I'm amazed it got through your customs... can anyone just send plants around like that?..

Marlorena,

Not legally, unless they are claimed at customs and inspected and there is a Phyosanitary Certificate and the plants are quarantined for a few years, a certain distance from all the other plants on the property of the person who imported it etc. and inspected by officials during the quarantine period etc. I know people who have imported plants legally and that's what they had to do. There are different rules depending on if its agricultural, just fruits and vegetables with no plant material, ornamentals, or seeds. The details can be found here for import and export.

https://www.aphis.usda.gov/aphis/ourfocus/planthealth/sa_export/sa_forms/ct_export_certificates_forms

Of course, some things are just sent by people who don't know etc. The fines can be quite hefty if caught. I have heard of a lot of people unknowingly ordering things online that they didnt know was coming from another country and it was seized by Inspectors and the buyers were sent a notice and warning. Like I said, some do squeak by and sometimes unscrupulous sellers will not claim stuff as plants hoping they will not be caught and inspected etc.

Some sellers dont care if you get your stuff seized and they will allow you to order without proper documentation and will not refund your money so people need to be careful when ordering online.

The FL News is always reporting stories of what all they find seized by customs in Miami like a bunch of baby cobras or parrots stuffed into a pipe or something. Im sure plenty of stuff gets through, maybe more than gets found. Its pretty interesting some of the things they find and how people tried to smuggle it. I think there is a TV show about it now lol.

..thanks sjn... I just wouldn't want to be the one to import RRD here... although I don't know if that's possible...

Yeah. I found out afterwards that this shipment I'm referring to did not check all the boxes in terms of being done properly. But.... they arrived, and I wasn't going to complain. My friend was trying to do something nice for me. Even though I want Carolyn Knight and Queen Anne pretty badly, I'm just going to have to do without them if David Austin isn't going to offer them for sale here in the USA. I try not to look at those photos of Carolyn Knight so I won't get tempted.

Maybe my Summer Song will sport on its own if I'm lucky

On a daily basis I drive by a house painted a mustard-y color with a rose that looks very much like this one growing in an area very close to the house. The two colors look AMAZING together.

HU-49270469186 , I lived in SF Vistation Valley , any chance I got to see this rose ? what is the smell like.

It has quite a few buds on it now. Should bloom in about 7-14 days. (Hope the unexpected rain doesn't spoil the blooms.) I will post some photos of the plant and flowers when it blooms. i forget what the scent is like, but it is strong. I'll post soon with photos.

Here is a photo of the Summer Song rose. The shrub is about 3.5 feet tall by 3 or 3.5 feet wide. I'll try to take another photo when more of the buds open.

Beautiful flowers. the-bustopher Do you still own a Kordes Brillant? Thats my favorite and its disappeared from the market.

I actually have 4 Kordes Brillants. I just got another one last year from Roses Unlimited in South Carolina. They still list it in their shrub list as Brilliant, the English spelling. Other Kordes roses in the same basic color are the climber Salita and the small-flowered grandiflora Prominent. You might want to contact Roses Unlimited. Good luck.

HU-30601032, the_bustopher if you guys have plants or cuttings of summer song that you’re willing to share please let me know. I really hate to ask, but I’ve been trying to purchase for 2 years now with no luck. I would love to have one in my garden and it’s just Sad that it can’t be found anywhere.

I have tried this rose twice in years past when it could be purchased. I gave it the best of care - where other roses thrived in same conditions, this one did not. It was a shrimpy plant, seemed to hate my east Texas conditions. David Austin roses commented, when I called the Tyler, Tx. office about it, what was wrong with it and why it wasnt sold here anymore [color was so pretty I would have stupidly tried it again] and was told that it did not thrive here at all and was no longer being sold in the US. From the horse's mouth so to speak - I concluded that, in spite of the fact I cant buy it here, there are other roses that do thrive and I will content myself with those. Good luck in your search - hope you are able to acquire cuttings, but I would guess cuttings would do even worse than the shrimpy bare root roses I tried to grow. You might do a search on roses of a similar color that can be grown here. One I recently purchased and like very much is Ring of Fire. Good luck!

