Blast and humbug, I just realised that as I want an "inside/outside" garden, I need to show you how the "tree" looks from the stoop.

My son is standing in a slightly different positon--between the lawnchair shrubs instead of to the side, but it doesn't matter--as I'd flank the tree with shrubs (or not) in any case.

{{gwi:38430}}

I like it, actually.

The "pruning" of your neighbor's birch will mutilate and ruin the tree, and in addition, the place you want to put a tree is much too close to the beautiful tree you already have just a few feet away on your neighbor's property.

Why not a small tree on the other side?

I agree. You already have a nice tree there (your neighbor's -- nothing wrong with "borrowed" landscaping). If you need a tree anywhere its on the other side.

Hi,

If you're looking to balance your front yard, maybe you could consider a larger plant on the right side by the house. I recently saw a large, beautiful (huge, really) hosta at a client's house. A larger, outstanding plant would help 'weight' the right side.

-- as for the front walk, here's a thought. If you put grass between pavers, it might make it harder to shovel in the winter.

Best of luck with it -- very cute house!

I'd reserve plans for the neighbor's birch tree, and that side of the lawn, until something actually DOES happen to it.

I really do admire your tenacity in problem solving - and your son's willingness to stand holding a big umbrella on a sunny day - but my gut tells me to consider reconfiguring (tone down the white) the inverted "T" walkway - although I totally understand shorter direct routes in cold climates! But that does hit you right in the face. Prune down the spirea as discussed on other forums - it's a hardy plant with a much dismissed old fashioned charm. Across the front, some low growing, slow growing evergreen shrubs suitable for a northern exposure are all that's necessary. Alternatively, barberry or ninebark for color, berries, etc. Or paint the exposed foundation the color of the house to remove the sharp contrast. A large window box under the window, perhaps. Even disguising the small porch "peak" by painting the triangle to complement the brick side. The Home Decorating and Cottage Garden forums always want you to get a real "pop" by painting the front door, too. But I've always been happy with my darkest shade of blue before getting into black front doors.

The more I look at this, the more I see tweeks vs major needs. If you want shrubs on the right side by the birch, extend the bed that's already there to incorporate them - no point in having two smallish free standing islands. However, my thought would be to forego shrubs there at least until something disastrous happens to the birch.

The area of concentration with workable space is, obviously, the flagpole side. But, I must be missing something - in the picture, the mature tree at the back top left provides a balance to the birch. And the asymmetry of your house might have been worked up into a problem that isn't totally there.

Mmmm now I'm feeling a bit guilty for having started you out on this, if I did. I agree that you can't plant replacement stock right under existing stock precisely as Laceyvail points out. What you can do is plant a tree on the other side, if you want to, so that if/when the birch goes you have some coverage already although it won't be in the precise same place. If it happens sooner rather than later, you can even move a tree if it's young enough.

My feelings about this birch are also driven by having lived under a similarly-positioned neighbour's tree for a long time, until it was way past a rational size for a mutually beneficial relationship. I think the phrase "borrowed landscaping" is apt enough up to a point, but beyond that it is the neighbour who is borrowing your property to house and nourish her tree - I came to the point where I considered it a form of illegal squatting. Slavery, in fact, as I was literally servicing the tree, what with constant eaves cleaning and such. What I see here is a tree that is on the cusp of crossing the boundary from neighbourly to thuggish, but of course I can't see it in person nor reflect anyone else's feelings about it. However, the fact of the matter is that the beauty of the tree is not Scrap's responsibility; she has a right to the peaceful enjoyment of her property and the neighbour does not have a right to occupy Scrap's property so that her tree can look as nice as possible. That said, Scrap has said she enjoys the tree and she may continue to do so for another five years or more. And with all THAT said, I think I had originally said that a tree could go on the left as part of a new bed there.

