Alarmist BS straight out of 30’s propaganda films like Reefer Madness. If you need a glass of wine or puff of smoke to blame for your wayward tendencies, then lie to yourself. But don’t try that silliness with grown educated adults.

Is what they did legal? Honest question on my part, as I have no knowledge of where this occurred, and of the laws surrounding medical and recreational weed. In my area of the world, it is illegal so I would have reported them immediately. Totally separate issue from what I believe in or whether I think it’s right or wrong, or my personal opinion on how impaired I thought they were.

"As for the argument that because one cannot find workers that are sober, they will hire whoever they find regardless, it's just not a valid one."

printesa:

You have mischaracterized my argument. My argument is valid. Look it up, please.

Let's say you start Printesa's Residential Remodeling and you need to hire workers. There are highly paid union workers that can pass a drug test, but when you run the numbers, you see that if you pay them scale, your bids will be double those of your competitors, leaving you with no work and no profits.

You can hire lesser-paid non-union workers who cannot pass a drug test and deliver competitive bids that are profitable.

You must choose. As the contractors in the Remodeling magazine article discovered, you aren't getting low paid residential workers who can pass a drug test. It's not happening; the marketplace will not allow it.

In my twenties I briefly worked as a bank teller. Most of my coworkers were creative people doing it as a day job: actors, artists, a DJ. We never came to work high but I think most of us dabbled in our off time. We actually told on a manager who came to work drunk and he was fired. This is basic Golden Rule kind of stuff . I wouldn't want an impaired person handling my mortgage payment or paycheck so I didn't do that to others and neither did my coworkers. Now on the other hand if someone had hired the DJ to do the music for their wedding reception or gone to see the actor in a play.....there's a decent chance they would have smoked a joint beforehand......and would probably have delivered a better performance because of it.
The question is whether building work is creative or exacting or both. I'd personally be fine with a rasta tile guy who did beautiful work and smoked a joint at lunch but I want my electrician to be an uptight hardass who had nothing but coffee beforehand.
It's up to the OP what s/he wanted from this job.
And it's up to the business owner what they require from their workers.

Since weed has been legalized here it seems people have started to treat it like tobacco. When stopped at stoplights I'll occasionally smell it rolling out of the car next to us, last weekend it was someone walking through the campground every early morning waking me up for fear of a skunk. When smoking became more public I was horrified--intoxicants have never been my thing--but I admit that now I'm desensitized to it. Compared to the homeless and opioid epidemics, a pot smoking tradesman seems like a relative success.

Mentally trying and convicting someone who “smelled” of pot also begs the question how you know what it smells like? If you’re so goody two shoes?

And if they only smelled of it, and did a good job, how do you know they didn’t just visit the local Jamaican owned convenience store for a couple of coconut waters? How do you know that smelling of anything means “impairment”?

Does a glass of wine with lunch result in impairment? What about the 4 martini lunches of 1960, complete with the smokestacks of tobacco?

All anyone has any right to expect on any job is that good work is produced. The fact that they produced good work puts them 10 miles ahead of the fully sober hacks whose work gets constantly shown on here in the Help Disaster posts.

Better be sure that all of your remodels have pulled the proper permits, and satisfied the HOA requirements, and that there is no unlicensed firearm or friends’ loaned drugs in your medicine cabinet. And that you never speed and always use your turn signals. Because someone is definitely going to call you out on being a hypocrite.

And, if you aren’t a hypocrite, then it’s just possible that an uptight sad sack needs to ask for a hit next time. Because there will be a next time. Many, in fact.

Sophie, you can go ahead and hire those under the influence to do anything you want in your house..That doesn't mean that everyone who will not accept this is uneducated..You are known here for being rude, so I'm not offended by your attitude. There is nothing silly in expecting to have sober people on the job, regardless of what job might be.

Joseph, how did I mischaracterized your argument? You said that your cousin no smoke policy was quickly repealed.

As for hiring non-union workers, yes I did and none of them were ever high or drunk. Also they were paid well. As for the cost of a project, it's not that difficult to find out, on average, how much a project should cost. Yes, I got all kinds of bids and the lowest were always dropped since they were unreasonable low and the highest, if they were out of this world, they were also dropped. Unions are not what they used to be and that is true everywhere.

