The first thing that struck me were the adjacencies. Taking groceries from the garage to the kitchen involves walking the full width of the house. It may be better to generally locate the kitchen where the bedroom is and the bedroom where the kitchen was. I will have more comments later, gotta get back to my work.

I'm never a fan of the master closet being in the bathroom for a variety of reasons.

In addition to Mark's comment there is a lot of space to walk around to get to the different areas that is eating up some square footage and lots of jigs and jogs inside the house, plus the walking spaces appears to be narrow to me.

Other things I noticed are

- venting for the washer/dryer is going to be a long run

- No privacy between the two upstairs bedrooms at the top.

- very small closets in the bedrooms which won't hold much. I know you said it was just for guests, but if you ever want to sell they would be a deal breaker to me.

- The shower in the master looks really tight

- Doors should ideally swing out in a toilet room because apparently a lot of people have emergency situations on there which makes it hard to get to the people when they block the door.

- The doors are so skinny in some places that if you plan to age in place and may need a walker or something you won't be able to make it to a bathroom

- Not sure you'll be able to get any large pieces of furniture into the master bedroom with the narrow walkways there. Not sure how it would turn the corner

- Windows on all sides would be nice of a room and even a powder room even though you want blinds for privacy could use a window.

- The top right upstairs bedroom will get woken up if they are a sensitive sleeper by anyone using the bathroom with the door there as light always shines under doors and even around the frame some. I would just skip the door.

- The distance between the table seating and the island looks tight for anyone to walk through when someone is sitting at the table.

- When sitting at the dining table one side has an excellent view, the ends have a decent view and the other side has a view of the kitchen. If it was designed so the table was turned all but 1 seat can see out to the lake.

- The master closet looks really tight in the width. When clothes hang they tend to take up roughly 2 ft. How much space do you have to walk in? The corners won't be very useful as they will be hard to access. Yes you can hang things there, but for 2 ft they will be blocked by other items.

Another thing is I would want easy access to a bathroom from the lake assuming people will be wet and needing to go.

There are other things, but I ran out of time and I'm sure others will note them too.

Unless you are also planning on some kind of cabana with facilities, I would make sure that your your powder/ laundry/ mud room areas are together and easily accessible from the outside...and I would include a shower in that space, too. We live at the beach and after 20 years I finally have that, and I am beyond grateful. An outdoor shower, with hot and cold running water, is another thing I finally have....and I still wonder why we did not do it sooner.

Lyfia made some great observations.

To maximize your lake views and natural light, I'd redesign the house so that it's only 1-2 rooms deep (including covered porches and attached garages), assuming the views to the lake face either north or south. :-D If the lake is to the west, I'd want to consult a licensed architect ASAP or sell the parcel. (I'm sensitive to western heat and glare in a house. ;-) )

When a home is 2.5-4 rooms deep, interior spaces will likely suffer from a lack of sunshine.

(For future designs, it also wouldn't be a bad idea to locate the powder room so that it's not quite so visible from the front door, lol.)

One of the top priorities for our lake house build was a powder room at the rear of the house (lakeside) it can be accessed from the exterior via a side porch that has an outdoor foot wash station.

(not a pro) I'd want the public areas - kitchen, family, dining - along the back for the views. Master BR doesn't need the view since you'll be in there when it's dark. Also I'd want a big deck next to the covered porch, for outdoor enjoyment of the lake view and grilling.

Hanging clothes take up about 2' of space, perpendicular to the wall, and they don't turn corners. Your WICs will hold about as many clothes as a reach-in closet, so you might want to redesign those.

And I'm not understanding the 3rd picture - is that a redesign of the main floor? There's a room with no door?

Assuming you have room, I would want to pull the covered porch over to the side of the dining room, rather than straight out the back blocking the views. That is one part of the bigger point ODD made about not having the house not be so many rooms deep.

On the bedroom level make the closets for the two top bedrooms reach-ins on the shared wall (for better sound privacy between what I’m assume are intended to be the adults’ rooms), put just one sink in each of the bathrooms (visitors don’t really need double sinks) and give the added space to the lower two bedrooms (which are a little tight considering they’ll like house multiple kids, right?)

Is the middle picture a lower level? So this is a walkout? If I'm going to love there a long time, a main floor master doesn't help me get outside of I have to go down a flight. Not to mention maintaining the mechanicals down there.

Thanks for all the input so far, please keep it coming!

The first 2 pictures are of our plan. The last 2 pictures are of the plan we based it off of that we built 5 years ago.

