It is that transfer with the parchment paper that deflated it. With my recipe, I take the risen dough and plop it into a red hot pre-heated, covered, 3 quart casserole dish at 425°. It goes right back in that oven with it's hot cover on an is only uncovered for the last 10 minutes. It will rise some more and brown on the bottom before the lid is removed. The top dries and brown in the last 10 minutes.

I don't have any problems making good bread, and the only time I've had one of those peasant breads come out well was by accident when I was rescuing a different bread that went wrong.

Did you try my sourdough recipe? It should be fool proof.

Would you like my easy bread recipe?

The main thing if you're going to make bread is consistency. Everybody's ingredients and ovens are different. If you stick to one recipe, and adjust it until it's just what you like, then save that, and always use the same ingredients, you'll have a good bread whenever you want it.

I usually have to adapt new recipes I try because they rarely make up well first time.

Still, any recipe that's refined (no bran) wheat flour, water, yeast, salt, where the proportion of water is low enough to make a dough ball that can be handled, that you knead for a good ten minutes until you have a well stretched glutenous lump, let rise to double (not more), punch down, shape, rise to double again, and bake to an internal temperature of 195-210° F, is bread. Details--use 450-475 g flour, 11g or a teaspoon of salt, and 2 tsp ADY for a fast rise, or one tsp ADY for a slower rise, plus a 1-1.5 cup water to make it tacky but still solid enough to work. More water will give you a softer, damper, lacier crumb. Less will give you a closer, drier crumb. A damper oven will give you a harder, crunchier crust. All these are nuance. Anyway you make it, you'll have bread.

Our clan has been baking No Knead Bread and enjoying it. In fact, I have one loaf finishing its first rise right now. It seems that it is a no fail recipe and turns out no matter very nicely with all our learning. My brother sent me the recipe, and it turns out my sons have made it over the years too:

Jim Lahey's No Knead Bread

3 c all purpose flour

1/4 tsp instant yeast (I use Fleishman's Rapid Rise)

1 1/4 tsp salt

1 1/3 c water

Mix dry ingredients in large bowl. Then stir in the water till all the flour is evenly wet, cover the bowl, and let it rise till double in bulk for 12-18 hours on the kitchen counter, out of the sun. Turn it out on a well floured board. It will be sticky. With well floured hands, gingerly fold the edges of the blob over to the center of the dough and push it down so that the edge stays put. Think of the blob as a square, and fold each "side" into the center of the blob once. At this point, I usually turn the dough upside down and tuck and turn the dough trying to form a nice skin across the top of the dough. Then I flour the top of the dough so that I can cover it with Saran Wrap and it won't stick. Let the dough rise for 2 hours. 30 minutes before the dough is ready for the oven, preheat your oven to 450 and place the oven racks in the lower part of the oven. At the same time, also preheat the covered pot you will use to bake the bread. I use an old Revereware soup pot that is 8 inches across. When the oven and pot have preheated 30 minutes, drop the dough into the ungreased pot, put the lid on it, and return it to the oven. After 30 minutes, take the lid off and bake it for an additional 15 to 20 minutes. The recipe calls for flipping the dough into the pot so that what was the top of the risen loaf becomes the bottom of the baking loaf. That can get a little messy. Some bakers like to place the dough on sheets of crossed parchment paper and drop paper and all into the pot, not flipping it at all. I have had luck with slipping well floured hands under the risen loaf and flipping it in my hands to drop it into the pot. Sometimes it has hit the sides of the hot pan, but it bakes up nicely anyhow. Cool before slicing.

I've been making and making the bread, constantly trying to find the set of ingredients and a technique that will work for me. So far no luck in getting an excellent result. Edible yes, but excellent no. That's what I mean by it being difficult, which belies the moniker "peasant." I know many of you turn out excellent loaves time after time, but it still eludes me.

Maybe you're making your incremental changes too big?

For me, the successful high hydration, no knead bread happened when I was intending to make my normal ADY bread and was half asleep and something fouled the flour measure. My closest guess was that the scale wasn't zeroed on the bowl or something was touching on the base, which throws it off. I was using a different bowl and didn't notice until I poured the water in and just had water. :) So I added more flour until it had substance. I had no idea how much was in it, though, because it had soaked awhile. It didn't occur to me until after to weight the whole thing. :) I kept looking at it as it never became kneadable, so I poured it into a pot I've been baking regular bread in, and it rose and I baked it, and it made up the same volume of bread as the regular one, but was much softer with a very lacy crumb. This was with 2 tsp, ADY--no retard or slow rise--and a standard rise time and bake. I did use my Danish dough whisk to stir extra adding the flour, but it never got to the point of stretch and fold either. Maybe something like that would work for you? But I have to say, that was curry bread, so had lots of flavor. In general, there's not much favor in high hydration, cook in a pot bread, other than salt. Whole wheat has a lot more flavor.

