ADU/MIL Rough Floorplan Ideas
First time posting on Houzz, and first-time homebuyer!
It's a 1970 fixer log cabin in rural Washington state, and we are using a renovation loan to help get it in shape. This post is about an attached 30x30 'Bonus Room' area of about 900-ish sq ft. We may detach it, to make an ADU, if the permits allow. We intend to use it for my elderly mother-in-law, and then later, another older relative.
We have hired a consultant to help with building requirements and permits, a general contractor, with electrician, plumber, roofer, etc. ready to go. We will also apparently, have an architect assigned to us at some point, but haven't met with him yet.
The area shares an electrical panel, water heater, forced air, and septic system with the main house, and has rough plumbing for a bath and kitchenette. It also shares a metal roof and is currently connected by a badly executed hallway. We may or may not keep it connected, an outdoor breezeway might take its place. The red wall in the photos is the original back door of the main log house.
It has 12 windows and four doors! (I deleted a back door and window) In addition, there 5 large skylights, all of which have to go because of leakage. The windows are all the same 46x46, but the intervals between them are all different.
Exterior will have full shed roof, new patio, and new french doors. Parcel is wooded acreage with river and incline on left and driveway on right.
The first sketch is my tentative layout idea, second sketch is how it's currently set up. Composite pics of interior, and drone shot to see placement.
Please ignore the VERY TRASHY shape the house is in! OBVIOUSLY, important repairs come first. (roof, framing, sheeting, insulation, flooring, sheetrock, plumbing, electrical) All underway, I promise.
QUESTION!
We need some rough floorplan ideas to show the architect what we want. I would really like a few options to compare before then!
PROBLEMS!
- Soo many windows! Aesthetically, is there enough room for interior walls between them?
- Mother requests two bedrooms if possible, one quite large, and wants them on the non-driveway side
- Original kitchen sink placement is awkward, if we put kitchenette there, bathroom access would be thru kitchen, yuck! I think moving sink plumbing is best. Or should we move bathroom plumbing?
- Woodstove is also awkward, too far from living area, but can't move it
- Front door is huge, but useful for large furniture
- Should I consider wheelchair/walker dimensions?
What do we think about this floorplan? Anyone have an alternate idea?
Comments (23)
- 2 years agolast modified: 2 years ago
@dan1888 Not sure if this is what you meant...
The MB is 15x22 which might be excessive.
The next size down (around windows) would make it 15x17.
Related Discussions
Help! Please critique our kitchen floor plan!
Comments (44)As I wrote above, I had to guess about clearances because you didn't provide enough measurements for me to know for sure. I assumed that if I were to draw a straight line from the front edge of the sink wall counter run straight across the kitchen table area, it would run into the great room column (assuming that's what those big square things are), which is 92" from the far right nook wall. To that I added 48", which is the aisle width I recommended in my Plan A to get a total of 140" for table and chairs. If you do a 36" aisle between the right wall and the narrow end of a 42 x 60" oval table with the table turned so it's 60" side to side (not top to bottom), you should have 44" between table and island. You actually might have more than that if the table and island are diagonally across from each other as they appear to be on my drawing (didn't know if the drawing was to scale). However, I didn't have enough information to do the math for that dimension. I missed the part where you shared that your great room is a step down from the kitchen area. For this reason, I'm recommending a 42" x 60" table instead of a 48" round table with a 12" leaf. That will give you slightly wider aisles at the top and bottom sides of the table, which will give a little bit more safety buffer by the step down, which would be good thing for all ages (my MIL stepped off a curb the wrong way and broke her foot!). IMO, extending the island edge to be even with the counter edge of the upper butler's pantry will look quite nice. I don't think it's a problem that it extends past the right wall. In fact, I like that it brings the island seating closer to the table and great room areas instead of having them smack in the middle of the working part of the kitchen. I'm not sure what you mean by "blocky," sorry. Do you mean bulky? Well, it will be a large island but the whole space is large as is the pantry and range so I think it's all in scale. I hope I made sense and that I helped you through this process. Oh, you asked ages ago about removing the wall around the lower butler's pantry area. If you do corbels on the upper butler's pantry, I think it would look very nice if you removed the wall around the lower butler's pantry and added corbels to that cab as well....See MoreLooking for feedback on this floor plan...