Judith

My experience with Summer Song is the same as Judith's and so many others who have tried this rose and posted their results on so many other threads on the Houzz/GW Rose and Antique Rose forums over the years. I was able to get a Summer Song plant that was grafted onto Rosa multiflora from a very generous trader from Ohio who purchased 2 of them and neither was doing well in her climate. The plant produces thin, lanky shoots with a few stunningly beautiful flowers. You would think that the plant would grow larger and stronger over time, but it doesn't. I have tried taking cuttings and they root relatively easiliy. I planted the rooted cuttings in deep, well-drained soil where it got daily water from an automatic drip system. The cuttings grew well for a while as did all the other rooted cutting plants and produced some nice flowers in spring. When we hit triple digit temperatures, all the other rooted cutting plants continued to grow and flower well, but not SS. It stopped growing and by the end of last summer all the top growth had died. However, in late winter, new shoots emerged from the ground and produced several flushes of flowers in spring. So I guess you can conclude that SS is not fond of high temperatures, especially grown on its own roots. The grafted plant doesn't die to the ground in high temperatures; rather it just stops growing and shuts down.

I was able to obtain a rooted band of a miniature climber called 'Pink Cloud' that was bred by the late, great rose breeder Ralph Moore, from Kim Rupert. Kim has worked with 'Pink Cloud' as a rootstock for number of years and believes it is particularly good for use by amatuers as is receptive to grafting for most of the year, unlike most other rootstocks. Also, it has a much thicker cambium layer that makes it easier for non-professional grafters to successful make grafted plants. You can also graft scions onto branches of the mother plant while still attached to the plan. And if you want to produce a 'tree rose', he has found this variety can be used as the rootstock and the 'trunk'. I am going to try grafting scions of Summer Song onto Pink Cloud to see if it can grow better on it than on its own roots or R. multiflora.

I now have Summer Song and really wanted it badly myself only because someone took the time to send me a plant. I don't think that it will do any better for you than it has done for anyone else, but you never know. I do not believe that this rose will ever be commercially available in North America. And so Raoul, if you really want it, please send me at my email account at this website. Perhaps we can trade cuttings. And if you don't have anything that I am interested in, I will send it to you for postage.

John

Wait. @oldrosarian - you have a Summer Song in the PNW???? (edit: re read and see that you say it went out - where did you find it to begin with?) I'm in the PNW and would very much like to try my hand with Summer Song because I don't take good advice very well. You don't also happen to have Delbard's La Rose des 4 Vents (Simply Stunning in Australia) do you? While we're discussing unicorn roses.

"I was able to obtain a rooted band of a miniature climber called 'Pink Cloud' that was bred by the late, great rose breeder Ralph Moore, from Kim Rupert. Kim has worked with 'Pink Cloud' as a rootstock for number of years and believes it is particularly good for use by amatuers as is receptive to grafting for most of the year, unlike most other rootstocks."

John, Are you talking about Pink Cloud the flowered double climber or Pink Clouds the single small flowered rose? I thought it was Pink Clouds that was being used as rootstock.

https://www.helpmefind.com/rose/l.php?l=2.21014.0

I have a Pink Clouds rose and a Fortuniana rose. I got them both as rooted cuttings from the lovely generous Blue Girl (the person not the rose lol). Pink Clouds is much much more vigorous here than Fortuniana is, flowers more, requires less water, and is more disease free.

Fort is supposed to be the holy grail rootstock for FL but now I wonder.

Hi sultry,

I just looked it up and now see that 'Pink CloudS' with an 's' on the end is the rose that I was referring to.. Thanks for pointing that out, as there is a rose with a similar name without the 's'. My specimen is now quite large and I'm going to start playing with it in spring. R. fortuniana is supposed to be resistant to nematodes, which can be a problem in some areas in the south. I don't know how it would stand up to nematodes. But if your PCs is growing vigorously in your garden, either there are no nematodes there (or perhaps the population there is not high enough to affect the growth yet) OR it may be nematode resistant. It is possible that Malcom Manners may know if PCs is resistant to nematodes.