Hydration is the key. When my bread which was rising in a romertopf dissolved into a puddle while I tried to transfer it in a parchment paper cradle to the dutch oven, I figured the hydration was too much. So for the extra rise, I added more flour. But then what, too much and there does my holes and crisp crust . . . I just can't find the sweet spot . . . I let my bread rise in the romertopf to give it shape, which has worked well, but it doesn't fit into a dutch oven so I had been transferring it gently to the dutch oven for the oven spring and crust. If I bake it in just the romertopf, I get an uneven shape and uneven browning, even after I take it out of the romertopf for the end of the bake time. If I put the top on the romertopf, then it inevitably rises too much and the top sticks to the bread. So yeah, onward or whatever, but I can't help wondering if the peasants had to fuss so much with something they made every week, week in and week out . . .

What brand and type of flour are you using lpink? Is it fresh?

The peasants weren't all great cooks and bakers. They made subsistence food. Those who did better taught those who didn't, parents taught offspring, etc., so generally most had decent food, but some didn't get the instruction. Your problem is that you don't have the passed down exact method, pot and oven.

If the bread is hitting the top of the romertopf, you can cut down the recipe a little, and oil the romertopf.

While you're having troubles, I wouldn't worry so much about the shape. Try baking it in the dutch oven. The volume of the pot is only part of the equation. The diameter of the bottom and relation to the sides matters too. I could not get any to work in my lovely new 4 qt. Staub which was supposed to be specifically for baking bread in. I now understand that the standard recipes are too small for it. I liked the ease of pot baking enough to start baking my regular ADY bread in it. Then moved it to my two quart pumpkin pot which makes cute posy shaped loaves. The same pot worked fine for the accidental high hydration loaf, and it came out with equal volume to the more flour version, just with a way looser crumb.

So adjust your recipe to fit your vessel, or change your vessel to fit your recipe, and you should get somewhere.

Annie puts her no knead dough to rise on parchment and puts it parchment and all into the hot pot. I've tried it. It works fine, but I had trouble with creases. I'm sure I could get better at it if I tried.

With high hydration breads, I really don't see the point of rising in a mold if you're not baking in the same. IME, the dough is so soft it spreads to fill the pot anyway. Maybe try on parchment in the romertopf to make containing the spread and lifting the paper easy?

I am firmly of the opinion that you can do this and get really good bread out of it, and that you just haven't found the right formula for your kitchen. Keep at it!

I found it really hard to get used to handling high hydration breads although I like them best. Every bit of me wants to knead it harder and longer adding more flour. I am getting better. I did find watching videos helped. I like this guys videos - especially to see a raggedy mess get to be a fairly tight smooth dough.

https://youtu.be/Znv99QbfWGs 

I was baking fairly frequently this spring but I bake outside in a wood fired oven. It is way too dry right now. My rhythm is lost for now.

Because I have trouble with the flabby dough, I've been baking mine in a romertopf lined with parchment, which is also what it rises in. I use the top of the romertopf for the rising, and then gently transfer it to the preheated bottom using the parchment paper to minimize movement of the dough. But it just didn't look all that great, like a flattened football with creases, and there were crust issues including uneven baking. I use a tray with melting ice cubes when I bake in a pan in the oven, to add steam. But I also don't get the oven rise that way . . . So I was trying to just transfer it from the romertopf into a preheated dutch oven. It didn't hold any type of shape this last time.

Meanwhile, I watch this guy in the documentary "Fermented" and he just mixes it, kneeds it, and then puts it on a stone and bakes it. Mind you he has a special oven which is probably very steamy, but still, I just can't get my doughs to cooperate even when I follow and use recipes that I watch on YouTube. It is definitely finding the sweet spot of hydration. And yes, each brand of flour has its own personality. I couldn't get my usual King Arthur bread flour and have been using Pillsbury bread flour and it is not the same. The best bread I made was using King Arthur all purpose flour and adding gluten to compensate, back when I couldn't get any bread flour at all.

"Peasant" is an unfortunate name for this type of bread because it really can have different interpretations.It could also be referred to as "rustic".

If it doesn't work out for you to do that type of bread, bake the more fresh yeast type. There is nothing wrong with a fine crumbed fresh yeast bread.

I made some buttermilk bread this past week that was absolutely wonderful!

I did the no knead dutch oven bread a couple of times but found that it was a pretty dry bread that did not have much keeping quality and I though that the taste was a bit flat. It was best used right hot from the oven, but not really as good the next day.

There are so many different ways to produce breads that if one does not suit you, try another.

My grandmother always said that we put too much yeast in our bread. That is because when she was young they used much less yeast and allowed a much longer rising and fermenting time. They were "peasants" and that was how they baked.

If you want to know more about such baking tune into You tube and look for Townsends videos. He does this wonderful cooking from the days of early America and he is so much fun to watch. You could learn a thing or two about yeast and baking from him and how they used to do it.

I have been enjoying flat breads that are baked on the stove top in a hot iron skillet. I let them start with a sponge. They puff up like pita and they are so versatile to use so many ways! I make them whole wheat.

I suggest not using bread flour. King Arthur AP has quite enough gluten.

I suggest not using bread flour. King Arthur AP has quite enough gluten.

