Vee, I am glad to hear your daughter is safe! I don't think these religious things will ever be settled...they go back to Biblical times. Though most of the terrorist attacks these days seem fueled by hate more than religious conviction.

Donna

I just sent you an e-mail, Vee. I have to agree with Donna, in that these never seem to end, throughout history. So long as there are men in charge and so long as there is the "My god is better than your god" belief. I think some aspects of some religions fuel the hatred, making a peaceful world an unattainable aspiration, sadly.

Your daughter sure lives an interesting life! It is so worrisome, which is what "they" intend, I suppose. No answers from me. It just makes me long for the boring 50s when my big problems were boys who seemed to be either Peter Pan or bore me stiff.

Vee, I'm so glad your daughter is safe and sound! I have no answers, I just wish everyone would grow up and co-exist peacefully. I am really beginning to fear that this might be something we, as a species, are biologically incapable of doing.

I read a couple of articles recently reporting that people who read fiction are much more empathetic towards others than people who don't. I would say we need a lot more readers in this world.

What a good idea, Sheri!

So glad your daughter is safe! Sometimes it helps to look at the bigger and wider picture. We are actually living in one of the less violent times in history and the overall trend is in the right direction, and the chances of living to old age are much better than our ancestors. Interesting Data

Thanks to all of you who responded.

Sheri re the reading idea, I wonder if it might be partly to do with the fact that to read, one has to take time, sit down and for at least a few minutes, concentrate on something other than what is going on around us plus ignoring the extra distractions of TV, radio, phones, youtube and all the rest of the paraphernalia the makes up the modern world. I also like Mary/woodnymph's idea that if we had more women in charge we would be in a better place . . . and I don't mean those strident "my bra burns more brightly than yours" but the vast majority of us who have to juggle work/children/partners . . . think of something for dinner, remember the dry cleaning, take the dog to the vet, post that birthday card . . . we never have time to get down to serious hating.

Merry, I found your eg's of the violence in the world interesting, especially the map. I sometimes think graphs can be too 'stretchable' either vertically or horizontally to be totally reliable. And certainly when we listen to the (bad) news of the terrible attacks on innocent citizens of Middle Eastern countries who put up with these atrocities day after day it does make our problems appear rather more trivial, although I in no way want to detract from the grief and horror felt by families caught up in this carnage.

Vee, the general consensus in the articles I read was that by reading fiction, the reader gets to "walk a mile in another's shoes" and experience lives and points of view that may be completely different from the reader's normal day-to-day life. In short, reading fiction teaches us to imagine what others are thinking and feeling and to take that into consideration when we speak or act.

https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/novel-finding-reading-literary-fiction-improves-empathy/

https://www.edutopia.org/blog/reading-literature-cultivates-empathy-in-students-elena-aguilar

I also agree a longer attention span would help!

Empathy from reading was proven to me.

My son never reads books but when he went to a concert recently bought an autobiography of the performer who had migrated from a poor part of Scotland to Australia with his family and mentioned some details of that early life.

Suddenly my son started to ask me about my experiences as a migrant. He had taken my life for granted, only knowing me as his mother, the Australian resident who had relatives in England and had no idea why I had taken the journey.

After reading the book, he assumed that I also was an economic migrant looking for a better life and was surprised that I had actually gone looking for adventure, not being content with the rather dull life I was living at the time.

There are many reasons why people want to change their life. Not all are able to do this, sadly. Sometimes a book has to be a substitute.

Sheri, thanks for the interesting articles. The idea that prisoners should be given 'literary' books is certainly laudable and, although I can't speak for the US penal system, over here many prisoners are unable to read (which says little for our education system) and the present crop of murderers/terrorists are forbidden (as they interpret it) to read, other than their holy book, in much the same way that women are denied education and no-one may sing, dance or play music

Annpan, I'm glad your son started to show some interest in your previous life. Had you never spoken of these events to him or is it a male thing and he just never listened? My late Mother would tell us children about her, very ordinary, life and about her later 'adventures' when she was able to travel around the world 'though never South of the Equator(!) On the other hand my Father told us virtually nothing about his young life or his family or his time during WWII and it wasn't until old age that he even mentioned he/we had relations in Australia but with no useful mention of names/destinations.

Vee, I don't recall telling my children much about my life in England although they did know that they had close relatives there who later wrote to my son when he was in boarding school.

However the other day I shocked my 35yo grandson. Somehow the subject of beaches came up and I was telling him that I had a good sandy beach where I lived by the end of WW2 and was able to play on it once the barbed wire had been taken down and the mines removed.

He was taken aback by the matter of fact way I mentioned this. He gasped at what I had said and stammered that I had "freaked him out"!

Me, too, Lacey.

I agree, lacey, though it seems impossible not too! But I'm sure if there were to be a 'body-count' of everyone lost to conflict during even the last hundred years, when we have considered ourselves to be so civilised, it would be found that more people were killed through 'religious conviction' than because of politics.

Yes, vee, I think that's true. But far too many have become convinced that God wants them to kill people for the sake of their faith. Wrong. Wrong. Wrong. If God isn't love--and love for everyone, everywhere-- then I for one don't want to have anything to do with such a faith. Perhaps you've seen the bumper sticker "God Bless Everyone. No exceptions."

