Do you have pics during install? Sorry but whatever is beneath that tile is not an approved waterproof surface. How are they tying in the waterproofing of the pan to the wall???!!

It passed inspection

Ah, now I see that the drywall is propping up the tile. So they installed a pvc waterproof liner? Did they do a flood test? Anyway, love your tile choice.

Bri, yes, they did do a flood test. Based on timing (weekend), they actually left the water there for days. It did not budge.

And, yes, it is a PVC waterproof liner.

Thank you everyone for your waterproofing concerns. I assure you, it is covered.

The question is about tile spacing and offset. Much appreciated!

beautiful tile emilie. I know they are good, but make sure your guys go over the tops of those white tiles with a sealer before grouting. grout can get in to those crackles and dull your tile. a quick buff w/sealer on top (tops only) of the tiles will prevent the grout from sneaking under it.

as for the accent tile,,,same grout line. like in this photo,,,,see the thin black liner tiles? they kept the same width grout.

Thanks, Beth. Very helpful photo and also love those tile choices. We will definitely stick with a uniform tile spacing based on all the advice.

I know the contractors intend to seal the tile, but I will confirm that they will do that before the grouting (particularly because of the crackle look). Thanks for the tip!

Beth - we intend to use a similar blue/green floor tile as in your photo (except ours are square). Do you think that the off white grout gets dirty easily? What are your thoughts on using the same colored grout on the floor as we plan to use on the wall (the off white) - as opposed to using a different color (like a grey or putty color that is in the same scale of dark/light as the floor tile)?

what grout are they using? I like the stain proof if you want to use any white. Mapei Flex color CQ is what I used in my shower.

however, since a floor gets used a lot more, I would never do a white or off white. but that's me. is this a master bath? or more of a public type bathroom where people will be walking on it with shoes?

if you want, choose a warm gray. Mapei Warm Gray actually dries to an off white/gray, and I think would be a better choice w/your white tiles and look beautiful against the green

I used warm gray on the white subways, black on the cement tiles, and charcoal on the black marble hex.

consider using this shade w/your tiles instead of that off white shade. I think you'll like it better. #93

The spacing and offset are fine. Please study up on the use of crackle tiles in a wet area. Many manufacturers do not rate them for wet areas (check the manufacturer specifications for your tile) and if they ARE used, as Beth said, must be sealed first AND sealed annually.

Beth - thanks! Although it is a master bath, I don’t want to worry about light/white grout getting dirty. Plus, I think it will look very busy and grid-like with the 3” square tiles. I think we will go for something closer to the shade of the floor tile.


As to the wall tile, I agree with you that a light grey looks lovely with whitish subway tile. I am thinking about that for the other (larger bath). But in this bath, I like the off white much better with the Malibu quads, and want to carry the same grout color across to the subway on the wall.

Thanks again for your advice and all the helpful photos!

Also, we are using Custom Building Products Fusion Pro grout. It was separately recommended by our custom tile store and our contractors.

Love your patterned tile selection and because I like grout lines to line up, I would have selected a white tile which matches the height of your patterned tile.

Dragonfly took the words out of my mouth on this one. Most crackle finish tiles are not approved for a wet area. A professional installer would point that out and verify before bidding the job.

i had the Mizu tiles from WZ in my shower. crackle glaze. within 2 years, they were completely dulled and matte. turns out that WZ recalled them from wet areas. I ended up getting a full refund for the tile and they paid for the tile install. (which I did myself so I got a nice payday on that one!)

It passed inspection

Inspectors don't inspect for waterproofing behind a wall. They only inspect that a flood test passes.

As I previously stated: THE SHOWER WALLS AND SHOWER PAN WERE WATERPROOFED

Emilie, You were not asking about waterproofing, so we understand your frustration. Because of the massive problems that people on this site have experienced as the result of improper "behind the scenes" shower preparation, you will get these comments. As professionals with 35 years of experience, our comment regarding crackle tile used in a wet area was meant to educate and serve the consumer and industry. Since you are working with a reputable custom tile shop, I'm sure they would have discussed the recommended applications for this type of tile - "crackled" with you. (We will not install it in a shower). Another comment: it is not often you would see a crackle tile historically in conjunction with the beautiful Spanish/Morroccan tile you chose. We might lean towards a subway or other format field tile (not crackle and not too rectified) that pulls from a color in the feature tile. Something that marries rather than separates those walls and is of the same style (thickness, finish, variances). Good luck with your project.

My frustration is only that I already confirmed it was waterproofed - and the people continuing to ask nonetheless after that.