Merry Christmas to you!

John

That is interesting about Pink Clouds. I dont mind trying but I wonder who sells it on that rootstock ? I meant which nursery if that makes it easier.

I am not sure if Burling does. If anyone does she would.

I vaguely recall UC Davis selling stock of pink clouds.

Jin, just get the Pink Clouds rose on its own roots and try that. I grow it espaliered on a fence. Its a small single pink flower but cheerful and the bees love it.

Amazing that David Austin is so well known across the pond. I saw tons reduced in my fav gc! The latest craze is Olivia which has been named after David Austin's granddaughter.

Does anyone know where I can get Summer Song in the US now? Thank you

I thought I remember seeing it listed atFreedom Gardens, but I might be confusing it with Summer Wine. Anyway, it doesn't hurt to send an email asking Peter about it. He may have to custom propogate if he does though.

John - wondering if you were able to successfully work with Summer Song on the graft of Pink Cloud? I loved that rose in the garden in England (2018). When I asked about it, I was told it didn't do well in N. America, so would not be sold her. I didn't know it *had* been sold here previously -- I'd assumed it didn't trial well! Anyway -- it was gorgeous and looked healthy in Shropshire!

Vaporvac- Thanks a lot. I’ll check it out.

Hi, I am wondering if you still have your summer song? Can I have a cutting from you?

I don't know much about patents, it would be wonderful if one of the nurseries like Freedom could propagate Summer Song. I find roses that are said to do poorly do really well here.

@the_bustopher z6 MO, @oldrosarian if you have a rooted cuttings of summer song and Kordes Brilliant or any other varieties, I’m willing to buy from you. I’m not able to find these roses online and ln my local nurseries. I have an own root Falstaff & Heritage rose of David Austin if you prefer to do an exchange. And i also have Summer Romance which is very fragrant and roots easily for me.

unfortunately the old Rosarian passed a couple of years ago. HMF shows AngelGardens carrying Brilliant.

Vaporvac Z6-OhioRiverValley That is sad news about Old Rosarian. I wish I could have met her in person. I remember making a really naive comment about Paul Ricault and she corrected me.

I agree. I have loved to meet so many that are no longer here. Her pictures are still available if you search google.

@Vaporvac Z6-OhioRiverValley thanks for the intormation. Very sad to hear about old rosarian.

berrypiez6b All David Austin's roses are results of years of hard work which requires money, efforts, and financial outlay. Just watering the roses costs money!

For what its worth, Peter Schneider of FreedomGardens describes Versignyas as a French Summer Song.

Wow, thanks for that wonderful nugget of information !!! I never would have discovered it on my own.

Thank you for taking the time to write Vaporvac Z6-OhioRiverValley, I'm so grateful for the people on this forum that help each other. Missing Old Rosarian is bringing tears to my eyes now.

I don't know if anyone else has tried it, but I have J&P's Double Easy Orange, a floribunda that has roughly orange sherbet-colored flowers that have old garden rose form when they are not being fried in our heat. It is certainly an alternative to Summer Song.

Double Easy Orange is a strikingly beautiful rose in Hoang Ton's video. What do you think of the fragrance ?

I love the look of Double Easy Orange, especially as Hoang Ton showed us on his video. I would have ordered this rose last March if J&P could have shipped it to Idaho (they were not allowed to ship their roses into Idaho). I saw later the ban was lifted and now we Idahoans can order from J&P. That ban lasted for several years, and J&P wouldn't share why Idaho banned their roses. Diane

Oh boy, I wonder if Edwards can ship to N Idaho too - then again, I would be in BIG trouble.

