World's oldest tree? Kinda doubt it, but maybe worth posting

bengz6westmd

last year

Not sure carbon dating can be reliable enough.

https://www.beautyofplanet.com/9500-year-old-tree-found-in-sweden-is-the-worlds-oldest-tree-4/

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Embothrium

last year

last modified: last year

Mackenthun (2016) critically examined Kullman and Öberg's analyses and found (a) no evidence of genetic continuity between dead wood remains discovered beneath the allegedly 9550-year-old tree and the living tree itself, and (b) no evidence of a clonal origin of the tree. The problems of finding clones of great age and inferring their continuity are substantial. When we look at arctic treelines around the world, we find that they sometimes experience primarily clonal reproduction (where the treeline species are capable of it), and sometimes sexual reproduction. The null hypothesis would be that sexual reproduction is episodic over time, occurring during climatic warm intervals that favor complete cone and seed development, with reversions to clonal reproduction during less favorable periods. Therefore, absent evidence to the contrary, the Swedish trees do not represent a 9,000-year-old clone, and the oldest clonal age in this species remains unknown.

Picea abies (Norway spruce) description (conifers.org)

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Comments (9)

ken_adrian Adrian MI cold Z5
last year
so sad he named this magnificent specimen after his dog.. really dude.. how about some norse or swedish god or some such .

i presume some translation issues.. but wouldnt one expect that during the ice age.. being so far north..... the whole place would have been under ice.. and the height of the north sea immaterial since one would think it would have been covered by ice???

thanks for the reference...

here is the link to the top scientific journal on the web ... lol: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Old_Tjikko

and is it really a Norwegian spruce as the original article says.. being in sweden ...

ken
gardengal48 (PNW Z8/9)
last year
It is the root system, not the tree itself, that is reputed to be 9500 years old. The tree itself is relatively young......only around 600 years, if that. When the upper woody portion gets old and dies, the root system pushes out another replacement.

The Methuselah bristlecone pine in California is still reported to be the oldest non-clonal tree in the world at 4,854 years
bengz6westmd thanked gardengal48 (PNW Z8/9)
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bengz6westmd
Original Author
last year
last modified: last year
Hmm GG, that's plausible then. The cold soil (frozen much of the time) would perhaps aid in preserving the root system.
BillMN-z-2-3-4
last year
I thought the tree looked a bit on the small side even though seasonal growth looked to be at least a couple inches. That would've made the smaller tree on the left in the last picture about 1300 yo lol. Maybe that one is coming from the same roots, along with all those low shrubby ones around the main tree.
bengz6westmd thanked BillMN-z-2-3-4
arbordave (SE MI)
last year
I'm assuming that a Norway spruce could only propagate itself by layering (living branches coming in contact with the soil) rather than by sprouting from the root system (as in the case of an aspen clone).

Per this USDA Forest Service webpage, "Under natural conditions, particularly in areas of high humidity and high soil moisture, Norway spruce reproduces by layering. It does not sprout from stumps or roots"
bengz6westmd thanked arbordave (SE MI)
Ontario_Canada5a_USDA4b
last year
These old trees certainly give those conifer gardeners who are concerned about the longevity of their plantings, peace of mind :-)
bengz6westmd thanked Ontario_Canada5a_USDA4b
BillMN-z-2-3-4
last year
last modified: last year
I think it's just amazing that any tree will grow at all out there in the open, with poor rocky soil and extreme cold temperatures and wind. According to some sources it's growing 100+ meters above the tree line.

https://sciencenorway.no/dna-forests-trees/worlds-oldest-tree-still-growing-near-the-norwegian-swedish-border/2037756#:~:text=Joined%20the%20land%20uplift%20after%20the%20ice%20age&text=The%20reason%20why%20Old%20Tjikko,that%20followed%20the%20ice%20age.
bengz6westmd thanked BillMN-z-2-3-4
Palms And Pines
last year
If clonal trees are considered then the title of oldest tree goes to this clonal colony of quaking aspen.

https://thetreeographer.com/2017/11/22/pando-aspen/

World's oldest tree? Kinda doubt it, but maybe worth posting

Embothrium

Comments (9)

ken_adrian Adrian MI cold Z5

gardengal48 (PNW Z8/9)

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World's oldest tree? Kinda doubt it, but maybe worth posting

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