Can install hard wood over a cement backer board?
5 years ago
Hi guys! Welcome to summer diy renovations!
Today I started ripping up carpets and tore out the ugly 90s tile that was in our entryway for our June 7 floor installation. However, it looks like under the tile was a cement backer board. It is flush with the wooden subfloor.
I was going to install engineered hardwood using the staples for the entire floor (including the part that still has carpet on it in the picture).
If I take the cement backer board out, then my subfloors are uneven. If I leave it in, I can't use staples for the hardwood floors like I'm supposed to and it's super chunked out and uneven rom the tile removal.
What would you do? What should I do?
Let me know if you need a different picture!
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Comments (8)
5 years ago- 5 years ago
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Supervising the experts - backer board install
Comments (3)Sarah, the other kids are pretty much spot-on. First, the gap between the framing and the tub flange: When the cement board goes on, the face of the cement board needs to at least be even with, or even slightly proud of, the tub flange. What you want is for the cement board to be held slightly above the lip of the tub flange. The tile will hang past the bottom of the cement board, it'll go over the tub flange, and be held just off the tub deck. So: Installing the tub...I'd look at the manufacturer's installation instructions and make sure the tub was properly set. Ledger board? No ledger board? Cast iron or plastic/acrylic/fiberglass? Some get set in mortar beds, some just get adhered to the floor with construction adhesive. But also check out the detail for fastening the tub flange to the wall framing. For the barrier behind the cement board, use either horizontally lapped tar paper, or 6-mil polyethylene plastic sheeting. For a topical barrier (should you go that route instead), you can use roll-ons like Hydroban or RedGard, or a sheet membrane like Kerdi, which dsegn mentioned. FWIW, you may as well read up on the installation instructions for the hardie board. The gap between framing and the tub flange could create problems. Excessive tub movement, "creaking" sounds when weight is shifted in the tub, cracking of the flange, etc. So yes, your idea to furr out the studs is right on the money, make sure the gap gets filed in so there is proper contact between the tub flange and the wall framing. Do not let them hang the hardie on the studs and float it over the face of the tub flange, so you end up with an air gap between the hardie and the stud down by the tub flange. That "kick out" will throw your tiling off and could cause integrity problems with the wall down the road....See MoreDitra over cement board
Comments (18)Davidro, Remember, they addressed the springiness of the joists by adding a support beam. But they still need to address the springiness of the subfloor between the joists, since all there is right now is a single layer of 3/4" material covered with cement board. That's not sufficient to tile over. To a certain extent Ditra can work for "springiness". You can tile on Ditra that is installed over a single layer of 3/4" subfloor. If using just cement board, you'd need a minimum of 1-1/8" of ply, then cement board, then tile. The Ditra acts as a shock absorber of sorts to not transfer minor floor movement of the thinner 3/4" subfloor to the tile. Cement board translates all movement, thus the need for a stronger and less flexible, and thus thicker, subfloor/underlayment system beneath the tile over just cement board. There are other products out there beside Ditra, but Ditra is readily available and easy to use DIY, there is good tech support for pros and DIYers from Schluter, they have a good distribution chain making it available in supply houses as well as box stores, and Schluter offers a full product line that can cross over from one application to the next. And the product performs as advertised. All that contributes to why I use it myself and why I mention it in my posts. Davidro, if you have another product besides Ditra to recommend, then by all means recommend it. I'm always willing to pick up new ideas. Weedy, Going back a bit, if you can validate that the floor joist size, span, and on-center spacing, as well as the subfloor thickness all meet Ditra specs, that the subfloor is in good shape (not punky) and that the cement board is properly installed over the subfloor, then sure, you can Ditra right over the cement board. Best, Mongo...See More3/4 T&G wood over backer board, concrete
Comments (3)Invented installs can be risky. I once recommended a customer use cementious backer panels to inexpensively raise the level of a room prior to installing a laminate floating floor and it worked perfectly. The key to success with any floor installed over concrete is to maintain moisture vapor transmission from the slab at acceptable levels. If the recommendation was from an experienced floor person and this person knows about moisture vapor transmission and how to control it, then I would not dismiss the recommendation out of hand....See MoreNeed Help with Self-Leveling, Backer Board & Engineered Bamboo Floor
Comments (23)I suspect you will regret bamboo. I have stranded bamboo in a kitchen and I wouldn't put it in a bath. If you really don't have the money to truly fix the deflection, use a small mosaic tile, hexagon or penny-round will probably work best. Use a masonry board or a uncoupling membrane and then adhere the tiles with a flexible thin set. I prefer Laticrete 254, but if you have to do the big box store, Flex bond from Home Depot isn't bad. Then use a decent flexible grout. The Mapei flexcolor is a solid product. If your floor is flexing enough to break those tiles then you have much bigger problems. Eventually the grout might work loose but you should have quite a while before that becomes a real problem. ETA: Check my advice on the johnbridge forums if you would like. You can literally paste my advice to your problem over there and get opinions from professional tilers who will put their name and experience right there in their signature....See More- 5 years ago
- 5 years ago
Thank you so much! Removing that cement was no joke. We did that today and so. Much. Dust. Holy cow!
I'll go to home Depot to get the plywood. Can I lay it in the same pattern as the existing one or should I stagger it? I kind of pocked up the existing osb when removing the cement. :(
Thanks for your suggestion on pricing. I think you're right about not going cheap on the sub floors.
Not the best pic, since I forgot to take one after we vacuumed.
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