You would need to check the height of the stove, generally the cabinets get mounted to the subfloor, and a 3cm countertop will give the "normal" height that is standard. The flooring goes in after cabinets and should go thru the range and dishwasher areas. The range and dishwasher have adjustable legs and if installed by professionals will be at the right height. The 3cm countertops are standard and the additional 3cm of edge will not effect this as it covers the top of the cabinet rather than lifting the countertop higher. I do not suggest lifting the island cabinets unless you absolutely need to as a gap at the top of the dishwasher is very unsightly and the only way to secure island cabinets is by attaching them to the floor by glue or a 2x4 frame inside the frame of the base of the cabinet... raising them would make this very difficult and you could end up with island cabinets that move when enough force is applied. Again easiest way to tell is to get out a tape measure. Hope it works out and look forward to seeing the finished product.

@The Bowman Group - thanks so much for your helpful and fast reply! The stove is a standard 36" and legs can go as high 1.5". I guess where I'm confused, and keep getting different answers, is on the extra 3 cm laminated edge for 6 cm look... if the counters are not raised to accommodate for the extra 3 cm overhang, then the drawers would not open and I would not be able to fit the dishwasher under the counter? They "tech" person at the fabricator said they install a lager substrate under the granite to accommodate for laminated edge and that raises the counter. He was not sure by how much and didn't even know that base cabinets are 34.5 standard height and started measuring some there and said cabinets are 35" standard. While I'm sure he's great at his gig as a granite fabricator, his knowledge of cabinetry and answering the height question left a lot to be desired - guess it is just not his area.

So, again, please pardon my ignorance here, but if the counter is not raised higher than normal with a substrate, then where does the extra 3cm go? I assume it can't just hand over the edge and block the drawers and dishwasher...

You have chosen inappropriate elements that do not physically coordinate. Math rules. And whoever designing this doesn’t appear to do math. The previous poster doesn’t either.

Your counter choice will not work with a range. Only a cooktop and wall oven. Range legs are not adjustable enough, and the range cannot be recessed below the counter. You will hav other issues as well. This cannot be done with standard cabinets and end up with standard height counters. Only custom. And a lot of expensive custom details go into that choice.

You have to ditch the extra build up. It doesn’t work design wise either.

I see the confusion. on a standard cabinet there is 1 1/2" to from the top of the box (no countertop) to the top of the drawer. When installing countertops with the additional profile edge it is often installed with a 1/2" sheet of plywood on top of the cabinets under the countertop. This is what your installer was talking about. Again, both the stove and dishwasher have enough adjustment. The deciding factor should be are you ok with a less than normal gap between the counter top and the first drawer on your cabinets. I have installed these in several projects without custom ordering cabinets, and without issues. Again, if you have professional installers they know how to and do work around any issues like this regularly. If your uncomfortable with the concept you can ensure it works by having a tape measure ready when the installers are there and checking as they begin installation. I have included a few pictures of what to expect. in the third picture you can clearly see the range level with the countertop and those are standard base cabinets.

To Sophie: While I certainly can appreciate your opinion I do not know as a pro why you would tell a client that they can not do something that they want to do. It is our job to inform them of any things they may want to consider while making choices and help them achieve the goal they set. Telling someone that something can not be done, especially in construction is the easy way out in my opinion. Especially something as easy as this.

Why don't they cut the toe kick 1 1/2??? to offset the extra 3cm on counter??

So instead of the toe kick being 4 1/2 ...it would be 3" in height.

Because your feet can’t fit in a space 11/2”H and a whole other host of issues.

And NO, full overlay drawers come within 1/4” the top of that 34.5” top of cabinet. You would not want to cover that top rail even in a partial overlay or inset cabinet because the look would then be drastically off. None of those images use 6CM counters because you have to design entirely differently when planning to use 6 cm counters. 6CM isn’t stacked 2CM, which is 4cm and within the adjustability range of most range legs. You don’t tell someone the warmth is flat just because they want it to be.

This all has to be designed custom. Not stock.

@Sophie Wheeler - thanks for your reply and feedback. Well, let me take a stab at the math and perhaps you can tell me if this is correct or not...

