Agree!

As someone who spent a long time around horses, and rode ex-racehorses for decades, I can tell you from personal experience, that all you have to do is visit a feed lot to see what becomes of many of them. Some ex-racehorses still with the dirty dried sweat mark of the jockey's saddle on them. In other words, not even groomed properly before shipping them off after a last race.

Sure, the horses are trained, loved by their grooms, revered and coddled while they are potential money makers, but afterward.... let's just ask ourselves, where are those thousands and thousands of ex-racehorses now? Racehorses are done racing by the time they are 3, or 5, or 7 years, but they can live to be 20 or maybe even 30 years old. It's very expensive to keep a horse, so where do they go?

A few go into the horse show world, but not very many, that I could see. At least in California. They are sold to killer/buyers on feedlots in (the one that I have seen, and I haven't seen a place like that in years, so maybe it's better by now, but probably not imho), pretty horrendous conditions. Where are the farms full of 20 year old ex-racehorses who never won much money? And who is paying for their feed and care?

Additionally, I can tell you that the thoroughbreds are bred for speed...not longevity or long-term strength. They race at TWO years old! At two years old, they are not even done growing, their growth plates aren't closed, and the risk of damage to their fragile legs is serious. In the hunter/jumper world, responsible trainers (in my experience) don't jump horses until late 4 yrs old, approx. Why? So as not to do permanent damage to their growing leg bones.

There is so much more to this, that I could say. Is racing so terrible? Well, imo, it wouldn't be so terrible if they waited until the horses were older, and if trainers and owners were more responsible about finding homes for them after their racing days.

Youth sports. Greed.

NFL. Greed.

MSL. Greed.

NHL. Greed.

MLB. Greed.

NASCAR. Greed.

Formula 1. Greed.

Boxing. Greed.

Olympics. Greed.

Hollywood. Greed.

Politics. Greed.

Help me build the list.

Another comment from me: the horses that die on the track, or during their racing days, have an easy way out. Euthanasia would be a blessing for so many horses, racehorses and many other horses as well. But guess what? Euthanasia costs money, whereas a horse "on the hoof" as they say, is worth $$ by the pound at the feed lots, or at least it was back in my day. So, do people pay $350-$1,000 for euthanasia and transport/disposal of the body? Or do they SELL the horse and profit? Well, you can guess what many, many trainers do.

Euthanasia is a blessing, because you wouldn't want to see the alternative, in many cases.

I can't wait to see what marilyn_c has to say.

I don't think the commercial feedlot problem is restricted to horses, I think it is probably a dreadful experience for any animal that ends up on one. As bad as they are, there are some few protections in place, I would think some foreign feedlots without such restrictions might be worse.

I love horses, they’re an amazing animal, I just haven’t had very much exposure to them (unfortunately for me). However, everything that I’ve heard about the horse racing industry has not been positive. It would seem that in many ways it’s no better than the puppy mills in that it is all about the $$ and equates to animal abuse. I suspect with all the rescuing she does, Marilyn_C would be able to attest to that. Thanks for posting about your experience and perspectives Alisande. Putting it into a thread of your own is smart as it will drawn more attention.

I have always loved horses, especially growing up, the classic girl loves horses deal. But I've never liked horse racing. It all has seemed very seedy and money grubbing to me. I've heard the stories about the treatment of these horses when they don't perform and make a profit. Thoroughbred horses are high strung and aren't suitable for the casual riding crowd, they need to be ridden by very experienced riders. So they are a liability both financially and safety wise. Here in Florida they have finally put dog racing to bed - good. I hope the same follows for horse racing but I have a feeling that it will continue because of the high profits that only a few make on it. I'm not an animal activist but I have never cared for using animals for profit, especially racing, circuses, and particularly places that use sea mammals for entertainment.

Well said, alisande. I couldn't agree more with your comments.

Horse racing has long been an unsavory business that has long attracted unsavory types, in the stables, in the offices, in the stands. I don't consider it a sport at all. As others have said, the horses are NOT well treated. I'm not sure how the rose colored glasses approach in the other thread can continue with some but it's definitely not a nice business nor do normal animal welfare practices apply.

I remember hearing a story some years back from my relative who's a veterinarian. One of the large equine practices in Kentucky horse country invited a small group of vet students to come spend a few days visiting their practice, at their expense. It was a recruiting event. My relative, living at the time as a poor student, welcomed the opportunity to take a free trip and get an inside view of equine medicine at ground zero of the racing world.