Sophie - I'm a goody two shoes and I've know what pot smells like since my freshman year in the dorm. Samondragon's OP was objective and sincere with a legit question.

Do you have to be a perfect person to have an opinion about what is right and wrong? Nope.

DYou can’t avoid hiring folks under the influence. That’s the real world. You won’t get any applicants. Read your local FB jobs board. The companies that drug test can’t find anyone. They beg. Snd all a responder will tell them is to “stop testing”. And that’s for pack and pickers in a warehouse through telemarketing, to every service sector job, and construction, and anything else.

And most hires do not smell of their influencer, and most are far from obvious. You’ll never know. Your waitress is drinking vodka, and your oil changer guy at the dealer has a nebulizer, and the hairdresser has a few scrips, and your accountant wears long sleeves for a reason.And your good buddy? The dentist who you golf with? He’s got several of those going on all at once.

And if you’d ever been around a construction job site, you’d know that the massive tobacco use that so freaks out the homeowner is what keeps the machine going. Also with some coffee and 5 hour energy, and the occasional toke. You’re incredibly naive to think otherwise.

samondragonI think you handled the situation appropriately. It sounds like you simply informed the manager of your observation when asked. Depending on my sense of the manager, I may have also just given him a heads up.

You seem like a sweet person, so for some comparison I'll offer this story of a truly irrational homeowner... There was a woman on here a while back who demanded her entire project for free because a worker used her toilet and, being from a different country, threw his used toilet tissue in her wastebasket. She raised such a crazed fuss that the business did it all for free. Insane.

It's likely that marijuana will eventually be legalized. Then market forces will take over.
Some bosses will accept it. Others won't. Some clients will accept it. Others won't. Some workers will abstain, based on their job description and sense of personal responsibility. Others won't.
The OP refusing to leave a good review and telling the boss was the market at work. It's the OP's money and the OP gets to decide. Now it's up to the boss to decide if it matters and if it outweighs the possibly high quality work these workers might be doing. That is also the market at work.
The market regulates what the government doesn't and it sorts things out eventually.

This is going to be a major issue here in Canada as they decriminalize cannabis for recreational use in about a month from now. In workplace situations this is being treated similar to the use of alcohol. I'm surprised that some would take the attitude that as long as the work is fine then what's the issue. Just wondering if they would feel the same about a drunk driver, as long as you got home alive then what's the issue.

Sophie, I don't know where you live, but the people I know are not under the influence at work. Again, during their personal time, they can do whatever they want...don't care. As for the excuse that one cannot find workers that are sober at work, sorry, that is just an excuse. There are plenty who don't and willing to work.

kelli, alcohol is legal that doesn't mean that one can come drunk at work

See my earlier comment: I once worked at a job where I and my coworkers got a manager fired for coming in drunk only once. That was a job at a bank where one wrong digit meant a person's wire transfer went in to the wrong bank account instead of helping their grandma buy groceries. There isn't much of an acceptable margin of error in banking.
Now for a person working at a restaurant bussing tables, a glass of wine on their lunch break is a totally different story. A person running an antiques shop can keep a flask in the back if they feel like it. There isn't going to be an urgent majolica emergency at an antiques shop.
This is what I mean by the market sorting things out.
In some jobs it will matter. In other jobs it won't. This will be up to the business owners and clients to decide in each industry. And the OP had every right to let a business owner know she was unhappy.
I agree with Sophie that many of these comments are veering in to "Reefer Madness" territory. Marijuana does not make adults hit on a 13 year old daughter of their client as postulated by one of the commenters. An adult who is attracted to children has a serious defect. Marijuana does not cause that, nor does it lead normal people to do things like that.
You can blame marijuana for the cashier at Taco Bell forgetting one of your burritos at 1 AM. You can't blame it for child molesters.

Some people would rather remain in a clueless insulated bubble.

The 16% of Americans who smoke cigarettes? 14% of them are blue collar trades. That’s not the only substance that they partake of regularly either.