I do think this speaks a bit to the issue of uses and limitations of internet forums, if you don't mind me musing on that for a moment to assauge my guilt about possibly leading you down a dead end here. No matter how good the photos or descriptions of both the site and the needs, there is no way on earth that any information coming over the internet can overrride your own judgement of what should happen on your site. We can't enter into all your decisions nor should we; a form can advise, but should never decide. The internet can provide myriad opinions, and some of them will be good, but they will always be less informed than your own, as you live in the space. There is also a level of decision-making that a forum can't/won't enter into, nor should it set priorities for you.

But for what it's worth, I like the idea of the straight but slanted pathway. I do think, however, that Duluth has a point in that the T is the most irritating thing and it doesn't go with that. Maybe if you at least virtually remove and replace the T, you may be better able to come to a decision.

KarinL

My neighbour will get someone who knows what he's doing to prune her tree. She asked me "how much" I wanted off, and I told her "whatever the pruner thought best and don't hurt the tree."

So we'll see what happens.

OK: so I take the point that I shouldn't usurp it, just yet. I suppose the roots would make it difficult for a new tree to establish itself there anyway.

duluthinbloomZ4--About shrubs and window boxes--I like that idea very much. I've been researching "container gardening." I'll have to see if the husband is willing to drill into the side of the house to hold them.
What did you mean by saying "Even disguising the small porch "peak" by painting the triangle to complement the brick side. "?
There is no "brick" side--so I'm not sure what you are referring to. It's all rough stucco.

KarinL--please don't feel badly. You weren't the only one to suggest the tree--someone else did too.

It seems the consensus is I need something on the right in order to create balance--Hmmm. I wonder if the boy is willing to stand with the umbrella again today?

Extending and using the wood beds I've already got isn't a bad idea. They are only 25" deep, however. I should probably widen (deepen) them, but then I was thinking of building a small (3-4" high) fence there, eventually.

Thank for all your kind words and suggestions. I don't think I've reached to limitations of the internet quite yet. No one can or will decide anything for me--that doesn't even happen in "real" life!

The right side is so shaded, and on my monitor I couldn't tell the exterior is all stucco - hence the brick error. Guess I missed the fact the house is stucco in the first place. Might take back the window box idea just for the integrity of the finish - wouldn't want holes or potting soils to splash or plant stains on it either.

Hi Scraplolly,
Personally I think it is merely the overexposed photo exaggerating the look of the 'T' at the curb. I doubt very much that it is irritating or hitting you right in the face when standing in front of the house. It's a nice sunny spot -- you could make the 'T' more cheery by planting more of your low fluffy flowering plants around it, but only if you enjoy the maintenance aspect.

Trying to plant anything in the shade of the tree is going to be very difficult. Maybe just put some plants in the flowerbed near your son that are a bit less transparent, more substantial (but not tall). I salute your son for being such a good sport to help you with the visuals. The photo is too small for me to see if he is grimacing or smiling...

Are you very limited by budget? There is a house in my neighborhood, very similar to yours, where they added an elevated exterior entry to very nice effect. I'll try to post a photo this evening.

I hope you'll stick around on the forum, you're enlivening the discussions here, and seem to be enjoying it.

Catkim--you mean plant something like get-creative's suggestion of a Hosta?

I have one, (maybe two) waiting for a spot, unearthed when we took out the Thuja bush.

I see I am going to have to make a decision about those wooden things at the front. You can't tell from the photo, but the one on the right doesn't go all the way across. It actually "stops" at about the middle of the window on the right side.

I would dearly love to rip them out and use the wood for something else.
Any reason why I shouldn't?

--except for the fact that they are BOLTED together, with huge bolts, inset into the wood. I just took a really good look at them. egads. I'll have to rip them to shreds to take them out. Don't know if I have the physical strength for that! Tenacity, I've got. Physical strength --even with a mallet and a crowbar-- is another story.

Thanks for the detailed description above. It does help, although I'm often uncertain about whether what I "see" in my head is anything like what people are talking about in a thread. I read your description several times and then have been noting the further comments, so I'm beginning to form a picture.