It was a shocking experience for them. Though they were still vet school students and not experienced practitioners, they were appalled by the number of drugs, the nature of the drugs, and the effects they had on the animals. The experience had the opposite effect of what the sponsoring vet practice intended, or so I was told. All the participants swore off any interest in dealing with race horses.

I think we cover this topic every year at race time. I agree it’s a sickening business. It’s even more important this year because of the excessive number of deaths seen at the Santa Anita race track in Arcadia, CA this year.

I agree 100% with Mrs. S. The worst part of the shipping to slaughter, is that they now go to Mexico. Crammed 30 in a big truck, no food and water, usually 2 day journey, to be butchered inhumanely with no oversight. Put that many horses close together...it is a disaster. At least cattle, hogs, etc. don't have to make that long journey.

Thoroughbreds come from the track, still wearing their racing plates (horse shoes)

Some of these horses won in the many thousands of dollars but they are used up and discarded like yesterday's trash.

Not only in the "horse" industry, but I would say anything that has "betting, racing and income" associated with it. Think Greyhound Dogs.....same can be said about that industry, and the dogs are treated in the same manner as race horses.

https://www.theatlantic.com/entertainment/archive/2014/03/the-ugly-truth-about-horse-racing/284594/

DF, a veterinarian, studying equine medicine in vet school, changed specialties because of how "horses were treated as a commodity."

100% agree Alisande. Can't even watch the "sport." Those poor animals break my heart. Anyone who has ever loved a horse knows how intelligent and emotional they are.

How we continue to allow this in today's "enlightened" world baffles me.

"DF, a veterinarian, studying equine medicine in vet school, changed specialties "

I didn't find this comment in the link you posted.

Anyway, there is no specialization nor "specialties" in vet school. As in medical school, there are a limited number of electives but everyone graduates with the same degree and mostly the same course of study. There are no "majors". Specialization comes after graduation. Maybe what was meant to be said was that this person's intended career direction changed.

marilyn, like a broken record, I agree with you wholeheartedly. I know that many of those places closed, but allowing the shipment to Mexico (and, at one time, **overseas**!!!) is such a cruel end for these gentle, hard-working, beautiful animals.

I am proud to say that I have never sold any of my horses. They were, all of them, 12 or 13 total, taken care of until their quality of life diminished too much, and euthanized.

The difference between dog racing and horse racing is that horses are so, so much more expensive to keep than dogs. And they live longer.

I wonder if it would be feasible to ban shipments of horses out of the country when those horses are destined for slaughter.

I don't think slaughter of horses will ever end. Live horses are still shipped to Japan for slaughter. (Not a lot, but I understand that they do). Some go to Canada, but some of their regulations have almost eliminated US horses going there. There is too much demand for horse meat in many countries.

I don't like horse slaughter, but it would be better to bring it back here and strictly regulate it than to have them go to Mexico. I understand the difficulties handling horses to be slaughtered. They are often inclined to be nervous in the first place, but if it is going to happen, it should be here and as humanely as possible, but in the end, I can only prevent slaughter of my own horses, and I do that by never selling them.

Agreed! Thank you for posting this. I wrote a comment last night in the derby thread but deleted it as I didn't feel it was fair to derail that thread, so I appreciate you posting this.

I don't consider horse racing a "sport" because the horses have no control or input on their participation. The difference between horse racing and all the other profitable sports is that humans are able to make decisions about their own participation and the risks. Horses, on the other hand, are forced to take all the risks while the owners reap the rewards.

Imagine a human sport where hundreds died each year! That kind of fatality rate would never be acceptable so why it's okay for these beautiful animals is something I will never understand. Just another example of humans exploiting animals for money.

Horse racing is on the same level as dog fighting IMO. Repugnant. People deliberatly harming animals for fun or profit,with no thought or care for the harm it causes the animal. In both,once the animal is no longer a winner, they are disposed of in horrendous ways. Makes me sick.

Anyway, there is no specialization nor "specialties" in vet school.

About Veterinary Specialists

How to Become a Veterinary Specialist

In addition to four years of veterinary school, a candidate for board certification will have had several years of advanced training or hands-on experience in the subject area they are interested in. Generally speaking, most specialty organizations require veterinarians to spend one year in an internship practicing in their area of interest, and to complete a residency training program for two to three years. Some may require additional recorded time practicing in related subject areas to the specialty of choice. In some cases, hands-on experience after graduation can sub for a yearlong internship.

The timeframes on some of these requirements are nothing to sneeze at — to become board-certified in veterinary surgery, a veterinarian needs to complete 80 hours of training each with an anesthesiologist, radiologist, pathologist, and internal medicine specialist in addition to his or her training in surgery itself.