1) 34.5" standard cabinet (confirmed)

2) 36" standard range with 2" adjustable legs (confirmed LG model LRE4213ST)

3) 6 cm granite (3 cm with 3 cm laminated edge)

4) 6 cm = 2.36" of granite on top of the 34.5" cabinets

5) 34.5" base cabinet plus 2.36" = 36.86"

6) Set cabinets on floor with no shim and then lay 1/2" travertine around cabinets

7) subtract 1/2" from 36.86" = 36.36" counter height

8) raise free standing range legs 1/2"

By my math that should put the range just slight higher than the counters. Again, I am just a homeowner and not an expert by any means so please correct me if I've missed something or not calculating this correctly.

This wall will just have the range and refrigerator.

For the island area, we would shime the cabinets a 1/2" (or lay the travertine and set on top) so that dishwasher would fit under the counter.... 34.5" cabinet with sub and granite on top then mount the washer to the substrate.

Does all that make sense or am i missing something?

Thanks again!

The only part that is off is in #3. 3cm is 1.18 inches but for simplicity lets make it 1 1/4" 3cm of granite is going to go on top of the cabinets. the additional 3cm goes on the front of the cabinet. To make it look better your installer is going to add 1/2" to 3/4" of plywood to raise the counters and only make the extra 3cm show as 1/2" to 3/4" below where the counter would normally show. Which means with the plywood and the 3cm sitting on top of the cabinets you will be at "34 1/2" + 1 1/4"(3cm) + 3/4"(plywood) = 36 1/2" by raising the range 1/2" or adding tile under the range you are back to your 36" requirement.

But long story short yes your right it will work. It will make a lot more sense when you look at the side profile of 3cm granite with a 3cm profile... the second 3cm does not sit on top of the cabinets.

Range adjustability is measured from 36” AFF. Typical is not 2”, which would be 1” down and 1” up, Typical is 1” adjustable. Which is 1/2” down, and 1/2” up. Neither the spec sheets nor owners manual give any indication that the range deviates from the norm to have 2” of adjustability. Which would barely sufficient with virtually 37” H AFF counters.

You cannot have a lip on counters with full overlay. It will prevent the drawers from opening. That is why you have build up kits with Laminate counters. And it looks bad to cover the top rail. with partial or inset. All exposed stiles and rails should be even.

You’re not doing travertine for counters????

Sophie, again thanks for the opinion, but I am not sure where full overlay cabinets have ever been considered standard. As a trim carpenter full overlay cabinets only work if they are custom built. To find an existing kitchen getting remodeled where cabinet spacers are not required is almost non existent, (if they are used the full overlay cabinets look ridiculous IMO) unless your using custom cabinets that is.

36.5” is typically the tallest that any slide in range is adjustable to. And 35.5” on the lower end. I’ve run into that issue on several jobs on the lower adjustable end, where the lips sit above the counter edge.

Also, stone does vary in thickness and occasionally 3cm will be 2.95 or 3.05. It’s not exact. And that occasionally creates issues.

We have a suburb around here that strictly enforced the clearances around cooktops, where using a taller than standard counter height means mounting the wall cabinets taller to, in order to not get the red tag from the inspector. That means custom height cabinets have to be used when doing it there.

BTW, full overlay cabinets have been standard kitchen in kitchen design for at least 20 years. Customers don’t want partial overlay anymore. Frameless has made big inroads in American designer kitchens as well. Cabinets sit at the finished floor height NOT at the subfloor height. That can be accomplished by placing the finished floor under them, or by shimming to the finished floor height. Not doing it that way leads to even more clearance issues with appliances.