Comments (12)I think you're asking too much of this small space. The house is 1200 sf ... with the addition, it'll be -- what? -- 1400ish? 3-4 bedrooms and 2-3 baths just don't fit into that space. To put this into perspective, my first house was a simple ranch in that same size range. We had 3 bedrooms (master was full with a queen bed and large dresser, our two kids had twin beds and plenty of play space in their rooms), 2 minimal bathrooms with no storage, a good sized living and dining room and a small kitchen. It was small but functional. You're trying to add another bedroom and another bath PLUS a mention of second living space, etc. ... AND have space for a wheelchair. Can't happen. Unless your addition is going to essentially double the space, it just can't happen. My best thoughts: - Focus on your bathroom space. Since your dad's wheelchair bound, you MUST allow him space to maneuver, and I often hear on this board that means a 5' radius. I'd ditch the tubs completely and go with walk-in showers; no barrier, roll-in type. Realistically, his shower will be huge. And your bathroom needs space for dad PLUS a caregiver. What storage do you need in the bathroom? I suspect he has a moveable shower chair? Do you need to store any type of lift for him? Do you store medications in the bathroom? - With space at a premium, do you necessarily need two FULL bathrooms? Could you go with a jack-and-jill ... something that'd place a LARGE shower in a room ... then two half-baths on opposite sides? Yes, it'd be better to have two full baths, but realistically, this might be a compromise that'd work. - Since Dad (and Mom?) will live in this house all the time, and they'll have their own rooms, I'd consider twin beds in SMALL bedrooms. I'd consider placing their beds up against a wall to allow maximum floor space in the room. I'd think this would be especially useful for Dad since he needs the floor space for the wheelchair. - How much "stuff" do Mom and Dad have to store? I'm thinking of my grandmother, who absolutely was never going to use all the cooking gear or her plentiful collection of evening gowns again, but who COULD NOT let go of them. - You say they'll have live-in caregivers, and they'll need space. I'm assuming these caregivers will also have other homes elsewhere? So they will need sleeping space but probably not a whole lot of storage space? I'd try to give the caregivers a queen sized bed and a small closet. And I'd try for a seating area in the caregivers' bedroom -- a loveseat and a TV perhaps? -- it's not a secondary living space, but it's what I think a house this size can support. - Will the caregivers have children in the house? If so, could you plan more of a bunk room for them? And/or for visiting grandchildren? I'm wondering if you could do a bunk "up" and a seating area, desk, or play space "down" for the kids? Again, this'd give them a space apart from the family, but it would allow it to be in a small space. - I suggest plenty of insulation between bedroom walls. If your parents are typical, they'll start playing the TV louder and louder and louder. That type of thing wears on people's nerves and makes them "snippy". Avoid it with a bit of insulation. - With family coming and going, you probably need a good-sized eating area. And if your family's like mine, people want to sit at the table and talk to the cook. I'd encourage you to think about placing the dining table at the far end of the house (so it's a quiet, restful space, not a spot that doubles as a walkway) and scoot it up against the wall using a banquette. This takes so much less space. And you can leave an empty spot at the end for Dad's wheelchair to scoot up to the table. Since Dad will probably sit at the table for long periods of time, I'd try to place this in a spot with good views. - With family coming and going, think through your parking. Again, this is the kind of thing that wears on people: Plan it so that you won't always be running out to move your car so your brother can get his out of the drive. - Leave an empty space in the living room for Dad's wheelchair. If the whole room is full of furniture, he will have no place to sit....See MoreLook for suggestions of floor plan for new 2b1b addition