I avoid:

1. Designs that do not relate to the site.
2. Closets where hanging clothes turn corners.
3. Windowless walk-in closets.
4. Walk-in closets that will be difficult to walk into.
5. Hallways less than four feet wide.
6. Stairs less than 3'-6" wide.
7. Powder room off main entry
8. Powder rooms on an exterior wall without a window.
9. Master bathrooms with little counter space.
10. Bedrooms next to a bathroom without a sound barrier.
11. Clothes closets accessible from a bathroom.
12. Tiny mudrooms.
13. Gas chambers without windows.
14. Gas chambers.
15. Less than 3'-0" clear width for a water closet fixture.
16. Bathrooms with more than one access.
17. Corner bedrooms with only one window.
18. No coat closet at exterior entrances.
19. Inefficiently laid out laundry rooms.
20. Undersized utility rooms.
21. Double wide garage doors.
22. Views up stairs to where someone may be walking to a bathroom.

to name a few.

Mark, do you have any tips/tricks for a sound barrier between bathroom/bedroom? This is a pet peeve of mine but not sure how I can remedy this on the 2nd floor other than just sound insulating. What is your reason for avoiding double wide garage doors? I have never had a home with two single doors (currently have a double with a single) but would consider changing. Does it help with putting space between the cars?

I see more than one person prefers a closet separate from the bathroom, what is the reason for this? I haven't lived in a house for a long time that has a closet outside of the master bath and I can't think of a reason why I might like that better.

So much good info here, I am going to put a lot more thought into this!

"Do you have any tips/tricks for a sound barrier between bathroom/bedroom?"

One way would be to not have access into a bathroom from a bedroom if the bathroom has another entrance to it. Another is to utilize a closet between the bathroom and bedroom. Or sound proof the wall.

What is your reason for avoiding double wide garage doors?

With a double wide garage door the entire garage gets exposed. With two single doors only enough of the garage gets exposed to drive a car in. Helps space the cars. Aesthetics.

"A closet separate from the bathroom, what is the reason for this?"

I do not like having to go through a wet space (bathroom) to get to a clothes closet or having to walk through a wet space after getting dressed in a closet. Plus it could encourage the growth of mold and mildew in the closet if moist air from the bathroom enters the closet over time.

OP, I would never buy a house that DIDN'T have the master closet off the bathroom so that's not a design flaw but personal preference. Had it for decades and no mold yet!!

The only thing that jumped out at me is the master shower looks like a cave.

I really do appreciate all of the input I have gotten so far. It really helps to have other eyes take a look, especially when they can "read" floor plans! We hope to give this to a real architect/designer soon as we are supposed to close on the sale of our current lake house (floorplan in original post) in a week. In the meantime, I will continue playing around with the plan and trying to tweak it as much as possible!

What do you expect the architect to do for you? They normally design buildings (houses) to meet the owners needs and fit the site.

If you are going to hire an architect, you don't need to bring them a prospective floor plan - bring them your wants, needs, lifestyle, and let them put it together for you. Certainly talk about what you love about your current floor plan, and what you don't like about it. If your current house does not have a lake, or a view, or summer visitors, it might not be well suited for this lot.

Investing time and energy into your own plan can cloud your judgement - if the architect presents something completely different, it may be more difficult for you to see their vision.

So instead of tweaking this plan, devote your time to making lists of your wants, needs, and lifestyle. Things like how much you cook (do you do a lot of grilling at the lake? We do); how old are your children (if any); how long guests will stay. Do you love laying in bed and looking out over the water? Or sitting in your jammies with a cup of tea in the morning? Design the master accordingly.

I do like what looks like storage space in the garage - at the lake you need space for water toys in addition to normal garage stuff like bicycles and lawn mower.

I totally agree with those that suggested easy access from the outside to a bathroom - and make sure that bathroom has lots of storage space for beach towels. Somehow no one in our family can remember to grab a towel before they head to the lake!

Depending on your setbacks, I would want the house as wide as possible, to provide more rooms with lake views. The garage storage, for example, doesn't need a lake view.

As for the closet in the bathroom - some people love them, but I doubt I would. To me it seems like a lot of extra steps, if I have to go through the bathroom to get a sweater or jacket. And I would rather not have to squeeze past my DH brushing his teeth to get to the closet (in your configuration). I think it's better to use closets as noise buffers between bedrooms and public spaces, or between bedrooms and bathrooms.

I agree with the comments about the bathrooms. I myself am a big fan of the closet off of the master. Had it like that for 30 years and never had a problem, perhaps it depends on BR size? I would agree that the master shower needs some help especially if wanting to age is place.

