Though you state you have no grudge against those who didn't give you seeds, you then state "Remember, your list would be small if no generous people offered you seeds when you first started out." That is a very pointed remark which reads as an admonishment to those who wouldn't share their seeds with you.

There are a lot of people with many seeds who collected them from their own gardens, purchased them, or traded what they had to increase their inventory and did NOT rely on free seeds from others to get their lists started.

Well I only got free seeds from one person and Im going to buy them a plant in the spring and send it to them for the seeds she sent. I have traded seeds or other items like bags ,envelopes,etc,and alot were fine with that.Im not a moocher looking for free seeds.All im saying is there are some with hundreds of types seeds that wont trade unless you have what they want.They see you dont have alot to trade,so they dont want to trade.Nothing wrong with that at all,thats their choice.No way they grew all those seeds without trading for alot.I plan on sharing seeds from plants I grow with others to ANYONE that asks me for ones they would like.I was not being negative to ones that wouldnt trade with me,just reminding them they got alot from trades of others,and had no one traded or sent them seeds their lists wouldnt be as big.Seems you took the post the wrong way,but youre entitled to your own opinion,as I am.Im truly grateful to the people that traded with me ,thats all.

I never said you were a moocher, I just wanted to point out that there are a lot of us who built our trade lists by the effort and expense of growing plants, diligence and patience in collecting our seeds, and hours of cleaning, sorting, labeling and packaging them. We have invested years in our gardens (and hundreds or thousands of dollars on our plants) and tons of effort in the seeds we offer for trade. I don't think it's wrong for people to understand that and to know that we place value on our effort and time and if we choose to not give the seeds away or to trade for things we don't want, that is perfectly understandable, and I think it's unfair to be chastised for it.

By the way, I've made 8 trades this year and given away over 25 SASBEs, so I am not ungenerous or unfeeling towards those who have nothing I need at this time.

I wish you good luck in adding to your seed inventory, and I think it's great that you will trade/give away seeds to whomever asks. I only hope those recipients realize they are lucky, and not entitled, to receive your generosity.

Hi! I think that maybe the proper way to thank those who have traded with you would have been not to bring up those that didnt.:)I am new myself and have been turned down for trades or just not responded to,no biggie,never even thought about it twice.I am sure your intention is not to mooch your way into a nice trade list ,but understand that there are people that do.
There are many members that have what I call a 'dream list' and I dont even expect those people to trade with me,and alot of times I am surprised by those that do!Also understand that maybe some of the people that didnt want to trade with you may have limited amounts that they are holding on to for something they really want,I know I personaly do not have a ton of interesting seeds to offer on my list,but I have had many people give me generous amount of seed per pack,enough for myself and another trade.I hold on to the extra amounts to trade for other seeds I want.I do not list them, but,when I am interested in something someone has I look at their wants and see what I might have for an offer.It has worked beautifuly so far,and I find more of my trade offers are accepted.There are far more generous traders on GW than any other site and this fact is what has helped me keep up here.If it werent for the people that have shared with me and traded with me I would still be sitting here in a pile of Purple coneflowers and Shata daises.It is great that you intend on sharing with alot of people in the future and have all intentions on trading with anybody,but be prepared for the day some one wants to trade you a very commonly found plant for something not so easily found or wants you to trade off the last bit of something you are holding on to for a special trade for something you really werent looking for.Maybe you will have enough to send them a SASE at times and maybe sometimes, you will just have to say "no thank you",it is all a part of trading.Dont take it personal that some people had to turn down a trade with you,as you go along in this I think you may just start to understand where those people are coming from.I put in alot of offers really not expecting a response,but I give it a shot anyway,and then when one out of 5 responds and wants to trade I am thrilled because I didnt count on any of them getting back to me, therefore, there is no disappointment! You will find hat GW has the most wonderful members and just about everybody is willing to give a newbie a chance.If you already havent,try posting on some other sites and see the response you get compared to the ones you will get here.I dont want you to think anybody is ganging up on you,because that is not the case.And I only put my 2 sense in because I hope it helps you out in some way and maybe helps you understand fully where some people are coming from when they have to say no to a trade.Dont assume they are stingy because more than likely they arent,I seriously doubt anybody is sitting on a mountain of seeds they plan to be buried with,they just might not have them to share or are saving them for a trade that better suits them ,it has nothing to do with you or that persons character.Enough said by me and I really do wish you the best of luck in tradng and it is good to see that you feel comfortable enough here to state how you feel!~Angie

Consider this too please, if you will. Let's suppose you have nothing of interest to the other trader and they maybe have a 'lot' of something you were interested in. You really think they 'should' send them for postage anyway? You're assuming they should share, and take of their time and energy to get them to you...just because they have a lot and you have little? Lots of folks just do not have the time to wait for an sasbe to arrive, and then to package and get the 'free' seeds mailed out. Yet, when they do have the time, they will share those seeds either as bonuses, or for postage, or will mail them out in bulk to someone who can/will distribute them to newbies. Just because you have nothing of interest to another member, does in no way mean they are not or have not been generous.
Once you have been here for a while, you will maybe understand all this.