The 20% of Americans under 30 who use pot regularly? All education brackets, and only slightly skewed to the lower income levels. In 10 years, when the young people take over, social change and acceptance will be rapid.

If it were legal tomorrow here, it wouldn’t increase the zero amount I use one single bit. The use process is terrible, it stinks, and a half a glass of wine gives a better buzz.

But there is zero reason to fill our prisons with non violent people and give them a felony record just because some stick up the orifice Hooverite from way back had it classed as Schedule 1. That was a crime.

And narcing out people who use it and are not impaired is a sign of another busybody that needs a better hobby.

I'm surprised by the complacency some have regarding this issue. Most, if not all laws decriminalizing the use of Cannabis specifically state that it is only applicable for "Personal Recreational Use". The workplace is not a "Personal Recreational Environment". I am not against anyone wishing to use Cannabis, but just like alcohol or any other so called recreational drug, it does not belong in the workplace.

"Under the influence" is broader than marijuana. It is any substance, legal or illegal, that has the ability to influence and/or alter one's ability to reason and perform in a safe and normal manner. Most substances, whether it be alcohol or drugs, do lower normal human inhibitions and people do and or say things they might not otherwise. It can be prescription drugs that one is taking legally (not purchased on the black market). It can be alcohol, which is legal. It is not about hysteria over marijuana. This is a legal employment issue and about the position an employer is potentially put in. It is the legal obligation of an employer to make sure that an employee is operating in a safe manner where they cannot hurt themselves or others and they cannot damage the property of others. Once an employer is aware of substance abuse (regardless of whether it is alcohol or drugs), they are negligent if they do nothing and they face serious fines from OSHA as well as potential litigation if anything happens. We have had serious discussions with our insurance providers and they will not cover the damage or cover litigation if anything happens and we had the information to stop it and did nothing. No individual running a serious business would put themselves, their family and their livelihood in that position. I don't give a flip what someone does on their own time.

We would never allow anyone to remain on our job site if we became aware they were under the influence of any substance that impaired their ability. Our client's appreciate it and express that frequently. They know that we are professional, serious business people and that we respect them and their property. Before contracting, most of our clients want to know about the subs and whether there are background checks (which we can't legally do) and how we manage the workers coming on and off the site. Maybe because we are in a more upscale market. Most business, that are not fly by night operations, have a zero tolerance substance abuse policy. It has nothing to do with which substance it is or whether it is legal or not.

The OP was right to let the business owner know what happened in her home and no one should have to tolerate what they believe to be inappropriate behavior.

Mentally trying and convicting someone who “smelled” of pot also begs the question how you know what it smells like? If you’re so goody two shoes?

The same way I know how cigarette smoke smells, and never smoked one in my life. You can't be serious with that comment, you can make your point without performing mental gymnastics.

I probably would have done the same thing u did, and I’m happy to read that it turned out well for u. But if They got fired over the review u gave then... oh well! I wouldn’t lose any sleep over it, Afterall the manager Did ask for a review!

IMO if u play on the job, then u may very well have to pay..

:)

When I first read this "Workers Under Influence" I thought this was about someone showing up to do the work under influence and was throwing off the job that would make some sense for a discussion.

To the original poster You don't feel any guilt allowing someone under the influence perform work in your home?

When you smell the workers reeking of weed and when you allowed them to do the work... Did you pray that they will do a good job? Did you pray they will not damage anything else, or perhaps cutting themself on the saw and bleeding in your kitchen?

After the work was done and you saw they did a good job... did you take a deep breath of relieve and said "great job", and the minute they packed up and out the door, you called their boss and complained?

Yes, nobody should be showing up to work under influence of any kind and they're 100% guilty, but if you know it and you allow them to perform work, you just as guilty as they're...

