybe it's just using the small bonsai screens I have, but I think larger screens would be too heavy to shake for me. I did end up tying a bandanna around my face to keep from breathing the dust. I'm sure my neighbors really think I'm crazy now. For the pine fines, I started with a large-sized 1/2" screen that I placed over my wheel-barrow. Then I used the 1/4" bonsai screen followed by the 1/8" screen. I kept what went thru the 1/4" but not the 1/8" screen. For the All-Sport and the Manna Pro chicken grit, I sifted using the 1/16" screen. Then I rinsed it all, mixed it up, added gypsum and started re-potting. The re-potting took a long time because I had to remove all of the soil from the roots. After all, I didn't want to contaminate my gritty with that nasty old potting soil! I was shocked to see how much moisture was trapped in the soil, it's no wonder why the plants were struggling. I was wondering, can I use the pine fines that were 1/4" in any mixture or will the particle size be too different from the other ingredients to make it useful? Either way it won't go to waste, I just figured it would save me on having to sift more. I'll post pictures after I finish tomorrow. This post was edited by ifionlyhadabrain on Sat, Sep 14, 13 at 21:44...See MoreCustom Soil Mix - Turface / Pinebark
Comments (8)40/20/20 sounds reasonable. While I was doing the most experimenting with soils and soil ingredients, my focus was on root health. The gritty mix came about almost as a by-product of my search for a soil that held no perched water, but still held enough water in internal pores to satisfy both the plants needs for water and my need to be divorced from having to water with unreasonable frequency. I think the goals are worthy ones, but they can be approached via different routes. I tend to think of other's attempts at approximating the gritty mix in terms of water/air retention. What would most closely mimic the gritty mix using bark/perlite/Turface, would probably be: 3 bark screened 1/4-1/8 4 perlite screened over insect screen 2 Turface screened over insect screen You know better than I, what you're trying to achieve. I try to leave you with the idea that the air:water ratio and durability is important; and the hundreds of forum discussions help to show what roles the physical properties of various ingredients you might use play. The CONCEPT is the important thing. How you get there doesn't matter much. Have fun & let us know what your experiences are. Best luck. Al...See MoreTurface as a soil conditioner
Comments (3)Here it is 2013. I am growing Bromeliads and Brugmansia. I am Canadian but live winters in Florida A speaker at a Bromeliad meeting suggested and he said especially for Brugmansia to use tthis clay product Turface or Profile He brought in some fabulous plants growing in it. Looking for information and found this conversation Is anyone using it yet and what have you found as to its success...See MoreJoppaRich
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10 years agolast modified: 9 years agonil13
10 years agolast modified: 9 years agodrew51 SE MI Z5b/6a
10 years agolast modified: 9 years agodrew51 SE MI Z5b/6a
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tapla (mid-Michigan, USDA z5b-6a)