Comments (33)Oops, I mixed up bedroom #1 and #2 above. They are correct in this post. This paragraph refers to bedroom #1 in the northeast corner of the home. Yep, put the closet on the east wall. Having a long closet is a bonus..... However, if it's too long (I really don't think it will be), halve it and use the rest of the back wall as a niche for the head of a twin bed or a study desk. If you have a niche, I'd put it nearest the window, in the northeast. See if you can do the same thing with the large bedroom (#2): put the closet on the opposite wall from the entrance. That way, there's no dead space when you step in the door. This one is harder because of the way it's shaped right now. You need way more closet space than you have right now, IMO. In fact, if you put the W/D in the bathroom, you can offer the space allocated to "laundry" as a nice big storage space, for stuff, bicycles, a kayak, electric bicycle, camping equipment.... This would be very valuable to a renter in an urban area. Next possibility....Would you consider having the two bedrooms on the south side and the kitchen/living room on the north? I know it's not your preference, but it would put the bedrooms near the bathroom. I really don't see any good alternative to putting that bathroom in the southwest corner. Too bad the available space is not just a bit bigger, so there'd be more possibilities. Is your local code for a bedroom 70 square feet (with a minimum wall of 7') plus a closet? Or? It's important to know this exactly. Minimize Bedroom #1 IMO even if it's just a few inches smaller than right now. You'll need those few inches either in kitchen cabinets or inside the front entrance to make a drop spot, hooks for jackets on the wall, etc. You don't really have room in the cabinets for a dishwasher right now: every inch in a small home really matters. Hope this helps......See MoreFloorplan advice on kitchen and house remodel
Comments (25)course411, that's great. By the way, what application are you using to generate the drawings and images? The open staircase is really a statement, that's the kind of thing that would make certain buyers swoon. For functionality I think the U version of the staircase from six hours ago is my favorite, but the straight one is more dramatic. And it could add a large pool of light with a skylight of some kind at the top....the few extra thousand for that would pay off if I was going to sell. I think if I were designing from scratch I'd keep the bedroom connection, but I wouldn't make it a priority here. As the kids get older, more separation is better. For fun, you might be interested to see some of the remodel flips around here that took modest houses here and landed large results. Search for 775 Pico in the town of San Mateo. I do not know who lives there. You could just look at all sales in this town over 2.5. Not that we're gonna sell anytime soon...the long term plan probably will be driven by where our kids are as adults. So we will definitely be here 15 more years minimum....See MoreRelated Professionals
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2 years agoThis rough sketch has the bathroom near the master and the kitchen in the bump out area stacked behind the dining and living room.
melissaroantreelove thanked Susan- 2 years agolast modified: 2 years ago
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I found the bathroom layout…it was offered up as an option on a Houzz thread. Yes, my rough sketch was just trying to see if the measurements/layout could work. Love the inspiration photo for a breezeway…the range could go on the left wall in kitchen if you wanted a doorway to the breezeway. Smaller appliances would provide more counter space. Just noticed I drew the bedroom door hinge on the wrong side…door should open on long wall.
melissaroantreelove thanked Susan - 2 years agolast modified: 2 years ago
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PRO2 years agolast modified: 2 years agoyou could do a curbless shower regardless, it just makes it easy to transition if someone needs a walker down the road. there is no curb to step over
this one has the pulldown seat
or you could just get a teak bench
melissaroantreelove thanked Beth H. :- 2 years agolast modified: 2 years ago
Such great questions!
Glad to get you thinking!
Yes, breezeway is becoming a mustI do think it's the best way to connect to the main house. As such, you really need to keep the area that's now the bathroom "open" to the breezeway ... otherwise, what's the point?
The land is flat towards the gardens
So you could have doors /patios on any side.
The back door questions are also tricky, because she is showing signs of dementia
That's scary. Is it possible to wire a doorbell into your house so that when she opens the door, you know?
She suffers from kidney failure along with the possible mental decline, and she's 81 now, so you are right, I guess a wheelchair is unlikely, I'm so silly...
Kidney failure is scary stuff ... how does that stack up against potential wheelchair use?
Yes, stove must stay
And it stays in place. Okay.
Yes, one bathroom is fine. I did ask if she wanted a bathtub, but she preferred a shower. Need to add a seat...built in maybe?
Practical.