Somewhere along the way, the veterinarian will also be required to sit for an examination created by the organization in their subject area. The tests may be written, verbal, practical or some combination of the three, and can take up to three days to complete.

I have no particular affinity for horses but I I feel strongly that all animals, whether pets or animals raised for food, must be treated with kindness and dignity. Animals that produce food of one kind or another must be treated with respect as far as I'm concerned and their deaths should be as stress-free and painless as is possible.

I understand that there are cultural differences from place to place. The US happens to be a place where horse meat isn't usually thought of for human consumption and so the thought of slaughter and processing is repulsive for some. In many civilized countries of Western Europe, France is an example but there are others, human consumption of horse meat isn't front and center but it's not unusual either.

For me, the production of horse meat isn't different from the production of beef. The horses aren't Misty of Chincoteague or Mr Ed, just like the cows aren't Elsie the Cow or Babe the Blue Ox. They're just animals, entitled to humane treatment.

Thanks, Kool Beans. What I said is correct, there are no specializations in vet school.

My relative is a board certified veterinary specialist, so I'm quite familiar with the process. In the interest of trying to be less verbose, I omitted the details. My relative spent a total of an addition 5 years AFTER 4 years of vet school.

Since you mentioned surgery, large or small animal surgery is normally 4 years after vet school - a 1 year internship, then a 3 year residency. Sometimes people aren't chosen their first cycle and need to do additional year or two in internships. That's a typical length for most of the others too.

The number of slots available each year for all specialty residencies (most of which are at vet schools but an increasing number at large private specialty practices) is quite small, which is why there are so few boarded specialists compared to the number of vets in total. Applicants are chosen on a competitive basis and most who apply aren't chosen.

At the end of the process, boarded specialists are something like 10-15% of the total vet population. The specialty training produces expert practitioners with knowledge and abilities far beyond what the average GP vet can do.

I read it differently and have different experience, so IMO we disagree actually but that’s ok, you are entitled to believe whatever you want. End of subject.

I agree, based on what I've read, as a general rule race horses are a commodity and only pampered as long as they make money. Once they don't, those who doted on them no longer give a damn.

I really don't understand the mentality of so many, that animals are just walking dollar signs to be exploited at will and treated however we humans see fit. It's appalling and gross and there is really no defending it when it severely harms so many sentient creatures.

80 hours? You must mean 800?

Sleeperblues, I believe large and small int medicine, large and small surgery, derm, neurology, oncology, radiology, anesthesiology, opthalmology, are all 3 year residencies. There are more types but these are the main ones. All require a 1 year internship before applying. I know docs in about half of these specialties. The vast majority of residencies are at vet schools and at all but the largest, can be as few as one or two open slots per year.

Board exams are usually a few days, and there can be more than one session, in more than one year, covering different topics.

Yeah, Kool Beans "read it differently" and disagrees. There's nowhere to go with that comment. Haha.

I think much of the problem here is the way one looks at any horse, in particular a Thoroughbred race horse. Are they livestock or are they a pet? They're actually a bit of both! They are livestock though, and how one views livestock is quite different than the family pet. When livestock outlive their usefulness to a farmer, they are sent to a slaughter house or put down and the knacker is called to take away their bodies. We don't do that with our domestic pets - that would be considered appalling and it would be.

But what would one do with race horses that are now too old to race? Keeping a racehorse involved stabling, exercise and food - all costly things. One cannot run a business and have a stable full of horses that are not pulling their weight Harsh? Well, it depends on if they are pets or livestock. Could I send a horse to a slaughter lot or have him euthanized and his body hauled off? No, but then I would have a very hard time sending cattle to be slaughtered, either, even though I do eat meat.

I remember when my grandmother would decide that an old hen she had had quit laying for her - that old hen was going in the stock/stew pot without a 2nd thought. It was hard for me to watch her kill a chicken that was going on the table for dinner at noon that day. But I sure did enjoy her fried chicken. Call me a hypocrite - I might well be as I just couldn't do it but I'm not a vegetarian or vegan.

The "good" people in any industry, whether it involves animals or not, are ethical. Others are not. People at the high end of the Thoroughbred industry ARE ethical, but there are bottom feeders who are right up there with horse thieves. I'm involved in my dogs' breed club - they are purebred dogs. I can promise you that the "best" breeders are ethical. Now, being "best" does not necessarily mean those who win a LOT - some are, some aren't. But "best" on my list are highly ethical and ALWAYS put the well-being of the dogs above their own personal gain. Others do not.