Many newbies start out with just a few seed varieties, either saved or purchased. They then reply to the many generous sasbe offers you will find on the Seed and Winter Sowing Exchange boards. They do 'not' expect others to trade with them when they have nothing of interest to the other member. I suggest you answer the many sasbe offers if you are really wanting to build your list, so you will have a better variety of things to trade.

Well I only got free seeds from one person
That certainly sounds like you were expecting more folks to give you free seeds.

Sue

I do understand what you mean about the time consuming efferts of others trading seeds ,or doing the sase thing.I forment and dry the seeds I have myself,and bag them,etc.You make good points as far as the generousity of many which I have been grateful to.I stated about the having only one person to send me free seeds,not because I wanted more free seeds,but to point out all but one, I had traded seeds and stuff back in return.You are making me look like im greedy and looking for free seeds which I am not.Yes Ive seen many here that their want lists are alot longer then their have lists or reply to many offers of sase.Again I did not intend to offend anyone that didnt trade with me ,just pointing out that without trades many of them wouldnt have as big as list as they do.I have always thanked the nice people that traded with me,realizing they took the time to go through their seeds and send seeds I was looking for. If you look on my want list it is far smaller then many,Im not looking for hundreds of varieties.I love this site,and if I offended anybody Im truly sorry.My intensions were to thank the generousity of many and to wish them nice holidays,that was all.I dont expect to have everyone send me seeds Id like.Thats their choice if they wish not to trade with me.But please dont assume Im greedy and expect them to,as Im not.

I'm so confused about what point you are trying to make here.

Again I did not intend to offend anyone that didnt trade with me ,just pointing out that without trades many of them wouldnt have as big as list as they do
So you are saying that without trading many folks would not have such long seed lists...right?
Yes, I imagine they did receive some in trade. I imagine a lot of them were bought, gathered here and there, traded for, received as bonuses, or possibly received for sasbe.
Many folks initially 'buy' a few seeds to be able to put up a humble trade list. They then proceed to trade, and answer sase 'offers'. With buying, gathering, and trading, they have acquired a lot of varieties. In a lot of instances it did not come easily or cheaply.
Again...,just pointing out that without trades many of them wouldnt have as big as list as they do
Do you feel that because they have big long lists, that they should trade with you for something they do not want/need?
Do you think that they should be willing to 'share' with you because chances are that in the past at some time, someone may have shared with them? Why do you have seem to have an attitude about someone who simply declines trading with you...just because they have a long list of seeds?

This will be my last response to this matter,as I dont need to.I do not have an attitude problem towards anyone.If anyone does, read your replies again towards me Chem.Your intitled to your opinion,but to go on and on about the same thing is to me very negative.Was thanking people that did trade with me and wishing everyone nice holidays wrong also? Do you have anything nice to say,or just like critizing others?