-Her bedroom right now has an old fashioned 'double' bed, a large armoire, two 'highboy' dressers, a loveseat, a blanket chest and a vanity table. Whew! Mostly, I think she likes to have her clothes and accoutrements around her, so that's her reason for a large room.I get it. She's spent a lifetime accumulating these items, and she doesn't want to get rid of them.
-She has a ton of furniture, mostly antiques, which she firmly believes to be valuable and would not give up, there are multiple pieces to perform each function, so we can work around each room's measurements. We do have plenty of storage in the outbuildings, so we plan to just rotate things as wanted.
Yeah, some things are valuable antiques, but a whole lot more is just old. If she can't use everything she has, it makes perfect sense to store it rather than push her to get rid of things.
As for the second room, an overnight guest is very unlikely, but if it happens, it would be a single adult. No little ones!
So there goes the bunk room ... but I don't get the need for a second bedroom if no one will spend the night. What's the rationale?
-No crafts or other storage needs, just a few decorative collections, like figurines.So you probably want space for a glass cabinet or shelves. Could any of this go into the plethora of bedroom furniture?
Whatever empty wall we end up with, I plan to do a photo gallery with all her old sepia photographs.
If memory issue are a reality, this is a good idea.
-Kitchen-wise, she has many dish sets and serving items to store, but has no culinary inclinations. A simple space will be best. Meals will be just as you said, she'll prepare breakfast and lunch, and I cook in the evenings.
Could she be convinced to downsize to one set of dishes? It's just realistic.
Good lighting, level transitions between areas (no throw rugs-known trip and fall hazard)
Yes, pay attention to lighting.
And try to keep the floor one consistent material. As my grandmother neared 100, her #1 problem was changes in flooring. I can't tell you how many times the transition from linoleum in the kitchen to carpet in the family room threw her to the ground.
My mother lives in an apartment on the side of my brother's house; it's 27 x 27, so a touch smaller than your proposed project. I'm sharing her floorplan -- not because I think you could copy it -- but as an example of what's possible. Sorry the resolution isn't so great. I sketched it up on the computer.
What works about this plan:
- Note we have an exterior door on the left ... this opens onto a small stoop, and my mom has parking right outside.
- We also have an exterior door on the right ... this opens into the breezeway, which leads to the main house. I don't think any of the plans for your project are paying enough attention to the breezeway door, but a connection to the main house is essential.
- Good-sized bedroom with two closets ... they actually have sliding doors, but my house program doesn't have sliding doors.
- BTW, that's a queen-sized bed. At one point my sister and I shared this bedroom, and we had two twins ... along with that large dresser on the left-side wall.
- The bathroom opens off the bedroom BUT is also available to guests ... without cutting through the bedroom. In reality, the bathroom is more spacious than it appears here ... I'm not IN the house to measure, and I sketched it from memory. Looking at it again, I'm sure the kitchen comes down a little lower /cuts into the dining area, which I've drawn a little larger than it really is ... that's where I messed up the bathroom space.
- The washer/dryer is very close to the bedroom, and that linen tower next to the washer/dryer holds more than you'd believe.
- We have cabinets above the washer/dryer ... so no windows by the bathroom sink. I've always disliked that this space is dark.
- The cabinet next to the toilet used to be a tiny sink ... but it always leaked, and my mom had it removed. Now it's just a little cabinet for setting down clothes while she's in the shower. And she stores cleaning products underneath. It was an unnecessary sink, and no one misses it.
- The kitchen is pretty small -- if I could add space anywhere, I'd put it in the kitchen. In real life, the kitchen has another cabinet next to the dishwasher, but I couldn't make it fit in my drawing.
- The huge fireplace in the living room is a space-hog, and we don't have a good spot for a TV. My grandmother, who drew up this plan /built this apartment probably never even considered a TV.
- I didn't put it in, but my mom has a large, low dresser on the left-side wall next to the exterior door. It gives her a lot of storage, and it serves as a set-down spot for purses, etc.
I hope this gives you some ideas. It's a small apartment that's been serving our family in various ways since the 1970s. My mom's enjoying living in the apartment; she says she can clean the whole place in an hour, and her utility bills are next to nothing.
- 2 years ago
- 2 years agolast modified: 2 years ago
Mrs Pete