Ironically when I added gluten I got the best chewy texture that I love. I don't like the other type of bread, the softer, cake-like kinds. But hubs does, so I do both. Rustic makes me even feel worse. Like something that is just made from inexpensive easy to find ingredients you have laying around the house, with minimal fuss. I just feel like "rustic" bread should be that way . . . mine is more like "artisan" connoting high skill and special techniques and tools necessary. Not that there's anything wrong with that, but I am more of a rustic kind of gal . . .

My aunt was a great down-home cook. She spent a lot of time in the kitchen. Not necessarily doing elaborate things, but a lot of prep. It never seemed like she was cooking, just futzing. She always had a bit or bob of something marinating or sitting in the fridge ready to combine with something else. So she could pull a very delicious meal seemingly out of her hat. I have the time to do the breads, so a slow rise to develop flavor is OK, even time to nurture sourdough. It's the actual results that elude me . . .

See, this is what I meant about developing your own recipe for your ingredients. You got one that you love, but are trying to get there with different ingredients. IME, it doesn't work that way. You may need to bite the bullet and order up a goodly quantity of the flour, etc., that you really like and bake with that.

I don't think no-knead bread is a typical peasant bread or even a typical rustic one. Peasants weren't likely to have refined white flour. Their breads would have been whole wheat or even more likely a mix of cheaper grains (rye, oats, barley) possibly with some wheat or bran. Sometimes they ate "horse bread" which was made from legumes and considered even farther down the hierarchy.

Peasants also often didn't have ovens though they might have access to a communal oven. So flat breads or other kinds of bread that can be cooked on an open fire were often peasant breads. I haven't heard that they didn't knead their bread when making breads with flour. I thought no-knead was a fairly modern technique.

What peasants cooked they probably cooked over and over (once a day or once or twice a week for years) - it shouldn't be surprising that they might be good at it and that it might be hard to master for someone who only does it a few times or even a few dozen times. There are plenty of stories of the new cook who has lots of cooking disasters.

The breads I make are either kneaded or are rustic ones with periodic stretch and folds during the initial rise. (I consider the stretch and fold technique as a kind of kneading.) I don't see the attraction of making a no-knead bread, especially if it isn't producing the results you want.

I like doing the final rise in a flour-dusted linen-lined banneton. It's usually pretty easy to get even a wet loaf out of that without traumatizing it back into gloop. I haven't had good results with shifting dough off of parchment paper. If using that, I'd leave it on the paper when putting it into the oven.

@Plllog: Still, any recipe that's refined (no bran) wheat flour, water, yeast, salt, where the proportion of water is low enough to make a dough ball that can be handled, that you knead for a good ten minutes until you have a well stretched glutenous lump, let rise to double (not more), punch down, shape, rise to double again, and bake to an internal temperature of 195-210° F, is bread.

You seem to be excluding whole wheat from being bread in that statement. I don't understand that. I like the flavor having at least some whole wheat adds to a bread. With the right whole wheat flour, I even like 100% whole wheat bread.

Sorry! I meant that whole wheat is more finicky, and all whole wheat is more prone to failure, not that it isn't bread! I'm not supposed to have whole wheat anymore, but I miss it dearly. I made a variety of home milled 100% whole wheat and whole multi-grain breads for years as our daily bread. Commercial whole grain flours are often a bit finer and easier to work, but they also can easily start smelling a bit rancid before they even get home, which can also increase the bitterness. Whereas, you have to go way wrong to get a white loaf not to be bread. It might not be "right" but it's still bread. Even my worst failure at no-knead tasted good and breadlike.

The breads I make are usually 2/3 white flour and 1/3 whole wheat or rye. I haven't done "rustic" oatmeal yet but make it with commercial yeast. That and breads using various cooked cereals.

I had actually planned on just transferring the loaf from the rising romertopf pan that gave it the shape, right into the dutch oven on the same parchment paper. The romertopf doesn't fit into the dutch oven, but the bread that takes the shape of the pan does. That's how I had success with my last rye loaf. I was surprised that the bread just deflated so fast just by my picking up the parchment paper out of the romertopf. I had to scrape it off only because I wanted to redo the dough. It has been a good loaf, but flying saucer shaped, so I guess true peasant bread after all! Now CS has me wanting to try foccacia . . . sounds like my kind of thing! But I still don't get the texture I want, my pizza crust has so far been only adequate. AnnT flips out gorgeous loaves and crusts without batting an eyelash, but not me . . .

I imagine that peasants ate a lot of gruel, and probably included it in their breads. In fact, I'm sure that's how sourdough and eventually commercial yeast breads got started, because they kept the leftover gruel around to eat again, so I'm sure they figured out it could be used to make bread relatively early on. Bread easier to transport than cooked gruel and doesn't need heating to make edible. Gruel in the morning before work, bread and if you were lucky, cheese or maybe a cooked sausage for lunch in the fields, and then soup or stew from the back of the stove when you got home for dinner. Hubs and I eat that way most of the time, other than summer when we can pig out on fresh fruits and vegetables.

The whole grains may not be playing well with your substitute flour.

I just thought, while jneading my sourdouugh—have you tried batter breads? I've never done it but Grainlady recommended the technique. I'm sure. You can find recipes online.