Question on node theory and blooming of citrus seedlings.
I have a Clem-Yuz hybrid grown from seed that had to grow about 7 feet before it finally bloomed last season (2018) at the very tip-top of the plant. No fruit came of it.
THIS season (2019), the plant bloomed again, however this time there were many, many more blooms and many blooming much further down on the plant -- even as low as 2 feet above soil level (granted that some of the lower branches are quite long and are arching downward). I am aware of 'citrus node theory' that says a citrus seedling must grow a certain number of nodes (where leaf meets stem) before the growth becomes mature enough to bloom and bear, but I also wonder if something else comes into play. Could it be that there must be a 'critical mass' of mature growth before some of the tree is able to bloom? Maybe this lower growth had already attained maturity (required node count), but didn't 'kick in' until more of the tree had become mature -- like maybe some hormone was given off in adequate concentration? I wish citrus professor Dr. Manners were still monitoring these conversations to comment.
I am thinking of reducing the height of my plant by a couple feet next winter. I want to see how reducing the amount of mature growth at the top affects blooming of the lower branches -- will they continue to bloom again? -- or will they cease until the plant has grown back its critical mass of mature growth?
So for those who have grown seedlings to fruit bearing size, I welcome your comments and observations.
Comments (21)
poncirusguy6b452xx
4 years agolast modified: 4 years agoDave in NoVA • N. Virginia • zone 7A
4 years agolast modified: 4 years agoRelated Discussions
Question for Dr. Manners re node count
Comments (23)ok what about when a grafted tree blooms when it is small and the branches are not very long. will it continue to bloom at those lower branch locations even when it is quite old in essence having the whole tree producing fruit, the lower and top end? or does the node count change to higher requirements as the tree gets larger for it to produce fruit at? nero, A grafted tree is created with a mature scion. The scion never forgets its node number....could be something like, who knows?, 100,000 or a gazillion, depending on where it came from. Any branches that shoot from it will begin their node count at the scion's count, if that makes sense. ANY branches that come from it will be capable of bearing no matter how large or small the tree. To my knowledge branches cannot revert back to juvenile once their mature. Kind of like have you ever seen English ivy growing up a tree, then all of a sudden it matures into a more shrubby-like thing? It grows branches and the leaf shape changes. If you take cuttings of this mature growth, it will retain its shrubby character and not revert back to its juvenile viney character....See MoreCitrus cutting coming to bloom already! Yahoo. Pics
Comments (25)The way I rooted some cuttings was using a plastic drinks bottle, cut in half. Cut some fresh looking shoots about 6in long and put them in the soil with about an inch poking out, no leaves. Put the 'lid' back on and leave in a bright spot (but not too bright). They can take a while (mine took months) but sooner or later they'll either brown off and die or they'll stay green. Remove any obviously rotting one. I'm sure others have their own methods too. Don't be tempted to remove them until you've got signs of a growth flush and a decent root, and even then I'd leave them in the bottle for a while. Periodically moisten the soil and unscrew the cap to let in some air. Hope that helps Regards Nick...See MoreGreetings Citrus Forum! Lemon Tree Seedlings
Comments (23)Dave, I do realize that these are trees! lol :) As time continues to move forward, I am aiming to have space. Currently I have a spare bedroom that I am heavily considering turning into a grow room. I've got some good outdoor space as well, for when the time comes. It seems like I will have time to work it all out. If nothing else, I'm enjoying the experience and experiment in the moment! Perhaps it is indeed the citrus bug! I am eager to learn more....See Morecitrus seedlings in the ground in the North, an experiment
Comments (81)Here's the little Yuzu seedling, February 25 It seems to be doing just fine. It's doing much better after this winter than it was the winter last year. I know I posted a picture of it a month ago, but I thought it worthwhile to update it today because February 25 pretty much marks the end of winter and we are not going to have any freezing temperatures after today. If it could make it to now, it will do just fine the rest of the year. If any of you really want to go see it to believe it, you can go to the Yashiro downtown Japanese garden. A little seedling that doesn't have poncirus in it is surviving outside in Olympia, this far north in latitude (47 N). Not merely just a plant but a very small seedling, on its own roots, not grafted. Of course I feel it is in a protected spot in a very optimal location, and being situated downtown probably also helps temperatures from going to low. But it does demonstrate the climate Yuzu can grow in. A very interesting experiment. I'm so glad the seedling did not die-back this winter. I expect its growth will really take off this year especially since it is growing on its own roots (not grafted)....See More
tropicofcancer (6b SW-PA)
4 years agoponcirusguy6b452xx
4 years agolast modified: 4 years ago
jaydub83
4 years agoDave in NoVA • N. Virginia • zone 7A
4 years agoponcirusguy6b452xx
4 years agoDave in NoVA • N. Virginia • zone 7A
4 years agolast modified: 4 years agojelina_dk
4 years agoponcirusguy6b452xx
4 years agoDave in NoVA • N. Virginia • zone 7A
4 years agoAnother first to bloom! This is my Keraji mandarin seedling. Blooming about 6 or 7 feet up the tree. Entire tree is around 9 feet tall. I'll let it bloom once more next year before I trim it back. Want to give the tree enough time to realize it's mature. LOL! I think this tree is about 6 years old, give or take a year. I also started cuttings and one graft from the top-most growth last summer, so it's nice to know they are not far from being mature. Although if the entire original plant 'gets the message' that it's mature, I may just hack back and keep it. It's quite healthy. Just needs a bigger pot and some root pruning.
Here's the whole 'seedling'....
Denise Becker
4 years agoponcirusguy6b452xx
4 years agoDenise Becker
4 years agoponcirusguy6b452xx
4 years agoTheyCallMeDave
4 years ago
bklyn citrus (zone 7B)
4 years agoponcirusguy6b452xx
4 years ago
Jenelle Vallee
4 months agoI know I'm a few years behind here lo I have a question about seed grown Citrus, I have this Lemon Sapling that's 2 years going on 3 in January/February, it hasn' t flowered yet, I topped it 2-3 weeks after it sprouted. It's from a Lisbon or Eureka lemon, the pic is from last winter, I'm wondering how much longer it will take before it flowers? If there's anything I can do to help encourage, I feed Jack's Citrus Fed 20--10-20 every week or 2 depending how often I have to water them, follow the directions on the Citrus Food any suggestions are greatly appreciated
Dave in NoVA • N. Virginia • zone 7A
4 months agolast modified: 4 months agoJenelle Vallee , lemon seedlings generally take anywhere from 5 to 10 years or more to bloom, depending on environment and length of growing season. They usually grow very vertical and must get quite tall. If you trim it before it blooms, it will just keep putting out juvenile growth (not able to bloom).
So you may have to allow your lemon to get 6 to 9 feet high or more to achieve 'mature growth'. This is another reason why most people grow grafted trees, or trees grown from mature-wood cuttings. They bloom at a MUCH smaller size and much sooner! Fortunately, you're not growing an orange or grapefruit, from seed as those can take 15 years or more!
My Meyer lemon from a rooted cutting:
TheyCallMeDave