We are also double checking on the crackle tile, but the tile store and installer assured us it was fine with double sealing.

As Pro's we have a choice. We can offer a factual warning for free that could save someone reading along thousands of dollars or we can look the other way knowing someone is about to learn a hard & costly lesson. I suggest contacting the tile manufacturer before proceeding. It's worth the price of a phone call. I personally would never install a crackle finish in a wet area. This detail is more important than grout joint size. Hope all works out for you. I was typing when you posted. Sorry.

since I've been down the crackle road issue, if they do tell you it's fine for a shower, please get a written statement or email that says 'this tile is fine for a wet shower area'. If something should happen in a few years, you'll be reimbursed if it has to be redone.

who is the maker of the white tiles? and the Spanish ones didn't have anything in their line to go w/those?

The Malibu tile is not really a “line.” They were custom. I could not afford custom field tile. I also feel like I am having to defend my design choices, even though I am happy with them.

"help" isnt much help if all we say is 'looks good'. i get that its frustrating, i've been on the receiving end in my life. but there are such sad sad sad dilemmas from folks who never got help.

emilie, no not at all. was just a question. I like what you've chosen.

@ninigret - I did not ask for help on tile selection. Nor did I even ask people to say “looks good” to my tile selection. I asked for help on tile spacing and offset.

Thanks Beth!

Emilie,,,have you ever seen The Junglaow and her bathrooms? she used Fireclay tile, but bold colors and prints.

https://www.jungalow.com/2017/08/jungalow-bathroom-before-and-after-with-kohler.html

https://www.jungalow.com/tour-the-jungalow-2

I also feel like I am having to defend my design choices, even though I am happy with them.

Actually your design choices are fabulous.

I get that the salesman told you they were fine for the shower. After all he/she is making a nice sale, but if it turns out that the crackle tiles shouldn't be used in a wet area, it's no skin off his/her back since they won't be the ones having to deal with the water issues. That is why it was suggested you also call the manufacturer just to triple check.

Would you rather find out now that it's not to be used in a shower or find out in the not so distant future when you have water problems in the shower? I know what my answer would be.

I think this waterproofing method is called a ‘mud job’ and used mostly in California. I believe this is the method we’re using in our showers. It’s supposed to last ‘forever’ compared to more modern methods. We’ll see! Love the bold tile choices and hope you will post the finished job. I think keeping the same spacing for both tiles will be better.

Re the crackle tile: The manufacturer’s site specifically lists “shower” as a “usage” for the tile - in two separate places - and also provides installation instructions for wet areas.

"Waterproofing is provided by a membrane applied before the tile is installed...it's not something done afterwards."

Thats correct but First you need to know what your looking at. This is a classic Mud job and there is no mandatory TOPICAL waterproofing required.

I really like all the homeowners here that over the years have came to understand certain things and spread the Good word, but we have a serious issue of everyone is now a pro, jumping on bandwagons with scant knowledge and no field experience.

Being a mud man myself Id be saddened to see my shower posted and folks mis-informing my client of this.

Now Kudz I do respect most things you say and you clearly have some great advice.

Everyone on these forums should really start wondering where all the Tile pros have gone and why very few of us comment on this mess of a forum where everyone is now an authority on shower building based on the very misinformation they read right here on these threads.

The main reason i still participate and am happy to take the troll bashing i get is to better the very industry I thrive in by attempting to correct the mass of MIS-Information posted largely by a select few , time and again..

So strange you dont see me on the auto repair forum advising on repairs and im pretty good with the wrenches.

Have you considered a field subway tile that is not white?

With subway tile, the spacing is the most important. Make sure it is the same distance all the way through or you will get a nasty line you will not be able to live with. Love the Malibu, any idea of what will be in the niche? I think adding the Malibu would look awesome.

Tundra-

I respect your insights. For me, I was thrown off by that last picture in the original post showing a wall with a concrete surface part way up and sheetrock the rest of the way. It made me concerned since I couldn't be sure about what was or wasn't under the tile.

I somewhat regret putting up this original post because everyone questioned what turned out to be a very solid way of waterproofing the shower, and crackle tiles that the manufacturer explicitly approves for wet areas. Worse, people would not let it go when I said it was fine, and harped on it so much that o ended up asking my contractor on a holiday about both of these things. Luckily, they are very professional and responsive and explained everything. To the person who said that inspection only covers shower pans: that varies by city. Los Angeles looks at walls as well. Of course the contractor had checked that the tile was usable in the shower before agreeing to install it. And of course they already had a plan for following the manufacturer’s recommended treatment and install.