@The Bowman Group - thanks very much... all very helpful and appreciate your checking the math and correcting! I'm doing these thomasville cabinets but they have not arrived yet so I don't know big the "rail" is above the drawers. Is there a standard for that? I have a call in to Thomasville to ask them but can't find anything in the specs. Will the dishwasher still fit under the counter in the island? Here is the washer... https://www.bestbuy.com/site/kitchenaid-architect-series-ii-24-built-in-dishwasher-with-stainless-steel-tub-stainless-steel/8784203.p?skuId=8784203  

Mr. Buxbaum, all I can say is that this will work and will be within any and all codes that exist. I apologize that your question has become a back and forth disagreement between Pros. I know this will work as I have done it before. As a trim carpenter, general contractor and designer I can assure you this will not be an issue. I very much look forward to seeing the end result. Please post photos so we can all appreciate the time and work you put into your kitchen. If you have any other questions or concerns please let us know.

Thomasville has both full overlay doors and partial overlay doors. Many more full overlay than partial overlay. Which door style did you pick?

@The Bowman Group - here is the link to Tomasville cabinet choice. It is camden... http://canada.thomasvillecabinetry.com/Classic/Style8/Camden.aspx?RSID=68  I think this is what is called full overlay but not sure how space there is between the drawers and the top of the cabinet... might just have to wait until i get them or go back to home depot and measure the floor model!

That is a standard full overlay door. There is 3/16” between the drawer and the top of the cabinets.

Just saw the last post. Yes, Generally you will have 1 1/2" of rail (unless your using a full overlay cabinet). The dishwasher stands 34 1/2" tall if that is accurate you will not have any issues if you do not tile under it. Should your cabinets be full overlay, you can have the granite guys add another 1/2" of plywood to the top of the cabinets but you would need to get a longer foot for the range. You can find them at any big box store.

Thanks again to everyone for their help... i apologize if some of the back and forth were a bit heated between you all, but that was not my intention. The 6cm thing is not real common and in some areas unusual. Again, thanks to all, you;ve given me enough here so that I can work with the installer, measure the cabinets when they arrive and speak with the fabricator about what substrate size they will be using. I think if I take all those steps and get out my little calculator, we should be good. All the best to everyone for a successful 2018 and beyond!

PS - will post photos when install is done... March I think? Cabinets are being built and ship next week - we are very excited :-)

@GreenDesigns - here is what I'm thinking based on what everyone is saying and including your post...

Island (dishwasher and sink)

- cabinets sit on travertine (1/2" travertine) and including tile under dishwasher space

- 34.5 inch cabinet

- 3/4" plus 1/2" substrate

- 6 cm granite (let's call it 2.5")

- Total counter height (34.5 + 2.5) = 37.0"

- Space undercounter for dishwasher now = 34.5 (kitchenAid specs say to allow 34" to 34.5")

- that should work for both the dishwasher and full overlay cabinets

As for the base cabinets along the other wall (stove and fridge)

- cabinets sit on subfloor

- 1/2 travertine around cabinets and in range and fridge slot

- 34.5" cabinets

- 3/4" plus 1/2" substrate

- 6 cm granite (let's call it 2.5")

- Total counter height (34.5 - 1/2" for flooring + 2.5 granite and substate) = 36.5"

I just called LG and the range has a 2" leg range (+1/-1) so between that and tiling around the base cabinets we only need the legs to raise the stove to 36.5".

I think with everyone's help and calls to Thomasville, LG and the fabricator, that this should work! If anyone sees a problem with this revised logic and math then please do let me know... thanks again!

Have you identified your room's high spot? And low spot? What is your plan for a flat floor? Is HD doing your cabinet install? Counter install? Flooring install? Where is the GC who is coordinating all of the details? There are numerous pitfalls associated with your plan. But none so deep as if you are relying on HD to make any of this happen. Good luck!

You don't place your range down in a hole either. You do have to occasionally pull it out to clean under it.

If you want this to happen, regardless of the consequences, then return the range and figure out a place for a wall oven. Then do a cooktop and buy another cabinet. And double check clearances to combustibles above.

All this should have been figured out on paper long before any final decisions were made.

@Green the stove would be on the 1/2" travertine the cabinets on that wall would be "in the hole" as it were. that raises the stove a 1/2" even before the leg adjustment hence the measurements listed. @Sopie - really don't like that design and not hearing any real reason not to go with the measurements and design I outlined. I much respect your opinion of the look and the facts regarding the standards, but we've decided on this look and my goal here is to make sure it works. If you see something wrong with my last outline of measurements that would prevent this from working then I would greatly appreciate the feedback. Otherwise, we do feel pretty strongly that this is really how want it to look.

