Will P. abies ‘pendula’ eventually grow vertical leader w/o staking?
Ive seen at least two weeping Norway spruce that appeared to be 30-40 (maybe more) feet tall, were growing vertically, and were not staked. This has been in the ground 5 years now and was always staked until last summer when I inadvertantly removed the stakes (used to be a dead car in front, since tree was slightly leaning, I had a string pulling on tree and tied to car, then had car towed and forget about this and down came the stakes....lucky I was using jute twine that had rotted enough to break and not nylon rope). I noticed that this years growth (leader) appears to be growing up. So......after a certain number of years of staking, does this essentially “train” the tree to grow up? It is the right tree and the leader appears to be growing more vertical with time. I hope this isnt a false alert. Thanks!
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Cutting back vigorous growing leaders (Picea & Abies)
Comments (35)Oh thanks to you both...the zone thing is really confusing especially out here in the land of the microclimates. We used to be 8b which never made sense to me, now are 9b which is much more realistic, but we do much better with the Sunset zones which take account of the proximity to the ocean, elevation, etc. I am in the milder part of 9b (I can even keep Bouganvillea going, it just freezes to the ground every 5-6 years) (I hate it - it is here because my husband likes it!) and we do have summer fog not infrequently as we are not far from the ocean. We are the opposite of the midwest in that our summers are dry (until the fog comes in) and our winters are humid. What we hear from the conifer aficionados out here is that even if you water using drip (which I do), the conifers need overhead water from time to time, especially in a heat wave. I have a big sprinkler that I move around periodically to give everything a shower. Keeps things cleaner, too, as we generally get no rain between April and October. Thanks all for your info. I have learned so much from this forum. Here is a link that might be useful: Form and Foliage...See MoreSources for selected Picea abies cultivars
Comments (6)And I found something caled 'Rothenburg' on one of the Coenosium pages. bboy: this 'Reflexa' name is confusing. Some sites describe it as you say, and that would be something that can't grow upright on its own. But Dave (dcsteg) is growing a couple (see his post, with pictures, under the topic "my $49 blue spruce weeper ID") and I found a place on-line--I can't get back to it now--that describes the tree Dave is growing: upright grower with branches curving upwards with weeping branchlets. I find all the contradictory descriptions of these cultivars very frustrating and confusing. Treelover: I will try Iseli--the local nursery here--Webbers--has been buying from them recently, so I will see what they can do for me. Redwing; I will try Gee farms--thanks for the reference. A nursery in WV has a couple of P. abies 'Pendula' trees for sale. They have been sitting there for two or three years now. The burlap has rotted away and they are rooted in the ground. They look really nice and are growing upright on their own. It is too late now--growth is well underway and they would have to be dug, but if they are still there and still growing upright, I will buy them early next spring. But what could they be? I understand many things are commonly sold as 'Pendula' including 'Inversa'. I guess I will never know what something like this actually is, specifically. But I have lots of room and want to grow as many of these things as I can find, maybe in multiples. --Spruce...See Moremore on staking weeping norway spruce
Comments (8)You know to plant or not to plant and when to plant is a decision that has to be made individually. We all have our different methods and free advice to give. As for me I don't leave them in the pots all summer to become more root bound with continued growth held in check because of the restricted environment it is being subjected to. The longer grown in this state the more compromised the conifer becomes over time. If put in the ground, planted properly, and cared for I have always experienced better results. I plant all growing season. Of course climate and even micro- climate plays a big part in success or failure and where you live should be taken into consideration. Transplanting is a different issue all together. Either Fall or early Spring is the only time to do this. 4-5 ft. trees do not need to be staked unless you are training them for vertical growth. Once you have a dominant leader then the need for staking is over. This is not to say it will grow a completely straight vertical trunk. It bends and twists on it's upward growth which is the nature of this conifer. Lateral growth will be substantial as the tree matures. I have two of them. One puts out twice as much lateral growth as the other. There seems to be no consensus on the true identity of this cultivar. It takes on so many forms mostly irregular, erratic, semi-prostrate, mounding, etc. Purchased in 1-2 year old grafts you can decide how you want them to grow. This conifer is sold in most Nursery's under the cultivar name as 'Pendula'. Correct cultivar name is 'Reflexa'. Get them in the ground and start enjoying. Always a great focal point conifer. Dave...See MoreMy questionable purchase: Picea Omorika Pendula Bruns