If one is to houzz successfully, one must master the art of selective hearing :):)

To respond to a few items above:

(1) Dragonfly said that historically you would not see crackle tile with “Spanish/Moroccan” tile. It’s Malibu tile, and I have seen it in historical homes in Southern California with crackle subway tile. Lots of Spanish and craftsman homes from the first quarter of the century in California have these cracks. One of my inspirations was my mom’s 1908 house. Granted, the cracks occurred because of age. Unfortunately, we can’t wait around 90+ years to get the look we want. The thing that is not entirely traditional/historic about this is having an entire accent wall of Malibu. Most Spanish houses in California from the 1920’s had much less flashy bathrooms, and used Malibu tile sparingly if at all (the Adamson house being one big exception of course). But I love the Malibu so I was willing to break from tradition a bit in that respect.

(2) Palimpsest asked if we considered a field subway tile that was not white. Yes, we considered a lot of things and ended up purchasing these. This is a small bathroom, and the previous shower color was tan/brown and made the room look like a cave. We wanted lighter color to open things up and brighten the room. The house is also a Spanish on the outside/craftsman on the inside type. The house has a lot of white - and the tile we chose goes with the character of the house. A red adobe would be too Spanish for the house and too dark for the room. Other colors did not seem to work, either with the look we were going for or the character of the house. It is also worth noting that we chose a sort of turquoise floor tile. So we are not ending up with a big patch of color floating in white.

(3) Designer Drains asked if we would put the Malibu in the niche. We considered it, and we even have enough to do that, but it will not work, unfortunately. Given the placement of the niche, the motif would be offset from what is on the adjacent wall. But we do have the complementary 2x6 runner going all the way around the room, including right across the bottom of the niche. So it will all be tied in together.

(4) Beverly said she would have chosen a field tile that matched the size of the Malibu tile. We just completely disagree on that design decision. I personally feel that white tile that size would be completely out of character for a 1920’s Spanish/Craftsman. (Red adobe might be ok in that size, but we did not want that in the bathroom for the reasons described above.) Additionally, I don’t necessarily believe that all tile should match in size. To me, it looks very prefab/HGTV, and has less character. We are not into the “transitional” look. Instead, we are trying to bring the character back to the bathrooms in the house - after this bathroom was created a few years ago with no style whatsoever (other than maybe “functional cave”) and after the other bathroom suffered from a very bad flip (i.e., travertine in a 1920’s house, including unsealed travertine on the floor). Putting aside the design aspect of this suggestion, it would be very difficult practically to do that. This is because the Malibu tiles are custom and handmade, so it would be hard to find a field tile that perfectly matched the size.

With all the threads I’ve read on Houzz related to failed bathroom renos, I’m glad people bring this stuff up over and over again. I don’t take it as having to get defensive about it, but more as a tool to teach folks what questions to ask. I wouldn’t have known to ask, and when I did ask, my contractor said he’d never been asked about waterproofing methods in the 20+ years he’s been in business, but nicely explained the entire mud job process in an email. These posts are here not only to come up with answers to your question and to help others down the road. I know what I’ve done with my remodel/addition would not have been possible without reading old posts, responses from pros, and homeowners.

Emilie, I understand your frustration, reading through this thread. Good luck with your remodel - looks like it will be beautiful!

That looks amazing!!

Looks great! Congratulations on completing your project, as well as weathering the comments on this site.

Emilie, stunning shower. love it. what color grout (s) did you end up with?

Thanks! Beth, in the FusionPro, we chose Antique White (#10) for the walls, and Natural Grey (#09) for the floors. Here are some closeups. I just took them on my phone and it is evening, so I have the lights on; excuse the glare and color. I’ll get some better pictures with my real camera in better light once the whole project is completed. Thanks again for your advice!

Your finished shower is stunning. I'd love to see more photos of the entire room.

Emellie, NICE looking shower!

Yes, gorgeous! More pictures, please, when you have a chance. Enjoy!!

Thanks! We just finished the tile install. I will post pictures of the finished room once we get all fixtures and stuff in.

Absolutely love the shower!!! Thank you for posting finished photos. They look magnifique :).

So, full circle question: what size grout line did you end up picking for the subways? Works so well!!

We went with 1/8” spacing for all tiles. It was definitely the right choice. The subway tiles are also handmade, so I think putting them closer together would have been a bad idea (even though subway tiles are often placed much closer together). Also, there is coherence I’m having all the spacing the same.

We ended up using the same spacing in the other bathroom we remodeled. I think it looks period-appropriate for a 1920’s house.

Sorry I have been delinquent posting pics of the finished bathroom! We just have had so much work going on in our house.