In my mind's eye, for what it's worth, I think your small tree should be on the flagpole side. I don't know what that does to the flagpole itself? When I planted my service berry--zone 4, I'm afraid, the tree I really wanted to find was a variety of Canadian plum, Prunus nigra Princess Kay', which is described as having very fragrant, nearly double blooms, black bark / upright form for nice winter interest, good yellows and oranges in fall. The first description I found was at that Northscaping website you've mentioned elsewhere. The few references over on the tree forum were all very favorable. The main problem? Not easy to find in commerceÂat least, not near me.

Oddly enough your garden reminds me of my own in a number of ways. We still have sections of wood edging with those bolts that my husband hasn't quite got around to removing. The tree situation in front was also among the first major decisions for our landscape. I also have a son who gets roped into various kinds of garden adventures. AndÂhostas were among the first plants I identified for myself.

I'm not sure where Get-Creative was going with the hosta, but I do think that hostas are a perennial to keep in mind. She may not, however, be thinking of the hosta you found in your garden. There are hostas and there are hostas. A friend of mine thinks that there are just two: "The green one" and "The green one with a white border". Hers are both in the rather small category. Don't get me wrong, these workhorse hostas can be useful, but they don't function in quite the same way as some of the behemoth specimens that can have a truly gorgeous presence. I mostly limit myself to fragrant hostas because the fragrance is wonderful and hummingbirds adore them. It's sort of the "jasmine of the North". The only thing is, come first frost and the hostas pretty much disintegrate until they emerge in spring.

I'd suggest checking out the hosta forum "for fun". You know, you need a break from all that digging. You're on the right track putting your attention and energy on the general layout and the trees, shrubs, and evergreens that will form the basis of your landscape.

Meanwhile, I'm feeling your pain as you dig out thugas and contemplate those wood beams.

Wellspring

Thank you well-spring. The tree you describe sounds wonderful.

Prunus suffers from Knotwood, doesn't it? We have a mayday tree (Prunus) that is succumbing. So, although I love it to pieces I'm not sure I want one again. (I don't know how I'm going to handle it's removal). Why I've decided to care about things that die and are mostly out of my control is beyond me.

By the by, the thuja stump is out, as of Sunday.
And the Hosta I thought I had wasn't a Hosta. They gave me a really hard time over at the Hosta forum for that. Oh well, live and learn. It is most likely a bergenia.

But I did learn something about a horrible disease infecting Hostas right now, so I'm not sure I want to plant any, though they are quite seductive.

As for a tree by the flagpole, I have no idea what the effect of it would be either. It sort of serves as a tree, really, albeit a really skinny one.

I am becoming more familiar with the size of my lot and what will fit on it, though. In truth, I want a mixed shrub border, in a loose "u" shape weaving in and out of a small fence (though the fence itself would be straight), flowers, foliage and grasses. I may not be able to have all that and good design, too!

For the gardeners who can see the picture, the "T" walkway at the front looks so awful, in part, because my camera lens was smudged. Sorry about that. If I'd been using my SLR it would have been immediately obvious to me, but with the digital, it isn't.

Thanks for your encouragment, Well-spring. You have a talent for that, I think.

Scrap, there is a thread here somewhere about patterns on the ground, that is patterns suggested by overhanging objects. I am reminded of this when I look at the second picture, the one with your son in a position I hope none of his school friends saw. On the ground there is a pattern provided by the sun and the trees: light and shadow, as you have gone into this gardening business not only at the deep end but also off the high diving board you may want to study this pattern. If your photo software allows convert the picture to B&W and the pattern will be even more obvious. You will know of course that this pattern will change within a day and within a year but it may offer some guidance.
Your 'hosta' is definitely a bergenia other wise known as pig squeak from the sound the leaves make when you rub them with thumb and forefinger.
I think you can legitimately reduce the size of the birch without killing it ask on the tree forum as there are some knowledgeable folks there who may provide you with the right questions to ask of the "pruner". bboy could advice you too if he is reading along.

Thanks Ink. I'll see if I can find it.