Is there a reason for the long hallway? If you got rid of the wall it would open up the floor plan and furniture would make a walkway. It also solves some of the problem of navigating furniture into the master.

I am a serial remodeler/house builder and have worked with various professionals over the years. The more you can bring to the table to start, the better your project will be. I always noodle around with floor plans before I talk to someone, because that helps me clarify my thoughts. I also also make sure I have lots of pictures of things I like, for which Houzz has been a real godsend! No inch thick files of magazine clippings! My feeling is that the architect should be bringing your vision to life, better than you imagined.

May I suggest you put together a list of your wants, needs, wouldn't it be nice to haves, and pictures of the style of house you like along with a plat of your property to a licensed architect and see what he/she can come up with. You might be surprised to see a much better layout and plan that makes full use of your land.

We hope to give this to a real architect/designer soon as we are supposed to close on the sale of our current lake house (floorplan in original post) in a week. In the meantime, I will continue playing around with the plan and trying to tweak it as much as possible!

You don't need to come up with a plan if you're seeing a licensed architect. Bring what I wrote above to an architect and also look up bubble diagrams here on this forum as to what else would help a licensed architect.

A good architect will also come out and walk your property with you working with you to figure out the best way to orient the house, and maximize your land.

My inlaws had a lake house for years and designed it to have fabulous views. I'm not sure what your lot is like but they had a walkout basement with the same views as the main floor. What are your lot size restrictions?

I would want my kitchen sink to have lake views. And perhaps island seating if you eat there often.

I also don't think I would want a couch covering the window wall in the living room. This might depend on elevation above water but hopefully you are above the water. You are always looking down to water so the lower part of the window is more important and the couch blocks that.

I would also consider the dining view to the water. That covered porch will have railings and posts that will block the view.

Generally with a view house, you go wide with the living area. I would dare say, most go setback to setback. This comes from an ocean perspective but I would think the focus would be similar.

Your storage shed is taking some of your width that you could use for views - ie the kitchen could be there.

You don't need to come up with a plan if you're seeing a licensed architect.

A good architect will also come out and walk your property with you working with you to figure out the best way to orient the house, and maximize your land.

The OP apparently does not need or want the architect to create an entirely new plan from scratch. They have already built a similar house that they liked and enjoyed. They know what they want.

It sounds like the OP simply wants an architect to massage the existing plans and create a formal set of drawings. What's wrong with that?

My first car was a 1964 Dodge Dart, with a pushbutton automatic transmission. I loved that car. I was comfortable in it. Should I try to find a carmaker to replicate the 1964, or should I look for a newer vehicle that will be more comfortable, more efficient, and safer?

Being familiar with a plan is fine - but may be far from the best plan/layout for a lake home, for a hundred reasons.

Clearly the OP isn't an architect, and doesn't have a good sense of how interior changes affect the exterior. The OP doesn't have a good feel for spatial relationships (hence the 9.5' wide bedroom). They don't have a good understanding of flow and natural light. These aren't criticisms of the OP - the same could be said of most people who build houses.

Architects, on the other hand, DO understand those things, and have been trained to use them. A good architect will design for the homeowner's wants and needs, in a way that is takes advantage of views, and is harmonious to the property.

having a plan you already like is great - telling an architect what you currently LOVE about your existing house and what you wish was different, is a good start. Actually - if you could get your architect INTO your existing house that might be helpful as you point out things that work for you and done - AND the architect will be able to see how you live, what truly gets prioritized, etc.

Our architect came here and completely understood that a lot of our free time and cares and concerns revolve around the animals in our care, and hobbies include cars and racing that drove certain needs in our program.

Then translating all that to your site and how your life will change through the coming years - you will have a great result! But - BE OPEN to different thoughts. Some of the best meals I have had are things that were recommended by the chef / waiter vs what I thought I would order off the menu. :D

In your plan, if the site allows, I would SURE LIKE to see that house stretched from end to end. Fine to put the garage out "front" as you are on the lake and the real front is that side! HOWEVER - I appreciate more natural light in the morning to get ready and put on make up (or at least pre-COVID 19!). Your bathroom will feel like a condo or apartment with all interior walls. And the shower in your master seems WAY too small for this size house. In fact - I feel like you are cheating yourself in the master vs the upstairs suites!

My first car was a 1964 Dodge Dart,...

Quite a LONG stretch on the analogy. The OP is currently living in a similar house they had built, which is just 5 years old. We aren't talking about a 55 year old car.