Interesting discussion. I find Merryworld's comment particularly interesting, because it's one you almost never hear expressed - that we are living in a world of much less violence than so many have endured in the past. Wow ...

I completely agree with laceyvail re wars fought in the name of hate. I believe in diplomacy, cooperation and peace wherever possible. I want no part of any religion that preaches hatred of the "other." Gandhi said "An eye for an eye and the whole world will be blind...."

Lacey, bumper stickers are not much in evidence over here, I do however remember one from several years ago that might be reintroduced after our recent waste-of-time election which read "Come back Guy Fawkes all is forgiven"

I read the articles posted above by Sheri, where it says that only "literary" fiction caused the readers to have more empathy. Then, by pure coincidence, my sister sent me this article:

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/harry-potter-benefits_us_5936b4b7e4b0099e7faf3223

So, are the Harry Potter books considered "literary" fiction? (!)

As a huge Harry Potter fan, I say absolutely!

I should admit I have never read any of the Harry Potter books, despite J K Rowling having lived less than a mile from our previous house, attending school with our neighbour's children . . . the same school our two eldest children attended a few years later.

So are the HP books really works of 'literature' or just enjoyable stories for children? Does reading them make us better/nicer people?

<Does reading them make us better/nicer people?>

That is exactly what the article whose link I posted above says:

"A 2014 study found that kids who read “Harry Potter”are more likely to reduce prejudices toward minority groups and display greater levels of empathy."

Like you, I've never read the Harry Potter books, and notwithstanding what Sheri says above (grin), they are probably not great literature, along the lines of Booker prize shortlisted books.

I posted the article above because the Scientific American article that Sheri posted on Wednesday, June 7, says that only "literary" fiction improved people (more empathy, more tolerance). But this article about Harry Potter contradicts that.

Great literature or not, if Harry Potter makes children less prejudiced and more tolerant of people different to them, it produces an admirable end result.

Since they are exposed early in life to these books, I wonder if this tolerance carries over to their adult lives.

I read a little of one of the Harry Potter books and thought that there was rather a nasty and sadistic undertone in it. I can't remember the exact part but it was something about a boy writing out "lines" for punishment and getting pain inflicted as he did it. That was enough for me!

Interesting article reader and call me an old cynic but I am inclined to take most/many of these Scientific Studies with a pinch of salt. Perhaps it would be possible to suggest that children who read a lot of fiction are inclined to be more introverted, while the non/seldom readers are probably spending that time out kicking balls about and playing with their friends and therefore getting a more 'hands-on' feel for empathy with their fellows. This is all off the top of my head, but so many modern works of 'children's' fiction can be quite dark and disturbing I wonder if the sensitive child's attitudes towards his peers will be more understanding.

Learned articles notwithstanding, I honestly think almost any reading is good for kids and adults. Reading about people and places one would never otherwise personally encounter opens the mind, educates, enlarges (I hope) the reader's understanding and acceptance of the world in all its variety, and builds empathy for others by allowing the reader to share other's experiences and feelings. As far as Harry Potter goes, OK, it's not great literature, but it addresses great themes: right and wrong, good and evil, using one's powers for selfish or selfless objectives, and the biggest of all, growing up.

Annpan, the book you're recalling is Order of the Phoenix, in which the bad guys manage to take over Hogwarts and the truly horrible Dolores Umbrage punishes Harry by making him write lines which appear carved into his skin. It's my least favorite of the books, and the only one I have never re-read just because it made me so furious. I've always felt that it's really a tale about how easy it is to slip into fascism, and how we must resist ... which is a lot for a kid's book to take on.

I would suspect that any reasonably well written, character driven fiction would tend to increase empathy. We get into the minds of others, and see the world through another perspective.

Not exactly sure where the line for literary fiction is drawn, but I suspect it is higher than that. I would agree that formulaic fiction, while entertaining, probably doesn't have that effect.

I don't think that the fiction has to be "high" literary fiction, but the characters do have to be fully developed. The stuff that's just plot driven with cardboard characters--you all know authors who write that--just doesn't develop empathy. How could it?

And, yes, I consider Harry Potter books to be of the fully developed character type. As were all the children's books I really loved.

Speaking of empathy: two men recently were murdered on a train because they attempted to defend two young Muslim women from a man who was hurling insults at them. One of the defenders was a young man who had just graduated college. His final words were, "Tell everyone on the train that I love them." Makes me cry every time I think of it.

Vee, I am very glad your daughter is safe. Let's hope it becomes no more than a story she gets to tell when dining out.

As for the violence in the world these days, I believe that religion, ethnicity, race, and orientation are excuses rather than genuine motives, though the actors may themselves not actually know this. The world is crowded, and getting more crowded every day. Resources are scarce for many people. The future looks very uncertain. In my opinion, all this stress is the real cause of violent behavior.

When I was in college I took an introductory psychology class. We studied a classic experiment. Rats confined in groups have a very low level of violence initially, but as crowding is introduced it gets worse, the more the crowding the more intense the violence. Restricting resources makes it worse, but even with plentiful resources, crowding alone produces this effect. Our professor speculacted that population growth could have the same effect on humans. I do think we are more than just smart rats, but perhaps this is how our primitive brain works.

Folks, we really do need to do that empathy-inducing reading!

I had a course studying that same experiment, Rose.