Comments (27)This is a way I would do it. I am sure others will suggest a different approach.. One for sure. Prep the area. Go buy one of those 6 ft aluminum plastic covered green stakes at your local nursery. Also buy a roll of 1/2 inch wide stretch tape. The green colored stuff. Drive the stake in the ground directly where your conifer will be centered. Build your mound or cone the correct height where root flare is 2 inches above grade. Make sure you compact this dirt so there is little or no give. Then go to work on the roots as Dax described. When you are finished set the conifer on the top of cone at correct height and stretch tape it to the main leader. Now it is held secure for you to flare out the root structure around the cone. With the stake driven in the ground make sure it is plumed to vertical. No leaners. Make sure you have enough left to pull up the main leader to vertical and stretch tape it to it. If you want to build a berm and have no dirt go buy some top soil from your local big box store and mix it in with what you have tilled up. If you have a local source that can supply what is the same composition of soil for your area go for that if possible. Of course you will have to haul it or pay to have done. If your berm is any size at all then I would use that suggestion first. You will have to decide on your course of action. Good luck. I know this is a challenge for you and after you accomplish this you will give yourself a pat on the back. Also this experience you will retain for the next one. I have a feeling there will be more. I also am impressed with the choices you have made. All will be beautiful specimens. Also known to be true. Most cultivars 1 gal. and up that are potted are root bound. Even the small miniature ones. The only exceptions are the ones sold in the wooden boxes. My Pinus strobus 'Angel Falls' boxed was not root bound and perfect in every way. Buchholz conifers seem less root bound and their boxed cultivers have no root bound issues at all. Stay in the range of 1-3 gal. for potted conifers. Anything above that is a challenge and usually unworkable and comes with root issues. I can say this because I have purchased many potted offerings from multiple sources. Wish I could tell you who the main source of root bound conifers is but I am not going there. For purchases in the future pop them out of the pot if the nursery will let you. If they won't do it for you move on. Better safe then sorry. Any reputable nursery should always guarantee you a 50% refund if it dies in the first year when they don't plant it. 100% refund if they do. Then I know one that guarantees them 100% no matter who plants them. Dave This post was edited by Davesconifers on Tue, Sep 17, 13 at 13:41...See More
User
5 years agoken_adrian Adrian MI cold Z5
5 years ago
Garen Rees
5 years agolast modified: 5 years agoEmbothrium
5 years agolast modified: 5 years agoUser
5 years agoSo far so good. The leader went the way it needed to. Now, hopefully it will stop. Im not so confident on this one.
plantkiller_il_5
5 years agolast modified: 5 years agoGaren Rees
5 years agoin ny zone5
5 years agolast modified: 5 years ago
PROKD Landscape
5 years agoconiferbros
5 years agoI was scrolling through my camera roll and remembered I took this photo with the intention of posting it here. Better late then never I guess.
This one is a few blocks away from me. I do not know the cultivar, but do know that these two leaders have been growing upright for many years with no help. Perhaps they were staked at some point in time and decided to continue the habit. Single plant as far as I can tell.
Embothrium
5 years agolast modified: 5 years agoOntario_Canada5a_USDA4b
5 years agolast modified: 5 years agoUser
5 years agolast modified: 5 years agoUser
5 years agolast modified: 5 years agoI went to take pics of one of the two larger specimens I know of, but there was a big detour so I scrapped that and went to the third (and last) I know of (smallest) which I just spotted in the last month or two. This one appears to have a total of three leaders(2nd from last pic). Now I obviously dont know if this was ever staked or not, but it seems to be fairly vertical. I didnt walk up the driveway to get closeups, but maybe this is something else? The other two are taller, narrower at the base, and single leader I believe. The last pic was also taken today showing that the leader on mine is very vertical (has gotten more vertical since last pic, looks dead vertical to me now).
User
5 years agolast modified: 5 years agoI researched Picea Abies ‘Rotenhausii’ and this fits the description and pictures well. I am trying to figure out how a tree labeled as a P. Abies Pendula ended up being a Rotenhausii(other than being mislabeled). Is it as simple as a genetic mutation? If so, then this tree may be unique. It has been in the ground 5 years but a car blocked mid afternoon till dusk sun from hitting the lower 1/4 until last year at this time.
P. Abies can be propagated from cuttings and seeds. Any other methods? How are they typically grown at nurseries/tree farms? Here is a pic from Tuesday, it is very vertical and I am confident it will not weep(this year at least). Thanks.
User
5 years agolast modified: 5 years agoHere is a pic of one of the other two I referred to earlier in the thread. Once I figure out where the largest one is Ill snap a pic. So what could this be? Ive never seen it staked in about 7 years and it is growing vertical on its own.
alley_cat_gw_7b
5 years agoplantkiller_il_5
5 years agolast modified: 5 years agolink for post above
mine is only 2 ft , not much to look at
at plantingi could take pic later
ron
alley_cat_gw_7b
5 years agoGaren Rees
5 years agolast modified: 5 years agoI dig the photo even if it is just a wee babe. =)
Oh ooh, If you guys like 'Rothenhausii' then check out it's funky mutation, Picea abies 'Silver Star' AKA 'Inversa Viridis Dablice'. It's a short needled, cream colored sport that was found on 'Rothenhausii'. Same narrow habit with the added funky color. Not sure if it would be categorized as ugly or pretty, but regardless, I thought it was fantastic. I was lucky to get a tiny one from Coniferkingdom this year and it's handled full, hot, summer sun with no problems. Not sure if they have any left but it would be worth a call to see if they do.
Photos are from Irena's post on Facebook, Planet Conifer group.
alley_cat_gw_7b
5 years agoplantkiller_il_5
5 years agoGaren Rees
5 years agoplantkiller_il_5
5 years agoyah , guess that would be a tall order
anyway ,,,here is Rot yesterday
I think he is trying to make himself look biggerha , ron
alley_cat_gw_7b
5 years agoGaren Rees
5 years agoplantkiller_il_5
5 years ago
plantkiller_il_5