Oh, boy! Just be discreet and not openly talking about it on a forum (you see, there is a private message area here). We all know how expensive some plants are!! Borderline on being insane.I saw a clematis Viennetta and promptly lost my self-control. Well, nearly! I phoned around and the cheapest was £20.99. Well, I will have to go around all nurseries during summer holiday to visit all the reduced counters in POSH nurseries. That was how I bought my clematis Sieboldii and Avant Garde.

Ah, SummerSong is pretty rubbish in the UK too. Mine is ancient (but pitiful). I really ought to toss it but it produces half a dozen really quite startlingly beautiful blooms every year. I cut them immediately and bring them home for close-up adoration without the distraction of spindly canes and rare leaves. It sulks underneath a sorbus cashmeriana, in a sadly overcrowded bed so I guess I am also culpable for it's diminished performance. I keep it because it is such a delicious colour...but I wouldn't search it out again.

Why not take cuttings? It's easy and this year's weather in the UK has been diabolical. Tons of my lovely camellias died. Half of all the cornus leaves are brown.

Summer Song is still under patent. Diane

I thought so.

On a Rose Geek video she saw Summer Song first hand in David Austin's garden. It sure was flourishing there.

Ha ha, my allotment is a far cry from David Austin's Garden. Although I have much better luck with the simpler wildling types such as r.californicae, the spins, the likes of r.helenae and my beloved Darlow's Enigma (the size of a small tree) and just about any once flowering ramblers...so not all is doom and gloom.

For me, Summer Song has one of the most amazing scents and colors. Just gorgeous. In my Western European garden, it is a spindly plant, gangly, but thriving. It was purchased from David Austin EU. In its habit, it reminds me a bit of a less vigorous Claire Austin. It just shoots out canes in different directions, and every which way, and is happiest thus. It is not just growing perfectly upright, like some of its neighbors in the same bed (Olivia, for example). It does not get to be anywhere as large as Claire Austin. And it would work in smaller space. It really does not like the repeated 32-35 degree celsius heatwaves this summer, which are exceptional in this climate, and hopefully will not become the new norm. Before I moved it, it was in a pot on the patio (afternoon sun). In that spot, blooms would crinkle and wilt in the sun on the same day they opened. This was not a question of watering and other roses are doing fine there, so it is perhaps more heat sensitive than most. So it had to be moved from a pot on the patio to a shadier spot between other plants where the sun is not as strong. The sun still hits it, but the ground is just a bit fresher and cooler in its new spot. It is also between other roses, which compensates for its lack of bushiness. As the DA Rose Geek video was mentioned above, I seemed to recall her mentioning that the plants were often planted in clusters of more than one bush at DA to give them a fuller look, so that might explain why it looked fuller in that clip. In its first year in my garden, Summer song probably had a handful of blooms in two small flushes. But as it was healthy, had zero dieback, and had just a color like no other--this rich, vibrant pinkish dark orange--it stayed on for year two. It now has far more blooms than in its first year, and lovely leaves. It is not as prolific as, say Royal Jubilee Mary Rose, both of whom, starting in their first year, were almost continuous bloomers. On Summer Song, in its second summer, there is almost always a bud if not a flower, and it did have a good first flush of 5-10 flowers, so it is really doing quite well. And might have been even more impressive if the poor thing hadn't been moved this summer. But it seemed to rally from that quickly, perhaps the relief of being some place cooler. The fragrance is also magnificient. Not the typical David Austin myrrh sent but very sweet, And it's one of the better fragrances, I would say. Most roses really come into their own in their third year, so I imagine, it will keep improving with age in this climate, which is usually moderate in both summer and winter, especially when compared to many parts of the US.

I finally got my Double Easy Orange in April. It's a little bloom machine, and is on its third flush right through our horrible heat. It's currently 102F at seven o'clock. Another orange rose I love is the Kordes rose, Orangerie. It's available in Europe and Australia. The US patent was approved several years ago, but it hasn't showed up the the US. Do these companies think we dislike orange roses? They must think we US rose growers don't have the couths to appreciate the finer points of orange. Diane