Hi,me again!:)Ok,lets see if we can put this to rest....
Let's start with a little bit of history here,the other two ladies that replied to this post have been around here along time and both have seen it all,so you must understand why you got the response you did.I can completely understand why both are very skeptical of what you had to say,I must admit when I first read this thread I thought to myself.."Boy is he mad at the people that didnt trade with him!" After I read your response,I was hoping that maybe you have the same problem as my DH,words come out wrong and he tends to add things to what he said that cause misunderstandings.
I would like to believe that you really didnt mean it the way it sounded,and by your persistance to clear this up I now belive you when you say that you didnt mean to offend anyone.Computers are not good at relaying emotions.
About the free seeds,there is nothing wrong with taking people up on their SASBE offers,as long as your intention is to stick around and participate in trading here.And also most important pay it foward when you have the opportunity.I would suggest that you do take people up on a few SASBE offers even if they arent offering things you grow.The seeds you get from those offers you can put on your list and trade for something you really want.I myself have a SASBE offer I just finished up.The seeds I offered were for those people to grow or build a list with.Should they build a list with them and trade them for things they really want to me is the same as if they grow them,either way they have something they want and I know I am not the only one that feels this way about SASE offers.So go ahead,get some SASE!:)
Alot of people here grow more han veggies so it could benefit you to have some flowers on your list,there is another member here that really only wants veggie seeds and he has some flowers on his list so he can please everyone he wants to trade with,he has done well here and people really like to trade with him.I have traded with him,if he didnt have the flowers on his list he would have had nothing I was interested in at this time and we probably would not have traded.And vice versa if he hadnt been looking for flowers at that particular time,I would have had nothing he was intersted in.Basically,it would be a good idea to build your list up with more selection in order to trade with more people.Because I bet that the people that looked at your list may have already had those veggies and if they had a choice of a flower they have been looking for would have taken you up on your trade offer.Give it a try and I bet you will be surprised in the results.I would suggest looking at want lists of potential trades also,it may save you from being disappointed. Want lists say it all about a person,you can do as I do and still give it a shot or let it go because it doesnt look likely they would want anything you have to offer.
As for yor comment about some want lists being longer than the haves list.When I first started I had 5 things on my want list and was told repeatedly I needed to put more on it.That is all apart of gardening,you dream of the ones you may someday have.Alot of traders like to see a want list,it helps them determine what they want to send you for bonuses and lets people know your general taste in flowers/veggies.From what I have seen and have been told there is nothing wrong with wanting more than you have on your list,most of it is wishful thinking,hence the term 'wish list'.I have a much longer wish list than I have to trade.And I dont believe I have ever offended anyone with this or have been looked at as greedy.It is ok to want just as long as you are willing to give when you CAN!:)
I think maybe you really misunderstand how people are here.This forum is filled with the nicest people I have ever met and I have had some great trades and received wonderful SASEs here.People here really support eachother and look out for eachother,so if you are looking for a nice place to trade your seeds this is it!But in the future I would suggest when you want to thank people leave it just as that,a thank you.There is no need to point out those who couldnt trade with you.When you did that it sounded like you harbor some ill feelings against people who couldnt trade with you at this time,even if you didnt mean it that way!I think it would be a great benefit to you to look at some trade lists and see how the majority does it around here.I think you will see that it is not about greed here,just a bunch of seed addicts getting their fix!:)And we just try to enable eachother in this addiction!:)You shouldnt look at wanting as something bad,as long as you know that you are willing to give as much as you want,there is no problem!Well I hope all my babbling may have helped you in some way and maybe if not you someone else.
Have a great Holiday! :)
~Angie

Hi,
I had several potential trades for something I wished for, but the person wouldn't trade because I had nothing they wanted. Later, both our lists changed, and we were able to trade at that time. I think anyone who saves seed knows what is involved (time, effort, etc.)

Initially, when I read barryblushes post, I had what I call a "thud". When someone writes or says something that lands with a "thud", or "goes over like a lead balloon", it is often an opportunity for misunderstandings.

I used to tutor, and I have seen hundreds--if not thousands--of students' papers. There have often been sentences included that would be better left out. If the information is pertinent, then the sentence would be rewritten. Often, it is difficult to make one's point clearly since it first requires clarity of thought, and then the ability to express that in orderly, cogent writing. This task is not the easiest thing to do.

Many people write quite well here, and many do not. I do not assume that is a reflection on them personally, they may be in a hurry, or in the middle of cooking dinner, and I, myself, have had many occasions where I see a post I made and said, "Ooh, I should have edited that first," because of spelling errors and such. Tone is often like spelling or grammatical errors: a reader can tell something is not right, but isn't sure what the person may have meant. That, for me, is a "thud" moment.

When I first read this post, I had the "thud", and so I went back and read it again. The second time, I said to myself that I thought maybe he didn't mean it the way it came off, so I then read the responses. Part of being polite is overlooking a faux pas, but part of being polite is also indoctrinating someone to the way "things are done" in order to minimize future slip-ups and misunderstandings. Manners are a social lubricant that have generally gone out of fashion, I'm afraid. On that note, I must say that people here are very well-mannered, well-meaning, and well-intentioned--not to mention generous.

My own take on barryblushes note is that his "subject" is a response to his first round of trading. Possibly his content should have been a thank-you as the title implied, or maybe the title should have read "To All My Attempted Trades," which would have covered the content present.

Who knows, maybe in addition to a refusal to trade, barryblushes received a reply with unintended tone, and felt a response to all he attempted to trade with was necessary.

Sometimes, people feel they just MUST say something. Plenty of times omitting a sentence here or there, or editing and rewriting is in order. If a person needs to address a point that may have an undertone, maybe it would be better to e-mail that person directly and individually. I believe the words grudge and remember... are the hot words here.

This, of course, is only my opinion based on my experience. My intentions for writing a response are to look at the writing and how it can convey things we don't intend, or just shouldn't say. Of course, here I am chiming in, but I believe--in this case--there are no real bad guys.

In a nutshell, think of the people that traded with you, barryblushes. If one is sending a thank-you card, it would not be polite to mention other people's behavior in the card.

Happy Thanksgiving to all!
Robin