When one is cooking with high heat, the uprising effluent velocity can be 3 ft/s. When this is intercepted by an overhanging hood, it is feasible to capture and contain it with modest air flow rates (90 cfm/ft^2 with baffles). However, when using a downdraft aperture at the back of the cooking surface, capture and containment would have to start with redirecting the effluent momentum from rising to horizontal motion at the aperture. This requires at least as much transverse velocity at the effluent as the effluent has (causing a curving trajectory). However, air velocity outside of a duct drops rapidly with distance, meaning that for full capture of effluent from the front burners using a downdraft aperture the size of the cooktop, the air velocity at the entrance to the downdraft system might have to approach ten times that of the effluent. 30 ft/s is 20 mph close to the mesh, and maybe 40 mph through the mesh gaps, so one can imagine that the noise level might be a tad higher than desirable. Hot greasy cooking only on back burners might reduce the ten times factor to three times, so a large exhaust blower that could handle the restrictions (pressure losses) of a downdraft system might be effective, albeit still somewhat noisy. To the extent that they are cost and aesthetically feasible, hoods approximating commercial units will be more effective than hoods that greatly diverge from this pattern. kas

laat2 - I guess I'm not sure why doing a massive remodel would necessitate an external wall in our kitchen. Our current kitchen is on the top story of a 4-level split. We're moving it downstairs, into a re-done main level that will put the kitchen in the center, essentially. It will be located as "east" as it can go on that level, but to the east of it will be the basement (a half-flight down) and a living room (a half-flight up). To the north is the garage. To the west is a family room. To the south is a long sunroom that spans the length of the family room, kitchen and basement/livingroom - i.e. runs the length of the house. Four-level splits are a monster to deal with, but essentially, the kitchen is the "heart" of that main floor, and thus has no external wall within 15' in any direction. We're coming from a decade of cooking on an electric range with an OTR microwave that we really never turned on while cooking - we only use it when we roast our coffee beans. Venting has never been a priority - we never gave it any thought at all. I think I'm really only aware of it now because I read these forums. Otherwise, we probably would have stuck an undercabinet hood over the cooktop and never thought twice about it. Even in my childhood home, where we cooked daily with NG, the exhaust was only turned on if someone burned something in the oven. We're reusing our current frig and dw...bought a double wall oven off Craigslist...so I don't even really have any other places to scrimp from. Most of our remodel cost is in true construction (framing, roofing, siding, concrete, windows) and very little in "allowances" such as appliances. Our flooring has been purchased - nowhere to scrimp there. Can anyone tell me what the result will be if we do have to run the duct down the wall and out across the basement? The option that had the three 90-degree turns? I know it's not great - I just want to know how truly bad it is...will it cut the 650cfms down to about 200? 100? 50? Essentially nothing??? AP

BKO, I was alerted to this thread after posting over on Decorating. Almost 2 years ago we bought my current house. The cabinets were already white, but had yellowed over time. We were in a rush, and had to paint them. I'd long been wanting yellow cabinets, but DH balked at them, and I was in too much of a hurry to flesh out the design I would have wanted, so I "caved" and just painted them white. (In my last house I had glazed cabinets, so I opted to keep these white.) I *should* have been happy. After all, I love white kitchens, and that whole sleek "Something's Gotta Give"/Christopher Peacock look is one of my favorites. However, I have saltillo floors that are very, very rustic looking. The crisp white cabinets looked great, and the saltillo floors looked great, but not together. I'm a huge fan of mixing rustic/elegant, but it just never made my heart sing. I lived with the kitchen for over a year before I decided I'd had enough. I decided I was going to paint them yellow. It didn't matter if it wasn't trendy. It didn't matter about resale. (I'm a Realtor, so that's a subject I know all too well.) It didn't matter that it would be a royal pain in the carcass, or that people kept telling me that the kitchen was not just "fine" as-is, but it was beautiful, and to leave it alone. It just didn't make my heart sing. DH and I just finished my cabinets, and now I can say 2 things: 1. They finally look like what I had envisioned, and I couldn't be happier. 2. I'm glad I waited before doing it, as it gave me time to pull together the look I wanted, rather than being rushed into it. I'd say that if after 6 months or so if you still find yourself swooning over a white kitchen, do it. You'll thank yourself *every* time you walk in. I'm shocked at how much I love my "new" kitchen, and find myself walking in there just to look at it. I just never felt that way when it was white, though it was pretty.

I finally finished this today. It starts slow and it is a veritable Greek tragedy of a tale, but I think it's worth reading for any LOTR fan who is interested in the tales of the First Age. I did have a hard time getting into it, but when I finally committed myself to finishing it, the book flew. The characters are not as fully developed, certainly, as those in LOTR, and I just couldn't connect with most of them. Turin is one tough main character. I was also perpetually trying to remember who was who, for he and many other people -- and even several places -- in the story had multiple and ever-changing names. (There is a detailed list of names at the back of the book.) At one point I didn't realize for a whole page that the character in the middle of the action was actually Turin, as he was using his fourth or fifth alias since the start of the story and I had just lost track. Definitely a lack on my part :) The introduction by Christopher Tolkien, the appendices, the genealogies, and the story of how The Children of Hurin was painstakingly put together from the elder Tolkien's notes, poems and unfinished drafts is also interesting reading. Finally, the illustrations by Alan Lee are just gorgeous. As I mentioned before, I have not read The Silmarillion, or the HOME books, but I'd bet fans of those would really love this and appreciate it on far more levels than I can. Personally, I didn't love it, but I'm glad I read it. It's not a book I'd want to purchase, but it was certainly worth the overdue library fine (Janalyn, IMHO, I'd go the library route first). I'll be very interested to hear what everyone else here thinks of it.