My friend, the equine vet, graduated from the Univ of PA Veterinary School, one of the top vet schools in the country, is a member of the Jockey Club and has been a Jockey Club Steward, has served on the Board of Overseers for the Univ of PA Vet School, and was named Warner Jones Horseman of the Year. One would be hard pressed to find a nicer, more ethical man. He bred Thoroughbred horses for many years. His father was the Racing Secretary at two major racetracks, and both his sons are in various aspects of the industry. I believe this man.

Of course, money is involved - it must be - it's a VERY expensive sport. Now if you are a card-caring PETA member, you will tell me I should not own a purebred dog, eat meat, wear leather, and that horse racing is no different than dog fighting. Not much room for discussion there, is there?

^^ Yes, horse racing IS a very expensive sport and the owners of the horses could well afford to put them out to pasture and let them live out their lives. Or at least have them humanely euthanized, instead of selling them to be mistreated and slaughtered just to squeeze a few more dollars out of them.

"One would be hard pressed to find a nicer, more ethical man. "

Okay. Next time you see him, ask him if he provided or administered performance enhancing drugs for horses. Or diuretics (used to drop weight but dangerous for their health).

Completely outside of any gambling/racing parameter, breeding requires *culling*. The animal that doesn't conform is eliminated, often by destroying that bred animal. There's nothing romantic about breeding livestock, whether the animal is bred for food, wool, racing, or to win a blue ribbon at a dog show.

Horse slaughter will exist....that is a fact, whether you like it or not. I am just saying it should be as humane as possible, and that means not shipping to Mexico.

The anti slaughter people would like to see a strict curtailing to breeding horses, and that is a pipe dream that isn't going to happen either.

I would like to see more of the ex race horses given a chance to go on and do something else, but that depends on the owners, and some do try to place them, but you can't regulate morality or responsibility, and often the owners do find homes for them, and sometimes the horses end up auctioned by their new owners and they end up in the slaughter pipeline anyway.

By the way, the breed of horse most shipped is the Quarter Horse, my favorite breed.

The indifference and abject cruelty humans treat our food animals with bothers me in such a deep way, that I can no longer eat meat.

I'm not saying that to start a word war here or to make anyone else feel bad - I'm just sharing what I've had to do in response to the way animals destined for our food source are treated. I can't be a part of it.

Those poor horses. Born only so that humans can make a profit off of them. Pushed to their limits, mistreated, and yet they still trust humans and seek out human company - only to end up in slaughter pens. It breaks my heart.

Having been involved with thoroughbred horse farms for 40+ years, I can tell you most of the horses who are withdrawn from racing are not slaughtered. Most of the fillies (females) will become broodmares, and some of the colts (males) with good bloodlines, who have won races will become studs. Geldings (neutered males) will often become riding horses.

Yes, most of us do love our horses, and we're devastated when we lose one , whether it's on the racetrack, or at home in a stall or paddock.

Horses love to run, and they're going to run, whether we want them to, or not. And, yes, some will break down. It's heart-breaking when it happens, and it's hard on everyone who's involved with that horse.

Having said all that, I will also say that I don't like racing. I don't like the things they do to these young horses, and I don't like the people that are just in it for the money and don't care about their animals.

Woodrose -The horses at the ranch I ride at are mostly Arabian. Several have had racing careers before ending up the ranch as schooling and endurance horses. They are turned out 24/7 except when they get too fat. Absolutely they love to run.

There is a somewhat new organization called the Retired Racehorse Program that has a goal of providing incentives to people to take take ex-race horses and train them for a second career. Through that program my wife acquired a young, easy-going thoroughbred that never showed any interest in winning a race. "I'll get to the finish line, but it's much less crowded way at the back of the pack" He was young, green, and didn't know much, but was bright and willing to learn, but most of all he was calm and level-headed, so she called him "Cool Cat"

Participants in the program get to select from 10 (?) different disciplines and start training the ex-race horse no soon than January 1, and then in October they hold a competition in each of the 10 different disciplines to see which horse is best at his/her new "job". My wife was training Cool Cat in Show Jumping, Show Hunting, and Fox Hunting, it was slow going at first because he didn't even really know much past the basics of walk, trot and canter, and had never jumped.

Then just a week before the October competition she was kicked by a boarder's horse and could barely walk. She found someone else to ride Cool Cat in the competition but she thinks she could have done better.

After she recovered and trained the horse more for another 6 months she sold him to a young rider in the area to use for fox hunting and hunter shows and the girl really loves him.