The birch belongs to my neighbour, though, so there's no point talking to me about how to prune it properly, though I wish it were otherwise.

As a reult of the responses to this post, I'm now strongly considering a low growing spreading conifer for that spot. I have a question posted at the conifer forum about it.

About the patterns of shade and light--they are quite intriguing, aren't they. Part of the problem with a mocked up photograph, like the one above, is that I don't know how to handle them. (As I think I mentioned, there are still two Thuja trees smack up against the house irl. They'll be coming down, eventually.)

Nevertheless, it isn't a mistake to be thinking about dark burgandy foliage, is it? Not only is it nice contrast, but I love shade, shadow and mystery.

Here is another suggestion. Instead of viewing and attempting to design your property in the full frontal mode take yourself over to the flag pole (is that a Norwegian flag?) and take some pictures from there. I think you will find that instead of a two dimensional house half covered by a tree you have something different. You could also look at it from the umbrella boy spot. If the walkway (known as a poison arrow in Feng Shui) instead curved round to the flag pole and you saw the birch as the back drop as you walked up it I think you might get out of the right side left side thing. Of course only you know if this is practical.

As I read this thread my mind keeps returning to last summer when I was walking down the main street of a southern town and heard my name called from across the street. Turned out to be a former client of about 40 years ago. She had wrangled with landscaping her property and was driving her friends nuts asking their opinions. It was suggested that she contact me for help. I quickly realized at our first meeting that she did not have the ability to understand 'spatial concepts'. This is not uncommon and probably is inherited as is artistic capability and musical 'perfect pitch'. I drew a plan for her and she just could not see how everything related. She kept insisting that I include three trees in the plan which I knew were a mistake. Finally I suggested another designer whom she might find better to work with and left her with my plan.

Her first words to me after all those years, "You were right. I was wrong." She then went on to tell me that the other designer followed her every whim and 20 years later she realized that it was all a mistake as the plantings matured. So, she dragged out my design, ripped everything out including her three trees and replanted following my design exactly. Once it was installed and growing she realized what I had been trying to make her understand 40 years ago.

Scraplolly, you do not need an additional tree on your small lot. What you do need is some professional advice to aid you in 'seeing' relationships and how to pull things together. Your needs are really very simple and a one hour consultation should set you on the right track. Do it.

Scraplolly--
I'm in Palo Alto at my sister's "new" house (1952 Eichler...it's gonna be great, but right now...oy. They boought from the estate of the original owners....) I've been reading in between bouts of nephew chasing. I'm not pro...but I agree with Nandina. It'll be the best chunk of change you'll spend. I'm currently trying to convince my BIL that rehabbing a 56 year-old landscape is beyond my scope. I have a couple of designers in mind...but I'm not certain if either works in the South Bay area. ;^) Bahia--my e-mail is in my profile! The other lass...I'll need to e-mail her.

melanie

I don't want to disagree about the value of hiring a designer, but I am not sure it is in Scrap's modus operandi nor in her budget.

My thought about all this planning is basically what my first response was on Scrap's first thread here: Scrap is trying to do the landscape planning with far too little plant and gardening knowledge to support the planning. I actually think she's got good conceptual understanding and she's said she's a "big picture person". The problem is that she hasn't got the plant knowledge to distinguish good ideas from bad ones nor big ideas from small ones. I think that will be an issue even if she hires someone as I'm going to bet that there aren't too many Ink/Nandina/Laags hanging around the northern town she's in. She may get bad advice, but how would she know?

For example, let's follow up on the burgundy foliage idea. Under the birch, in the shade, forget it. It won't go burgundy in most cases; very few plants with colour (gold or red) will hold it well in shade.

I feel strongly that what you need to do, Scrap, is to stop planning and start doing. Pick a spot on your property, any spot, and dig in and plant something. Watch it grow, well or badly. Try to figure out why. If badly, move it and see if it will do better. Kill some plants. Be overwhelmed with some weeds.

