Agreed, can we see a larger area?

I will bring the furniture in through the back patio. There is a set of French doors (72") leading to the patio. I had originally considered putting the new master bath on the west wall of the new master bed room, but I can't get enough fall in the plumbing. The house is on a crawlspace. Now I'm planning on putting a large walk-in closet/dressing area on the west end of the new master bedroom.

You should of course hire professional help on this project.

In the meanwhile, let's hear your thoughts on this:

(wall thickness isn't indicated, proportions are approximate)

I like it.....it's a whole different look at things and that's what I was looking for.

What are your thoughts on either of these? I don't know how I feel about there being such a narrow corridor. It is just over 36" at the narrowest part. The option on the right would let me keep the window possible.

I think the entrance to the bathroom is preferable off the pasage, rather than from the main bedroom. It may open up more options to move it, but the separation would trump that for me.

About the corridor effect; best avoided I think. Particularly as there are two sinks, so the space will be used by two people simultaneously.

Another point to consider is visual weight and proportion. Where avoidable, you don't want to enter upon a huge shower, makes it feel like a small space.

Lastly, the space immediately infront of the shower and bath is frequently wet. So this is best in its own space, not in a spot you need to pass through much eg. the entrance.

In the plan I posted above. The toilet is near the bedroom. Do you think sounds will travel much in your space and be an issue? What's the walls built of?

Another idea. Doesn't have a separate make-up area, but consider having that in the bedroom or closet area

I am willing to accept the door either being off the passage or off the bedroom. I don't see that being an issue. As you stated it does offer some more options.

I also agree with you on the corridor effect being avoided. I was hoping that might be a way to keep the window unit. Not a deal breaker either way, but being able to keep some natural light and not incurring the cost of taking it out, would be a win-win.

The existing walls are drywall. I don't believe it would be an issue having the toilet next to the bedroom wall. I could add some soundproofing insulation to the walls and eliminate much of the noise.

One other thing worth mentioning is that we could probably get by on just a single vanity in the master bath. It is rare that two people are ever going to be using it at the same time, at least in my house.

I could swap the toilet and shower in both of my drawings and move the wet area to the other end. I usually don't like to open the door onto the toilet, though. What are your thoughts on that?

Where will the bed be, and will you have a dresser?

You don't need to, and shouldn't, remove all natural light and ventilation. You could move the window, some more cost but if it's possible, it's far better than a bathroom with no window. You can also have transom-type windows above the vanity if it goes there.

Whats the dimensions of the existing window, and the length of wall next to it?

Is this planned as your forever-home, and are you planning on aging-in-place features?

"I could swap the toilet and shower in both of my drawings and move the wet area to the other end. I usually don't like to open the door onto the toilet, though. What are your thoughts on that?"

Like you say, that gives the entry upon the toilet issue.

Also to be avoided where possible is entering upon a bathtub, or any obstruction you must immediately turn away from

Consider a trough sink on a longer vanity, for your needs.

Where will the bed be, and will you have a dresser?

Again, just my initial thoughts on where the bed will go. I'm not huge on having the windows in a closet, but may not be avoidable.

Whats the dimensions of the existing window, and the length of wall next to it?

I will have to confirm measurements

Is this planned as your forever-home, and are you planning on aging-in-place features?

This will most likely not be a forever home. We will move at some point in the next 4-6 years probably.

A trough sink might be a possibility. I'm not sure it would fit my wife's more traditional taste though. However it makes the space work, then so be it.

That's relatively soon, to be taking on a big bathroom reno. What do you currently have in the space?

There is currently nothing in the space where the new master bedroom would be. The area that is becoming two bathrooms is currently the master bath.

What are your thoughts on a wall of cupboards in place of a walk-in?

Not sure I'm game for that. I would prefer the privacy and storage offered with the walk-in.

I see. What prompted the decision to do the reno?

Will you have guests often? Are there issues in the current bathroom? Are you doing it for resale appeal?

