We are doing cost plus so no allowances in our build. I just spent 1400 bucks today for a bath filler for a freestanding master bath tub..ouch.

I would triple that amount I think to be realistic. Can't imagine that you can cover a house that size for 6500k.

Are these tile showers? What about the kitchen ? Laundry?

That's very low. I agree with ILoveRed. I think triple would be a good number and that wouldn't be for top of the line fixtures like Kalista or Rohl.

Yeah, didnt the architect specify any of that? Is there a selections document?

Obviously that would not include the shower tile. But were you assuming pans for some of the showers?

How many bathrooms. How many tubs? How many showers?

Seems low for a 2mm house. Also odd these details were left to an allowance.

That's extremely low price. $335/sf.....that's outrageous!!!! You must be in CA or the NE.

The tub count is important of course. Most of the shower cost is usually in the tile budget. Standalone tub fillers are the highest cost thing out there so if you don't have one of those, that helps.

Most of the time though, this is lumped with Kitchen but you say just bath? That is an important detail.

5000 sqft could of course be 3 baths or it could be 6.

The details matter and you need to provide exactly what is in that $6500.

A freestanding jetted tub could be that entire amount. at 6500 sq ft that's L-O-W...

I spent nearly 3K on the master shower fixtures alone and they were nothing too extravagant.

Thank you for all of the responses. I'm new at this. So I really appreciate all the input. I'll provide some additional information. There are 3 full bathrooms and 2 powder rooms. Total of 7 bathroom sinks and 3 showers. There is 1 tub. The $6,500.00 is for bathroom faucets, bathroom sinks and shower faucets/sprayers. Thank you.

That is perfectly fine IMO. Tub filler not included? Basic undermount sinks are cheap. Powders often do vanities with sinks included. We have done guest bathrooms as vanities also.

Everyone has different standards of course. I personally think allowances for plumbing fixtures is very appropriate. Makes the GCs work easier because he does not have to do a lot of upfront pricing work before he has a contract and it also allows the homeowner to defer decisions until later. And then you can tweak the budget easier later if needed.

Don't do allowances, Just pick the exact fixtures you want right now and get an exact price for them

This really is the best advice. Pick out as many of your materials and fixtures now so that you have a better idea of what your build will cost. We had everything specified before our builder produced his estimate. (Of course, we made some changes along the way...some saved money, others were more expensive).

The $335/sq ft is even higher than ours was, which is pretty painful, but we were lucky enough to start before Harvey and Irma and Canadian wood tariffs drove up the cost of building materials. Can you wait a year or so until prices stabilize again? Demand is extremely high right now.

This is partly a question of how your fixtures will be sourced. If you're buying them from the plumber who's marking them up in addition to charging you for their labor vs. paying wholesale plus your general contractor's fee. Our builder sent us to a great showroom in Denver where we bought a few more fixtures for a little more money. We went with Delta and some Grohe. I'm pretty sure we could have met that budget or come very close.

Better check the rest of your allowances. I’m betting you it ain’t gonna be close to $335 when it’s all said and done. More like $400.

Allowances are just intentionally bad guesses so as to make a house seem cheaper on the front end. If the builder was honest and gave you the contract for the full 2M+ that it will actually end up costing, you’d run away. Consumers have trained builders to lowball. So they do that in the unrealistic allowances.

I chose all my fixtures, sinks, tubs, siding, roofing, flooring, countertops, etc up front so my bid was as close as possible. I am providing the electrician with all the light fixtures so no allowance for that, nor was it in the bid. For the kitchen appliances I picked mine out this summer, gave my GC the expected $$ and he put it in as an "allowance" but I knew that number was accurate. When I went in a few weeks ago to make downpayments and get them ordered I discovered the Nov sale that all appliance stores have, and I saved 2K off of the summer prices and got free delivery.

You should be fine then

ingridmichael... the best way to find this out for sure is to talk to your contractor and go shopping.

Seems low to me. We are also building a house but with only three bathrooms and our allowance was $8500. I am going to be able to stay under, but we are not doing anything fancy at all.

That seems VERY low. We're building a very similar house - 5,000 square feet, four full baths, one half bath, which together include six sinks, four showers, and one soaker tub (and our cost per square foot, in the PNW, is only a few dollars less). Our contractor estimated $21,000. We think that's too high (we'll be paying cost plus, and for initial estimates ours does the opposite of what Sophie describes and errs on the high side for allowance estimates), but it does give you a basis for comparison.

Kristin - remember this is not a full bath allowance. Tubs and showers and toilets are not included. Only sinks, faucets and shower valves and trim.

Now take Delta Dryden wide spread bath faucet (our last house master choice and very common in higher end spec houses today)

Chrome, internet - $230

Bronze, retail - $530

So it depends whether you are paying retail (hope not and honestly doubt it) and it depends whether you like chrome or bronze. We happen to like chrome and pay internet (or wholesale). So even outfitting 7 sinks with widespread is $1600. But we did kids rooms in $120 - Grohe Concetto in chrome. So 3 as basic, 2 master widespread, 2 middle of the road for powder - $1200.

We did undermount sinks which were $100, but climb to $250. You can spend more - just saw a $2000 vessel. Even going with a $1000 vessel as a fancy piece in a powder room, you can be under $2000 total.

Basic Moen shower trim and valve is like $200. Let's say master gets a Grohe thermostatic with a seperate valved rainshower, conventional and hand held. $1500 is probably good. So $1900 in shower valves.

Leaves about $1400 for a tub filler which maybe fine unless free standing tub.

For chrome and internet pricing. 35% more for retail, 30% more for non chrome - now well over allowance.