You said in an earlier thread that you don't think moving plants is so easy. when they're small, it is dead easy; no problem at all. I've moved most of mine at least once, usually more. You could even plant up that strange elongated box you've got at the front, and leave that until you have a better idea of what you want to do. Plant up your foundation, and see what happens. The thing in gardening is that you don't have to get everything right - plants are actually very adaptable. But they are also responsive to conditions and care, and there is a right way to get the best out of them.

For better or for worse, gardening is the foundation of landscaping, and if you are going to landscape, you have to understand something about gardening. And the best - or is it the only? - way to learn about gardening is to do it.

So I think that if you do want a comprehensive landscape plan now, then yes, you should hire someone. But I'm not sure that's what you do want. I think you want to dabble, learn, and work your way toward a completed landscape. And when you do that, you can only see a little way ahead of yourself at a time.

The one aspect of planning that is easy to grasp is that hardscape should be first. You've mentioned a fence a few times, you've said you hate the walkway... and you know what you want to take out and you're doing that. You're wondering about house paint and things. Each one of those decisions will impact the ones that are to be made later, so do the things you're sure of, and defer decisions where you have a lot of uncertainty until later. In the meantime, pick a patch of ground, go buy a couple of hostas or conifers, and plant them! Right now you're trying to plan way further ahead than you can actually see, but I don't think it's your spatial ability that's at fault but rather your gardening experience base. Build that up, and the confidence to plan further will come.

And Ink is also right not to do so much planning from out on the street but rather from being at various spots in the space.

KarinL

I'll bite.
Why?
What exactly can I expect?

This is a bit like the suggestion I received in my original thread--plant a tree, someone said.

I say, "where?"

I should have asked, "why."

duluthinbloomz4--it's been weighing on my mind--I didn't mean to sound curt when I mentioned the brick/stucco thing. This medium of communication leaves much to be desired at times.

Ink--I looked up that thread and read it. Our library has a copy of a book by a fellow named Brookes suggested on that thread, so I'll be checking that out. Oh--and it's a Canadian flag, of course.

KarinL--you've been a real trooper, catching my posts at various stops on this board. I appreciate it very much.

I am a Big Picture person, and I like to know as much as possible about something before I begin it. And I have been accused before of wanting to "do the Ph.D"

I do want to change the walkway, I do want a fence. These are expensive however, and not in the budget this year. (Though I'm going to do my best to track down second hand wood for fencing. I've seen three "stacks" of old fencing, newly removed, sitting in people's yards in the last three days, surely it doesn't ALL go to the dump?)

I need that one thing, the "inspiration" piece, as we say in interior decorating, that great fabric or couch shape or whatever which drives everything else. And once "everything else" is figured out, you go back in and tweak it. THEN you buy your furniture, your lamps, whatever.

A walkway (and path system could do it) a fence might, or a tree--but it turns out (for various reasons) these are non starters.

Anyway, KarinL has hit the proverbial nail: How would I know if the LD I spoke to did know what s/he was talking about? And can you imagine his/her response to me?

At any rate, for what it's worth, I've been doodling...(and taking notes):

{{gwi:38432}}

I think it's going to be too much trouble to try to get something to grow under that birch. Too dark, too many roots, too much weight on that side of the yard already. So I'd throw that out. But it's an important spot, what do you do with it? Put a bench there. Make that the place in your yard from which everything radiates. Right now all the plans you have proposed are symmetrical about your front door. But your house's character comes from it's asymmetry. I think your axis of symmetry should be about a line that goes from a bench beneath the birch to the spirea and have the curves of your beds loosely follow arcs from the endpoints of that line. Then the pathways are rays that cross the arcs. What if the arc coming off of your house was mimicked with a curved arc near the corner of your lot and that arc was actually your fence (not a full length fence, just a curved piece of a fence that gave you a bit of privacy from the street corner.

Just some ideas to break you out of your rectangles.

Lisa

I promised you a photo of a house similar to yours with an added elevated entry. Simple house, simple improvement -- well, I'm not so sure this is any help at all, but here's the photo...