As resale isn't far off, do consider general opinions, not only your requirements. Particularly with things that are difficult to change (eg bathtub vs shower, window vs none)

We do frequently have guests and it could also serve a regular bedroom with attached bath, were my thoughts.

The main reason for the reno, is updating a badly done 1990's reno done to a 1960's rancher. Resale appeal is the main driver. Most of the homes in the neighborhood are going thru transition and being updated. I have the experience and resources to handle the renovation.

I agree with keeping the resale aspect in mind and keeping overall appeal to a broader audience.

Aha makes sense then. Best to put in a double vanity too.

Ok back in some hours, I'm off to bed soon.

'til tomorrow, my pleasure :)

Hello there. Let's have your thoughts on something like this. I prefer the one on the right

If you went with a pocket door entry to the master bath from the hall you wouldn't have to worry about the door swinging into your legs while sitting on the toilet. And there's plenty of wall space to accommodate the pocket door.

In general or are you referring to one of the proposed layouts above?

I'd expect the door won't be swinging open when someone's using the loo...

And in any case you'd need a door stopper in a plan with the toilet behind the door.

I don't like pocket doors for wet spaces, and spaces where the door is intended to be closed when not in use. Also seals less well, from a sound and general separation perspective, than a swing door, so I don't recommend it in a bathroom.

Another idea. You might want to look at tubs and showers to see how much space they require. Where will you want your plumbing. What kind of shower doors do you want. Make sure you leave room to walk around in the bathroom.

A shower might be better in the top bathroom. My thinking is that even thought a toilet must have a minimum space of 30 inches, that will feel too tight in an alcove. You should have 32 inches which still might feel tight. Might be okay.

Your hallway seems constricted near your master bedroom.

I would make sure it is a little wider where it turns.

I wanted to send a quick note and say thank you to you all for the tips, thoughts, suggestions, etc. I am still struggling on the layout and trying to come to a compromise with my better half on fixtures to be included in the space. She is convinced beyond a doubt that she can't live without the makeup vanity and bathtub. I personally believe that adding everything will choke the space down to an uncomfortable size (option B).

My only two constraints that I am trying to hold to are keeping the existing window(s) and wall locations. Can they be moved? Yes, but I'd prefer not.

So, right now I'm down to two options that keep the windows/walls intact and get most/all of the items on the wish list. However, I feel the separation shown in Option B is unacceptable. Would love to hear some thoughts.......... Thanks.

I wanted to send a quick note and say thank you

It's a real pleasure!

She is convinced beyond a doubt that she can't live without the makeup vanity and bathtub

It certainly is possible to include it, there are a bunch of possibilties laid out above.

My only two constraints that I am trying to hold to are keeping the existing window(s) and wall locations.

I hear you, but a) I don't know where exactly the windows are in the plans, and b) it sometimes turns out to be less of an expense than anticipated, particularly if a window and frame can be romoved intact. Have you checked out the option fully?

So, right now I'm down to two options that keep the windows/walls intact and get most/all of the items on the wish list.

Sorry, can't say I find either optimal. 4'6" tub? And a crampy wet shower-tub-vannity spot. Entry upon a toilet, or upon the wet floor outside a shower, toilet in the furthest corner, tight 2'3" spot entry... the latter changes the perception of the entire space, and may well deter me as a buyer.

I'm sorry, I know it gets frustrating trying to fit it all in. But I think if it's worth doing at all, it's worth doing well.

It also gets confusing keeping track of it all. Do this. Take a sheet of paper, draw small sketches of each plan above. Underneath list all the pros and cons. Then decide what among that to prioritise. And consider resale.

We are set to start remodeling our master bath and the guest bath in about a month (one after the other). I, too, like to sit when doing make-up. I have overtaken the vanity area in the guest bath, but after the remodel, neither bathroom will have a designated spot for such. I'm buying a vanity/make-up table for the master bedroom. Maybe that could work for your wife, as well.

Again, thank you for everyone's honest opinions.

I have attached an updates sketch with the locations and sizes of the windows. Again, I can remove them if it becomes necessary, but trying to avoid it. The window and frame can be removed, intact and I have done this before, but the brick exterior will be hard to match. In the past I've been able to find matching materials, but have not been able to locate anything close to matching yet.

