Argh...so many threadlets to address. Kirimarie - I read your posts and obviously your opinions are valid based on your experiences. But, you never addressed what I specifically cited: walk around any average middle to upper income residential section of a randomly selected mid-to-large UK city. Walk around the same in the US. Anyone paying attention will spot huge differences in the amount of effort put into the personal landscapes, on average. It's not like I'm saying something crazy here that has never been said before. My parents aren't into gardens at all - I got the bug from my childhood neighbors who in a strange twist of fate were all avid gardeners. But every time they are in the British Isles they go on about how great the gardens are and my Mom will just take some pictures on a random street of people's gardens brimming with Fuchsia, Choisyas, Lilies, various vines, etc. A friend of mine who is also not at all into gardens went to Ireland with her erstwhile fiance and both said the gardens there were absolutely amazing. I'm sure they didn't visit botanical gardens, and by amazing they weren't talking about the fact there's a Phoenix canariensis in Cork. They were just talking about the gardens they saw in neighborhoods that were on their way to someplace. "I think the whole UK are "better" gardeners point of view is nonsense. " When you clearly spend more time at something, the world usually rewards you with the accolade of being "better" at it. The only scintilla of unfairness in what I say might be that, obviously, the climate makes it easier for the English to have the sort of gardens that they do than it is for most in the US. But that isn't to say it can't be done. I've visited private gardens in PA that are every bit as impressive as any I know of in England...(on a per unit land basis, of course...you can't really compete with Sissinghurst when your entire spread is the size of one walled garden there) but they might well be more work in PA. Doesn't have to be someplace moist: I once spent about an hour walking around the neighborhood near the Denver Botanic garden. I saw a couple very interesting private dry-climate gardens. Employees maybe? Probably just supporters who went to the plant sales. But most were just boring standard landscapes...blue spruce, some bland shrubs, whatever. This climate factor influences US regional differences, obviously, as gardengal noted. The whole west coast seemed a bit more gardenesque to me than the rest of the country, and I especially single out some parts of the Bay Area. Lawns... I agree in the west, the watering of ornamental lawns is absolutely a massive and foolish waste of water resources. (though I've gotten in huge arguments with some westerners about this...not online, in real life!) In the east, over maintained lawns are a different kind of environmental timebomb. Particular in the Chesapeake Bay watershed, where, years too late, the amt. of phosphorus in lawn fertilizer was finally restricted. But this doesn't mean lawns per se are the problem, it's just that people have a pig headed approach to them. I will never water my lawn. In the terrible summers of 2010, 2011, and 2012, it had periods of going brown. Big deal. I also don't fertilize it, because I don't need it to be a perfect shade of green, and fertilization would make it grow even faster than our often abundant rains do. Because I did some judicious broadcast spraying with trimec years ago, and - DUH - cut at the highest depth permitted by my Kubota MMM which is 4" on the scale but probably a little higher in practice - broadleaved weeds are so rare I can just spot treat them as needed. So, I am ecologically caring for my lawn. Many people are not, and too many people want theirs to look like a putting green. The house I posted, no, is not nearly the worst example of McMansion landscaping. Definitely not "horrible", in fact I would just call it average to mediocre. But the reason it's partcularly egregious is, sorry, someone who collects plants on such a massive scale, should by my estimation have known better. The formally trained person they hired (this I know from the real estate site where I snagged it) still got it wrong, which is actually more comical than some random local landscaping dude not knowing what he was doing. In fact, the university trained landscape architect producing something that pretty much says "local landscaping dude cramming plants in front so he can get the bill up to 25K". (thus feeding the wholesale industry beast which - to loop back - is the whole reason I branched out into this) It reminds me of the hilarious story of a mature Araucaria araucana - one of the only on the east coast - being cut down at a historic estate near Wilmington, DE, by a professional landscaper for "not looking English enough"(!). Seriously, you could not make up a funnier and truer anecdote about the ignorance of some in the US landscaping profession. It's priceless.

Whatever you do - don't plant English Ivy. The house that was recently built next door, had an old concrete slab piece wall - about 60+ years old that had to be removed with a bulldoser, before they could put up the wall. It took out my apricot tree, not to mention un-earthing a lot of awful sub-soil. But at least the ivy is gone. The old wall also supported a ground cover - which I'm rather fond of. It is quite common, but a good solution to hold banks, and such. The nice part is - it attracts bees and is easy to pull up in unwanted places. It is Aptenia (mesembryanthemum cordifolium) - has a small succulent type leaf and either red or white flowers. It can withstand heat and drought very well. I use it a lot around my fruit trees to act as a cool mulch. It probably would be best planted on top of the wall, and allowed to hang over, rather than grow up. I loved the pictures - is Protea hard to grow or need any special soil/care? Tearing out my front lawn sounds like a good idea - (my water bill doubled recently - drat!) Bejay

As for hardiness, I have had a Camellia sinensis planted by a west-facing concrete porch for several years with no problem. I bought it from Burnt Ridge nursery in Onalaska WA. Sometimes their plants are small but the first one below says it is a gallon. They sell inexpensive seedling plants in a lot of fruit and nut trees. I'm still waiting for fruit on some small plants I bought from them after several years. Maybe some day... Nice people, family business. http://landru.myhome.net/burntridge/ornament.html TEA BREEZE - A dark green leafed selection. Widely cultivated for tea. Hardy to zone 7. Grown in gallon pots, about 3 ft. tall. Multi branched $15.00 ea. BLUSHING MAIDEN - A pink flowered selection, otherwise similar to Tea Breeze. Grown in gallon pot, about 12-18" tall. Multi branched $15.00 ea.

oooooh, did I hit a nerve. Especially with perennial princess....maybe she is closer to the owners than we think. My oppposition first off was a correct one, so take that to the bank. Second, the ag department here is not horrible like you say, and being you are not from here, I would say to you, you have no fuel for the arguement. My biggest complaint with Northcreek is that the sales and coordinator for communication to the shipping department, gave me the runaround with the excuse with the usda and ag department being the problem, then it was the shipping department problem. Then after 3 weeks of saying the order is being delayed again, she actually informed me that my order was being shipped on this day, and that it would reach me in 4 days. After giving me the "go" on the shipping, and providing that the plants went through and passed inspection, the 7th day approached. No plants, no phone call, no professional courtesy of informing me there was another problem. So, call it you will, but if you say that your product is having problems, then the problem is fixed, and you guarantee that you shipped it, then it doesn't reach you because "THE COMPANY DID NOT LIVE UP TO THEIR PROFESSIONAL MATTER OF CONDUCTION" about your order, then "I HAVE THE PURPOSE, POWER, AND PREROGATIVE TO OPINONATE MY FEELINGS ABOUT THE MATTER!". Oh ya, you can quote me on that....even if you know the owners personally, if you watch their dog occasionally, if you are against negative feedback on the net, if you don't like the response I had or others will have, or if you question a persons purpose because he/she experienced ill-prepared business ethics exhibited by a lie given by a "well liked business" and is both e-commerce and a professional institute of horticulture. Well, if you don't like the internet, don't use it. Don't reply to a post if you don't want the answer that is given. Thank you and have a better times with internet companies......