{{gwi:38433}}

Oh, catkim, isn't that lovely! (I like the haziness in the photo, too!)

Those flowers truly make it spectacular.

I'm so glad you didn't forget to post it! As a result of your comment, I said to my husband, "It sure would be nice to sit on something out here (meaning the front) and watch the rain, wouldn't it?" and he said, "We'd have to figure out a way to...." which nearly knocked my socks off--I hadn't thought that a porch would ever be possible. But he built a front deck for my mom last year, so he's gaining confidence!

lschibley--did you mean something like this?
{{gwi:38434}}

I'm not sure what you meant by "rays"--I checked a few math sites and so on, but I'm not sure that it matters, too much?

But telling me that my house gets its charm from its asymetery--well, that matters! No one has ever said that to me before, and it gives me fresh eyes--so thanks, for that.

In my first formulations of a plan for the yard, I had planned to put a birdbath over in the spot where you suggested a bench (though totally enclosed by shrubs which my recent reading in the shrubs forum is telling me will be difficult).

and Ink--I took a picture from the side, as you suggested. This is what there is to see:
{{gwi:38435}}
(That small tree to left is my neighbour's cherry tree and those are her raised beds, too. Our houses have the same set-back)

That's sort of what I was thinking about. But first off, angle the bench so it faces the line, at an angle to the house. Then I was thinking of curves that were a bit bigger. What would it look like if you were to take a string tied to a stick pin at the bench and created a curve starting at the corner of the house. Could that curve define the back of a planting bed on the left side of the house? Anyway, I just wanted you to think about curves and get you away from symmetry around your door. Everyone says garden beds should be curved, but I really think randomly placed and curved beds look a little arbitrary and defeat the purpose of the curves of the bed. All I am trying to do is give you a reason for a curve that doesn't try to force your house into symmetry. Anyway, I still like the idea of a bench under that tree, especially after seeing a picture of that spot. A big ol' tree like that just invites a stop and sit.

Lisa

Isn't that stepping stone pathway inconsistent with what you've told us about your needs (shovelling, rushing) as well as unwise for your climate (frost heave?)?

KarinL

{{gwi:38436}}
I think there is a resemblance to this house as well scrap, notice the subtle use of colour.

Ink--I don't want to presume--but are you making a joke? --cos it sorta does look like my house!

A joke? I just thought it would add another dimension to the discussion i.e. "is this where I should plant my house?" or "please help, blank slate."

That's just silly, Ink, though as usual with a good point at the core of it.

Scrap, I think you did start off with a question that sent the conversation in some rather scattered directions. I think it is a natural error given what you are doing, which is to try to practice landscape design at an advanced level without having taken the introductory course. I sympathize, I do it all the time myself - end up specializing in "learning the hard way." I got a real kick out of your self-description of "wanting to do the PhD." Believe me, I relate.

If you were to consult a landscape designer, s/he would start off interviewing you about your needs and aspirations for the site and would design according to those identified priorities. What I think is happening here is that, having perhaps not clearly articulated or listed those priorities because you think you know them, you are being distracted from them by one or more of common practice, alluring ideas, or other people's input. These things have led you down paths that move away from, rather than toward, realizing your preferences. I first heard this process described as being seduced by features you don't need when shopping for software, years ago when the department I worked for was shopping for its first every computer program. Same idea here.

For example, somewhere, perhaps in your blog, you spoke with some clarity about a fence for the left side, where it should go and why. Yet in discussions here you have zeroed in mercilessly on the right side, where there is literally no point in doing anything because of your neighbour's tree, I think in response to some comments made. Another example is what I tried to point out three posts up.

Why don't you make your priority list as if you were going to consult someone. What would you tell them was important, and what you needed the fastest? What is bugging you the most? I encouraged you to look at the walkway as you said you hate it, but if it currently meets your basic needs while other needs go entirely unmet, then that is wrong too.