I have 100% nixed option B above. I agree the 2'-3" entry is ridiculous and not going to happen.

There are probably many more pros/cons than I am able to see with each of these. I did modify the toilet location in one the previous designs to reduce its visibility, which does help, although still may not be perfect. What pros/cons am I missing?

Hello again.

Knowing the window placement and size helps greatly.

Essentially, the shower can only be along the bottom wall, right wall, or the right side of the top wall, to avoid clashing with the window. I've come up with a few more ideas, that take this into account.

By the way, if you want a makeup area and you're ok with one sink, another option is to leave the plumbing in place for two sinks, aquire two vessel sinks, only instal one, and sell the other to the new owners when you sell. In the meanwhile, use that space as a makeup area.

Regarding the options you listed with pros and cons:

The guest bath with a tub next to the vanity as shown in A & B, I was thinking would be rather tight, but it would actually work.

I don't consider toilet placement in C & D a con though; it's a less-used bathroom, and not right upon the door in any case. But the tub there saves a bit of space. If you do that, I think the vanity area along the bottom wall, or left wall, works better.

option C of course mainly involves window alterations. Consdering it?

Option D, as I estimated, there'd be less than 3' where you indicate the shower. Would work if it does fit.

How goes, hungry tourist?

Hello again.

Alright, That's not too bad. The shower and vanity so close together being wet space would bother me, but otherwise I find it fine.

I'd prefer it the toilet and vanities switched, which is shown in the third of the options posted, reposted below. This allows a mirror over only one vanity, but I'd sacrifece that were I you. I quite like entering upon a vanity, seing as t's the most used part of a bathroom.

I know you want to avoid wall changes, but look into losing the notch into the bathroom, and straightening the hallway out. (as shown below) If it turns out that this is feasible, you could do option B with the vanities moved down.

Mmm I wouldn't recommend that route. You're planning to sell relatively soon. I would never buy a place with no shower in the master bath unless I had the time for a reno, and the price was low enough to allow it. Rather shower only, but certainly not tub only. Rather a single vanity, which I don't much recommend for resale, than no shower.

Going up to my previous comment "Hello again. Alright, That's not..."

What are your thoughts on that layout?

I agree. Symmetry would be preferrable there. Otherwise I like it, got some sense of separation between the various spaces.

Maybe consider a smaller shower, 3'x3'.

I have to be off now, but I'll think on this and be back.

I am going to jump in late here and suggest that if your wife prefers to sit doing her hair and make-up, she should have it in her master bath. I find standing on bathroom tile hard on my body. There are many physical reasons that some of us have this problem and it only makes sense to allow for it. Najeebah's idea of not installing the second sink is one option to consider, if you don't think your option D will work.

We just put a pocket sliding door on our only full bathroom and it is fine. Our motion-activated Panasonic bath fan takes out all of the steam, so our mirrors do not even get fogged, even in our 8.5' x 8' bath. The humidistat on the fan ensures that it runs as long as needed. We have an electric cove heater as our supplemental heat in the bathroom, so by keeping the door closed, we have a toasty bathroom all of the time. A sliding door is also easier to deal with when you widen the door to 36" for accessibility, like we did.

If you take the suggestion to eliminate the notch in the hall near the bedroom door, you can use a modified Plan D for the Master. Move the second vanity next to the make-up area, move the shower to where the toilet is, and enlarge it, and put the toilet where the notch was taken out. If you have 8 ft there, you will have 3 ft width for a toilet next to a 5 ft tub. Can you then do the guest bath in the configuration for Plan B, so that you don't need to move any windows? The mirror for the left side vanity in the master can hang in front of a window. The window also gives optimal light for make-up at the seating area in between the two sinks.

Hello again. I think a smaller shower may be your best option, like below:

Either that, or no bathtub, (can the one in the guest bath be used instead?) or sacrifycing symmetry at the window (tub next to double vanity, meeting at the centre of the window)