Tendency is to set the allowances low so the total price looks smaller

OP said "faucets and sinks, including showers and tubs" - thus some of the comments - I assumed that meant the actual showers and tubs, not just the fixtures that attach to them.

And what is the kitchen pand outdoor kitchen plumbing allowance? I too took it to mean tubs, etc

How many bathrooms is it for? I think I spent about this amount on kallista for one master bathroom. This also included two sinks and a wall mount toilet. The tub filler was painfully expensive.

I think at your square footage price you should look at some higher end finishes like kallista and water works. I agree with forgetting the budget and picking what you want.

I'd think at least triple that number if not more. As others said, it is really best to do as many selections as you can for plumbing, electrical, tile, counters, flooring, appliances, interior and exterior finishes and details, windows, roofing, HVAC, etc. Even if many are only initial and then you go back and finalize them. $6500 sounds like your builder is choosing the absolute least expensive of everything.

Our builder is a very reputable high end custom only builder who assured us that the numbers in the budgets would be good. Plumbing came out 2.x, electrical fixtures 2x, tile 1.3x, flooring 1.6x, windows 1.2x, etc. And on plumbing we chose some less expensive fixtures to stay as close to budget as we could.

The builder wants to rope you in to their process. Once you're in their process it's more difficult to turn around and go elsewhere.

Another option is to do all of your architectural and interior along with all selections and then put it out for bid. That's what we'll do next time.

The amount is often important. An allowance is just a small Cost of the Work contract inside of a Lump Sum contract. If it is low, you will need a Change Order that increases the Contract Price. If it is high, you will need a Change Order that decreases the Contract Price . An owner doesn't usually get the contractor's markup refunded in a decrease change order but otherwise the amount shouldn't matter as long as the contract allows the owner the flexibility to chose the suppliers and to reject suspected sweetheart deals between the general contractor and his favorite sub-contractors or suppliers. I recommend using your consultant to write a construction contract that avoids these common pitfalls.

OP - don't stress. People like to point how allowances are often too low and that is the assumption. I think yours is fine but people are not reading the fine print.

The amount is irrelevant; what matters is your control over the buy out process.

JDS? Welcome back.........

Glad to see you back JDS.

Awesome. Our original architect is back. Glad to see you JDS.

I may have had a bit too much wine Friday

"... Makes the GCs work easier because he does not have to do a lot of upfront pricing work before he has a contract and it also allows the homeowner to defer decisions until later..."

This is all too often the exact situation, i.e., the allowances are made to make the initial construction cost appear low and acceptable at the outset, and then when the allowances are insufficient, the builder often benefits from the additional expense, overhead and profit associated with the changes to the allowances. And the owner is upset over the surprise and added expenses.

As others have said, plumbing fixtures are in the category of materials and labor which may be furnished and installed by the tradesman (plumber), or purchased by the owner and installed by the tradesman. There are advantages and disadvantages to each option which should be understood before making a decision.

Good luck!

Contractor allowances are not necessarily intended to make the initial price seem low. When there is nothing specified, there is no reason for a contractor to guess high. It is wise for everyone to avoid credit change orders.

As an architect, I write my client's contract and issue it as part of the request for bids. When I write a contract, I establish the allowances based on what I know of the owner's expectations so the allowances are the same for all bidders. Asking different contractors to provide different allowances serves no purpose and can make bid comparisons difficult

If you are asking contractors to submit their own contract proposals and allowance amounts, ask a knowledgeable professional to review the submissions before awarding the contract.

The key to allowances, if they must be included in a bid package, is to have them based on the owner's detailed requirements, even if they are verbal. Anything else is, of course, based on the SWAG factor.

Welcome back!

If you knew the owner's requirements in detail you would specify something that could be included in the bids even if it needed to change later. An Allowance should be used for materials (not labor) and act as a place holder in the contract. If the material is known but not the quantity, a unit price should be bid. It's not a difficult issue.

What is difficult is how the contractor is allowed to buy the allowance material. Owners seem to get distracted by the Allowance numbers when they're not real prices. An owner might not know where the final price comes from; it might just be a number on a subcontractor invoice. On large projects, 3 sub contractor bids are required for each allowance item and the owner's rep chooses the winner. I usually stipulate that if the owner doesn't like the price or the supplier, the owner can delete the allowance from the contract and supply the material themselves.

Another consideration is that if you do go over the allowances,you may need to pay cash immediately to cover any additional costs, since the construction loan is based on the allowances. This may not be an issue for you, but some folks are running really tight for money during construction, and have trouble coming up with additional funds to cover items that go over the allowance.

Many customers and GCs go too low on allowances because makes them feel better when they see the total house price. However, when they do the actual selections they discover they have champagne tastes on a beer budget.

Bruce

way too low.

Plumbing fixture costs and homeowner expectations and financial means vary greatly. Some of my clients have wanted to buy their fixtures themselves online or at Home Depot (amazing what they can do with plated plastic these days) and others did not care what the fixtures cost. Some are concerned about the mortgage amount and others do not need to borrow. One of my problems is remembering where a client's expectation falls in that range and being prepared for when they are inconsistent. Ironically, it seems the more expensive the house, the less is borrowed.

Why guess? Go online and get the plumbing selected or go to the builders plumbing supplier and pick. On line menus let you pick & adjust to your budget. Typically, I use an allowance based on real selections, such as a prior home so I can back it up. "We did this home for $____" is most credible. For those who want an absolute fixed cost without allowances, I specify brand, finish and model. Practically, most clients won't spend the time up front, so I send them to my plumbing and appliance showroom who costs a little more, but then you can see it in person.

A 2-year old thread. Bet the OP has it figured out by now.