Being familiar with a plan is fine - but may be far from the best plan/layout for a lake home, for a hundred reasons.

How do you define "best"? Best for whom? Best for you, the architect, the OP? Preferences in house designs/layouts are highly personal. Just because you don't like it, doesn't mean it isn't ideal for the OP.

Clearly the OP isn't an architect, and doesn't have a good sense of... The OP doesn't have a good feel for...They don't have a good understanding of...

This is probably why the OP intends to use an architect in some capacity. To tweak/massage the current plans, improve them a bit, ect. Why spend tens of thousands of dollars on an architect to re-invent the wheel if the OP is happy with their current house, and has tweaked the current plan to account for their changing needs?

Why spend tens of thousands of dollars on an architect to re-invent the wheel if the OP is happy with their current house, and has tweaked the current plan to account for their changing needs?

The OP is clearly planning to use an architect. The suggestions here are to let the architect do their job - which is to design a home that suits the site, takes advantage of views, satisfies the needs of the family in a pleasing and efficient way.

Plopping an existing house - no matter how much you like it - on a different lot is not likely to achieve the above goals. The advice to the OP is best stated by just_janni:

"BE OPEN to different thoughts. Some of the best meals I have had are things that were recommended by the chef / waiter vs what I thought I would order off the menu. "

In other words, bring the ideas to the architect, but let them figure out the plan.

But - BE OPEN to different thoughts. Some of the best meals I have had are things that were recommended by the chef / waiter vs what I thought I would order off the menu. :D

Exactly. It is the same when using a person of design talent to create a home for you.

An example is the horticulturist who created my exterior. The first time we sat down, I mentioned a whole bunch of plants I insisted I didn't like. Well, 1 year later some of those plants are now in my garden and are now some of my favorites. Why? Because my horticulturist is a true artist and knew how to create something that incorporated some of those plants in a harmonious whole that makes them and the rest of the plants shine even brighter. Every single person who walks by, comments on how gorgeous my garden is and how they think it's the best one in the neighborhood. I would have NEVER been able to come up with the plan that she came up with!

Conversely, there were a few plants I insisted we use because I LOVED them, but now I'm regretting it because they just don't work well with the others.

I knew I didn't have the eye or the knowledge of plants here in FL to create a beautiful whole. She designed something that went far above my expectations or anything I could have envisioned.

The suggestions here are to let the architect do their job - which is to design a home that suits the site, takes advantage of views, satisfies the needs of the family in a pleasing and efficient way.

Architects can be used for a broad spectrum of services, can they not? The OP could hire an architect to tweak/edit the existing plan, which they are quite familiar and happy with, right?

They have built and lived in a similar house and appear to know what they want. What is wrong with spending $5,000 on an architect to massage their existing plans, rather than spend $25K-$50K+ to reinvent the wheel?

Yes, in a utopian world, with unlimited funds/time/resources, everyone would build a completely custom house by selecting the best architect around to design a bespoke home, which fulfills the customers every desire.

I understand that is how YOU want everyone to build their homes. But that is simply not reality for many people. They might not have the time or resources to do so. Or they may be comfortable enough with their own plans to simply have an architect review and give his/hers $.02.

At the risk of throwing out another analogy you won't like:

Having an architect "massage" amateur plans is kind of like having a racehorse pull a carriage in Central Park. Or having Michelangelo paint your bedroom.

If all a person wants is to tweak existing house plans, they hire a draftsman, not an architect. If a person wants to make the most of their home-building dollar, to get a house that will be a joy to live in for years to come, they hire an architect.

I don't recall the OP saying they were on a very tight budget, so I don't understand the insistence that they can't afford an architect - especially when they clearly stated that they were going to do so.

They have built and lived in a similar house and appear to know what they want. What is wrong with spending $5,000 on an architect to massage their existing plans, rather than spend $25K-$50K+ to reinvent the wheel?

Why do YOU assume it's going to cost $25-$50k to reinvent the wheel? Now who's making assumptions?

You're getting bogged down in the minutia again...

The point is, it will be MUCH less time-consuming and MUCH less costly, for an architect to offer suggestions on an existing plan vs. creating an entirely new/different home from scratch.

Wouldn't you agree?

I don't recall the OP saying they were on a very tight budget, so I don't understand the insistence that they can't afford an architect - especially when they clearly stated that they were going to do so.

There is no insistence that they "can't afford" an architect. If they already have plans they are comfortable with, why waste months and months of time on an architect starting from scratch? Or spend tens of thousands of dollars unnecessarily?