Again, my goal here is to make sure my numbers are right and that everything fits. Nothing is "in a hole" below the travertine flooring line other than the base cabinets on the wall with the stove and refrigerator. All else is on the flooring.

Sorry to cause so much anguish! Just look to make sure the numbers work. From a designer look and feel perspective, we are set.

Good luck! There were items I couldn't get 100% consensus on how to install either but I researched the heck out of it, held my breath and took a leap of faith, and watched intently during install. Everything came together and I am sure yours will too. If issues do arise (as in all construction) you step back and regroup, maybe going in another direction if that's the only option but do what you really want to do so there are no regrets.

Not what you asked about, but your choice of travertine for counters: I have travertine counters and floors in my master bath and flooring in my entry hallway. My house came that way, but having lived with it, I would not recommend it. Yes, it is very nice-looking, lovely.

Travertine is classified variously as a limestone or marble. Translation: it will etch. In your kitchen do you think you will never spill wine, tomato sauce, juice, salad dressing, or soda? In my bathroom, I had drips from toothpaste or moisturizer or who knows what that etched, and also water glass circles (yes, just water). So I had my travertine counters and flooring in my bathroom refinished which was expensive, and now I baby that travertine like nobody's business. I would never recommend for the harder use of a kitchen.

@friedajune - thanks for your advice! We are only putting it on the floor - not the counters as someone suggested earlier in the thread. We did the same in our Chicago place 6 years ago and used two coats of sealer, resealed at the 5 year mark, and have never had a problem with that house so we plan on doing the same here at our AZ place. There are different grades from different countries and that, along with how it is sealed, could be what the problem is at your place. We also have a 1800 square patio of travertine around the pool - unsealed - and looks great with no stain problems.

I am NOT a pro, or even an expert, but I know what cabinets look like - they are inset, full overlay, or partial overlay. Inset are usually more expensive. You'd probably know it you ordered them, if Thomasville even makes them. Full overlay are very popular. Do they still sell partial overlay? I'd be shocked if you had ordered partial overlay. So, it looks like your base cabinet drawers are not going to open. BTW - I think Sophie can be quite negative and somewhat unrealistic about price. Or realistic about price if you are engineering to NASA standards and using an architect, kitchen designer, lighting designer, GC, and world's finest craftsmen in their respective trades. But I don't think I've ever seen her be WRONG. You should come up with a back up countertop plan and make your final decision after cabinets, stove and D/W are installed. WITH TILE UNDERNEATH THEM.

For the stove, you can always build a platform for it to sit on.

Hi All, Thanks so very much to everyone for their help! We finished most of our kitchen (only need the backsplash) and after the helpful debate here on this board, and working with our installer and the granite fabricator, we wound up with an incredible 6 cm, stepped edge counter! Everything fit perfectly, including the stove, dishwasher, etc. I know there were a couple of people here who expressed doubt this was possible or would work out very well, but after doing the math on my own, listening to the more supportive comments on this board (thank you!) and speaking with the team here, we proceeded with our dream kitchen counters and it worked fantastically! I spent a ton of time with the shop guys at the fabricator and detailed exactly where I wanted the cuts for the laminated, stepped edge and the average person cannot tell it is a laminated... the granite lines up perfectly and no obvious seam since it is stepped! Have a look and please let me know what you think of the outcome!

Our situation was not exactly like yours, but similar enough that it might help someone else faced with the issue. My wife and I are tall and had custom cabinets installed to keep us from bending over. That required some adjustment to be made for the appliances. We decided to drop the cabinets down for the stove. Here's a pic.

@dchall - beautiful!

@Bownman_Group - special thanks to the Bowman Group for your supportive and helpful posts and photos and setting us on the right path to making this a success with our local team... very much appreciate!

@Bowman - note that we used the exact cut you posted in one of your samples... 3cm ogee on top of a stepped 3cm demi... awesome! everyone who comes to see it loves it! We are so very excited we went this route :-)