I'm the original poster. I loved, loved, loved everyone's comments. Here's a bit of clarification. The issue with the MJ smoking tiler happened about a year ago so you can see that it still bothers me to some extent...bothers me in a philosophical way, raising questions & provoking thought. For those who CAREFULLY read my posting, I did mention I haven't a problem with MJ use & agree that it can sustain a creative process. I was a young teenager during the late 60's & hardly an innocent bystander during that era; raised in a liberal household & continue to be left of center on almost everything. My late husband smoked medical MJ from time to time to counteract the symptoms of MS. To those who referred to me as "priggish", you clearly don't know me. On the other hand, I am a medical professional & I do know the metabolites of THC have psychoactive properties. When I am dealing with patients, I won't even take a cold remedy. I think tiling is one of those professions that requires multiple skills; part science, part art. I was willing to give this tiler a chance as he had received good reviews & I saw photographs of his previous work. I WAS concerned about safety issues & even more worried he would drift off & quality would decline. I did monitor him from a distance. At the end of the job, I thought it seemed fine...small areas of imperfection but acceptable. Later, I noticed more defects but not enough to cause a fuss. It wasn't until the next day when the owner of the tile shop called me to review the project. I sent him photos of the backsplash & he deemed it worthy enough to visit my home, staying an hour or two to correct some minor issues with the grouting. This is when I told the owner about the MJ use. For those who asked, I did not write or post any negative reviews, simply a conversation with the owner. He eventually spoke with the tiler who actually denied being a MJ smoker & said assistant tiler was the culprit. She was smoking while they were driving back from the supply store. So, the question still remains what would other people do? Did I handle it appropriately? All's well that ends well? Blah, blah, blah. Oh well, time to move on to a new dilemma...if the head of the free world does not see there are important papers missing from his desk, is it time to crash the White House with farm implements & tiki torches & drag that man out the window?

"Oh well, time to move on to a new dilemma...if the head of the free world does not see there are important papers missing from his desk, is it time to crash the White House with farm implements & tiki torches & drag that man out the window?"

Where did this come from? I think you should consider a puff or two yourself... it might do you some good LOL

Loved your response, samondragon. I beg to differ on one thing. I'm sure the head of the free world notices when papers are missing from her desk. Angela Merkel doesn't overlook anything.

Right on sister!

" Oh well, time to move on to a new dilemma...if the head of the free world does not see there are important papers missing from his desk, is it time to crash the White House with farm implements & tiki torches & drag that man out the window? "

Where did that come from? It looks like you could use a few puffs yourself, it might do you some good. -:)

Zero tolerance does not equate to 1950’s prig. I pay the insurance premium and no one under the influence of anything is allowed on the premises (or to leave the premises). No need to defend; my house; my rules.

The use of offensive names is immature at best. Ignorant, mean-spirited, abusive also come to mind.

Lol Grover. Brilliant!!

GN Builders LLC...Ha! So the only way for many of us to "accept" this man as president, & presidential, is to get high?

We always wondered what it might be like if a business man/woman runs the country instead of a politician. Now we know.

I've read every comment made towards my original posting, thoroughly intrigued by peoples' thoughts & what I can learn from them, expand my horizons. Houzz is a design web site not a political forum & I made the comment about Trump as, in the big picture, my backsplash & the blunt smoking tiler who installed it, amounts to a hill of beans in the big picture of our current situation.

Thanks to all who offered their input. I heard from homeowners, construction companies & design firms...wish there was more commentary from the skilled craftsmen.

Wait a minute...GN Builders...wasn't that you who tailgated me with your oversized pick-up even though I was driving 30 miles over the speed limit in the right lane? When you passed me you mouthed, "you need to get laid"! Yep folks, smoke a dubie & all is right with the world. That woman driver in front of you? Get her laid & she'll be pulling that cute little Mazda Miata off the road & back home where she belongs.

samondragon : Why did you feel it necessary to drag politics into this discussion? You couldn't leave it alone could you? I was enjoying this lively discussion which, although skirting a political issue, deftly avoided being confrontational. How sad it has been degraded.

The issue here is, unless you live in a state where RECREATIONAL marijuana use is legal, then it is AGAINST THE LAW. Doesn't matter if it's pot, or any other drug. Would you want someone there if they were high on pain pills, or meth, or cocaine? Or drunk? My full time job is with a police department narcotics unit (not a officer). You don't realize that today's pot is so much stronger and different than it was in the 1960s. And laced with all kinds of stuff. And usually, if they do pot, they do other stuff as well. Not always, but in most cases when there's a bust, it's pot, and pills and crack too. All the same people. Don't forget that they get behind the wheel under the influence and could kill someone in an accident. I say err on the side of caution and don't have any part of it.