If all a person wants is to tweak existing house plans, they hire a draftsman, not an architect. If a person wants to make the most of their home-building dollar, to get a house that will be a joy to live in for years to come, they hire an architect.

Why do you care who they hire to tweak existing plans? They can hire whomever they like, be it an architect, draftsman, designer, ect. I'm sure there are lots of architects around the country that spend plenty of time tweaking existing house plans.

And it is ridiculous to suggest that ONLY people who hire a top-notch architect to design a blank-slate custom house will get a home that will be a "joy to live in." I guess anyone who builds a stock plan, or a subdivision new-build, will suffer through years of misery and despair.

Booty bums with no designs of your own and nothing to show you know anything, you seem to enjoy disrupting what everyone else says on these threads. If the folks didn't want comments or didn't like our suggestions, all they have to do is say so.

You don't need to be someone else's "hero" because all you are doing is being disruptive.

"The point is, it will be MUCH less time-consuming and MUCH less costly, for an architect to offer suggestions on an existing plan vs. creating an entirely new/different home from scratch."

That is a false and inflammatory statement. Soon everyone else will come to the conclusion you are a worthless troll in every thread you comment in. Starve.

So are you saying you can create a custom home plan from scratch, for the same amount of time/money as offering suggestions/tweaks to an existing home plan???

It is almost always much easier to start from scratch than to fix other peoples mistakes and problems. You are not hamstrung by the problems and preconceived ideas.

following

Hmm, has DE gotten a new name?

@booty bums I agree with a lot of what you say. I often feel like on this forum it’s use an architect this way or nothing. I completely understand that many see that as the preferred method but the assumption that it is the only way is wild.

OP I would say that if your site conditions at the lake are similar to your current ones it’s an interesting idea to use a similar plan. I would be open to changes though for sure.

A couple of questions I have:

• do you need a front hall closet? I saw you removed that from original house to new plan

Sorry couldn’t see your post.

I would actually remove the pantry and have that be more open to looking into main area. I presume there is a view?

I don’t love the bathrooms upstairs . Lots of doors and wasted space.

Which porch side faces the lake?

Consider removing the wall between the hall and living room, it will open that room and make it feel bigger and more grand. It will also give more of an open floor concept. You can spice up the “new great room wall and put a barn door on the laundry room door.

A S

@booty bums I agree with a lot of what you say. I often feel like on this forum it’s use an architect this way or nothing. I completely understand that many see that as the preferred method but the assumption that it is the only way is wild.

And AS there are those like yourself, who think no one needs an architect. However,in this case, the OP said she/he planned on hiring one, so why the need for you and booty buns to continue on your needs to diss the idea of using a design professional?

The sketch below is what I mentioned in my first comment about adjacencies. The top sketch represents what you have, the bottom sketch represents the an alternative arrangement of spaces. "G" is the garage and "K" is the kitchen, and the dark arrow is the travel path.

Granted there are many factors that influence how a house's space should be arranged that I am unaware of, and a lot depends on personal preference, but usually carrying objects a short distance is usually preferred over longer distances.

I can probably think of a better layout but this is just to illustrate adjacencies.

@CP I actually think using and architect or a designer is a great idea and often is the best idea. I just said using one isn’t the only way as many of you seem to think. And using one the way you all say isn’t the only way either.

Lots of professionals are happy to start with a plan and adapt it. Lots are happy to have a plan that shows what the client has previously enjoyed as a starting point.

My exact point is there are many ways to build a home and it is exhausting when this forum seems to imply there are not.

Likewise, I suggest that you remove the wall between the living room and the hall. And I would switch the laundry room door to the small entrance hall. That will open up the space along the hallway for a console with lighting or a gallery.

And AS there are those like yourself, who think no one needs an architect. However,in this case, the OP said she/he planned on hiring one, so why the need for you and booty buns to continue on your needs to diss the idea of using a design professional?

cpartist -

I know you read my comments and AS's comments, because you responded to them directly.

So you clearly know we NEVER "dissed the idea of using a design professional".

In fact, we did the OPPOSITE of what you claim. We suggested the OP use a design professional to offer suggestions to the existing plans they already have.

The only thing we did was push back on your contention that the OP must only use a design professional to create an entirely new custom plan from scratch, rather than providing advice/tweaks to the existing plans.

So in the words of Mark Bischak, Architect..."that is a false and inflammatory statement".

What is the purpose of the room off the garage? If it could be 3 ft narrower or eliminated, the plan could be reconfigured to improve the awkward master bathroom/closet, central hallway and tight foyer.