If you consult someone, they would be able to think all the way through the process from your most immediate needs to a final plan. Without experience, I don't think you can. Frankly, in my yard I can't either. I deal with what needs doing at the moment, and while I think three or four steps ahead, I focus mostly on leaving as many options as possible open for the next few decisions I have to make. I often find myself doing something completely unexpected but serendipitous. If I were to put my plans on paper, they would always incorporate a few areas deliberately grayed, labelled "see how this looks when I get there."

Perhaps the right first thing is to build your fence. Or even just to set your fence posts. You can figure out the precise style of pickets or panels later once you see the posts installed. You can figure out the plantings later, once you see what it's like with the fence in place. Will you feel enclosed enough, or too much already, with just a fence? You won't know till you get there. Make the decision then.

The fence issue seems like a logical place to start. Why not tell us about your fencing needs? Perhaps someone can help you flesh those out. But this time, don't begin by telling us what you have decided so that the discussion has to tear that down in order to get to new territory, and then has no direction once it gets there. Tell us first what you needs are, why you are thinking of a fence, and what purposes it needs to serve.

It is the process of articulating those items that generates good ideas. You may not even need any input once you have made all that clear to yourself.

KarinL

Okay... don't leave us in suspense, where is the Tree (or very tall shrub...) to be planted?

As far as the "left v. right" considerations, please keep in mind that symetry is just a sub-set of balance.

Oh, so kind of you to ask!

I'm up to my eyeballs in John Brookes and grids and drift planting and native species, etc, etc, and strongly considering taking Ink and KarinL's advice to just post "Blank slate, need help" and see what happens.

I can't even decide if I want another tree!

PS--I cheated, this picture shows all the current front plantings removed--I do actually have one left standing--and after having torn out a Thuja bush in early July and a topped deformed Thuja tree this weekend, I'm feeling quite sentimental about the remaining Thuja.

If you are curious about the true state of affairs, there's a link to my blog below.

Am I the guilty "someone else" who first suggested a tree (or shrub) on the right side? If I confused you further, please accept my apologies...
The spot marked with the umbrella could be a place for a small tree/large shrub IF your neighbor's birch really does get removed, but now, I guess you'd better wait - see how the picture changes after the front walk is redone, and thujas gone. Were you going to paint the house as well? Making it lighter or darker can change the "big picture" quite a lot.

Doesn't matter, timbu!

I have been motivated to learn an awful lot in a very short period of time...it's all good.

About painting--don't know. It's stucco and repairs aren't that difficult to make--to cracks and such--everything just sort of blends in nicely given the surface reflects light unevenly, anyway. It's rough stucco, too--not smooth as you would find in "Spanish" type stucco work--I think there's bits of glass in it, even. We've discussed painting it off and on...I need to find out more about it.

Enhance the good and mitigate the bad - rule #1.

There is an initial idea that the birch is, let's ay, not working out for you. I'm wondering how looking at a half birch with something stuffed next to it could possibly be a better alternative. Even if you have the part over your property removed, you still will have the remainder in your extended landscape. That can't be good for either of you or the neighbors, or the rest of the community that will see it.

Can you pretend that there is nothing you can do about the birch and decide how to make the best of the situation? Work with it because any alternative short of removing the entire tree is much harder to overcome than the encroaching tree, don't you think?

There is nothing I can do about the Birch.

I'm wondering how looking at a half birch with something stuffed next to it could possibly be a better alternative.

That's quite the picture!

And I actually like the tree. I don't want 1/2 of it lopped off--just a few straggling bits--it's actually starting to encroach over my front walk.

Can I just say that with what I've learned as a result of this thread and the reading it has sparked--this is sort of embarrassing to me now?

You can say it, but don't dwell on it! The whole point of reading, the forums as well as books, magazines, other I-net, and wandering around in your yard, and digging holes and planting things--is to get eddi-cated about all this stuff and hopefully have some fun doing it. It's a process!

I've had so many duh! moments and epiphanies, and most at my own expense, and I aren't near done yet with being amazed by how much I don't know.

Thanks, frankie!

I am having a blast. But then I always love designing things.