"You don't realize that today's pot is so much stronger and different than it was in the 1960s."

That's for sure. We smoked some real garbage back in the day.

"And laced with all kinds of stuff."

Back in the day, maybe. You'd never get away with selling contaminated weed these days.

"And usually, if they do pot, they do other stuff as well."

Yes. I drink.

"Wait a minute...GN Builders...wasn't that you who tailgated me with your oversized pick-up even though I was driving 30 miles over the speed limit in the right lane? When you passed me you mouthed, "you need to get laid"! Yep folks, smoke a dubie & all is right with the world. That woman driver in front of you? Get her laid & she'll be pulling that cute little Mazda Miata off the road & back home where she belongs."

You got some imagination... Was the worker under influence was one of your imaginations also since it came to you a year later?

I would like to try what you been puffin over there...Why don't you share your secret with everyone :-)

the narc agents find "contaminated" stuff all the time. That's what kills people. And the fake stuff. It happens. The dealers and manufacturers try to come up with "designer" drugs so they can get more money. That's the problem with a lot of people -- they don't think it's a serious problem. They just think it's "a little dope". But it's not just the person abusing the drug - I see how it affects families, friends, co-workers. Even if it was just about one person smoking a little dope -- where does he get it? Does he owe money to his dealer? If so, is that dealer fed up and going to come after him - in your house that he's doing work on? And what does that say about the abuser if he cannot NOT take drugs long enough to finish up a job? I don't want an addict in my house.

This is not a case of "I smoke pot on the weekends, away from my job, in my own house" issue. Once you take it to someone else's property, it is not just an individual seeking to relax.

You could have always asked them to share ;)

People THINKING they do a better job under the influence and ACTUALLY doing a better job are two different things.

Do as you wish on your free time not when your hired to do a job. You pay for quality work not to risk it on some bozo who cant control his or her habit or addiction for 8 hrs.

OP you were right and yes, you had the right to be upset. Whats next hey the school bus driver feels less nervous and the did it 5 min before their shift.

I live in CA legal Pot was the biggest mistake ever made especially without the infrastructure in place to test and regulate it.

My kids come home and see their teachers vaping in between classes. They know at the age of 11 what it smells like as we cant go into ANY public park without seeing or smelling it.

I wouldn't drink a beer in public keep your habits to yourself.

I smoke pot all the time, its legal here. But I wait till after work, not before or during. Interesting post for sure.

smiley, how can you stand the smell of it? To me, it smells like a skunk

I guess you have to develop a taste for it, really you want to vape it, very little smell, no combustion, none of the unpleasant parts like... huh now I am really getting off track.

I see..I was just curious, not that I would ever try it, just wanted to see from the user's perspective

I agree with printesa ..I feel it is very disrespectful for workers to enter a home smelling of weed! It smells like funky skunk! Rude too! Once,I had drywallers smoking weed in my home . I was very offended. People should wait until after work to smoke weed, cigars and cigarettes!

Anyone who needs to either drink alcohol or smoke pot before they can perform their job has a drug problem. The behaviour is unacceptable, it doesn't matter if you're a teacher, construction worker or a retail sales clerk. Just because something is legal to consume does not make it appropriate at work (or driving home from work!).

Recreational is on your time away from work...can we just move on to bad kitchens, wonky entryways, serious construction mistakes and color bashing?

LOL on Chis's self portrait.

I'm having some windows replaced in my Mother's house, interviewing prospective companies. I hope I have better luck this time, someone who comes to work under the influence of a work ethic.

I think I'm in agreement with the following: being high doesn't always improve your skills or creativity; if you are unable to stop using drugs (alcohol, etc) to go to work, then this is something more than casual use; yes, it DOES smell...it was on their clothing & drop cloths. The NEXT day my children came home & asked who was smoking weed.

I do plan to change the subject. My next post will be "need help with color choices; can't decide between Disagreeable Gray, Disagreeable Grey & Disagreeable Greige".

That's a wrap.