Seedlings with spots/curl

7 years ago

I would appreciate if someone can help me identify a couple issues I have with my seedlings this year. They are growing indoors at 75f and I am growing 5 varieties. 3 of the 5 look very healthy and are ready to go out to the garden. As I pulled out trays to place outside to start the hardening off process I noticed a couple leaf problems.

The Red Brandywine have these yellow spots forming on the older leaves. The young ones seem to be green.

The Amish Paste tomatoes leaves have all curled up and stems are drooping. They also seem to be a bluish green color. This is my first year growing these though so don't know if that color is normal?

All my tomatoes are being watered the same- every other day- and getting the same light- 12 hours now.

I have been looking through all the nutrient deficiencies I can find and have only come up with possible Mag deficiency on the Amish tomatoes? Maybe just not enough water? Hoping the spots on the Brandywine are not a disease. It sure looks like the late blight I see at the end of the season with these- not when they are seedlings!

Everything was planted in Johnny's seed starting mix, and everything is in 4" round pots now. Last week I applied Neptunes fish and seaweed to everything (tablespoon per gallon).

Appreciate any help!

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Comments (6)

PcolaGrower
7 years ago
I think you might be overwatering them. The spots on the leaf don't look too bad, but the Amish ones look pretty sad. I would hold off on watering them. Every other day is an awful lot of water for such small plants. I usually wait till the soil is almost bone dry and the plants almost wilt before I water. Also they look pretty old, when do you plan on planting them out? The sooner the better I think. Then hopefully they might come out of that funk. You definitely have some kind of issue. Some of the more experienced will probably be able to tell you a lil more. Good luck.
theforgottenone1013 (SE MI zone 5b/6a)
7 years ago
last modified: 7 years ago
Those plants look awfully big for a 4-inch pot. Might explain why you have to water every other day (I hope you are watching the plants and feeling the moisture in the soil before watering them). Having them in seed starting mix is also a problem. Either pot them up into a good potting mix and hope for the best, or get them in the ground and hope for the best. They look pretty far gone at this point.

Rodney
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I do not know your problem but maybe this will start you. If the problem is a deficiency, noticing whether it started on the older or younger leaves first might narrow the cause (if they are big enough). Nitrogen & phosphorous deficiency symptoms first appearing on the older leaves. Symptoms on the younger leaves include Calcium & Sulfur. Purple leaves on the lower surfaces can be seen with a Nitrogen deficiency & leaf curl downward is seen with a Sulfur deficiency. Leaves curled under are seen with a Nitrogen excess. Slow growth can be due to Nitrogen, Phosphorous, Potassium, & Sulfur. Here are some tomato leaf pictures: http://www.luminet.net/~wenonah/min-def/tomatoes.htm http://www.uga.edu/vegetable/tomato.html Tomato diseases http://ftsg.ifas.ufl.edu/DISMIK.HTM Gardenweb has a neat forum on Tomato Pests & Diseases. If you think you might have a disease you could post pictures on this forum. Any symptoms of leaf spots, abnormal veins, stem & bud character, plant size, etc., might help identify the cause. Here are some tomato leaf pictures: http://www.luminet.net/~wenonah/min-def/tomatoes.htm http://www.uga.edu/vegetable/tomato.html Tomato diseases http://ftsg.ifas.ufl.edu/DISMIK.HTM Gardenweb has a neat forum on Tomato Pests & Diseases. If you think you might have a disease you could post pictures on this forum.
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The light intensity reference was referring to when you go from one light setup to another like seedlings under some T8 and then move them into a system with a 1000w hps, for example. Plants will develop leaves based on the light they have been getting and when moved under something more intense it can affect them sometimes in a very bad way. The guys at my local hydro shop moved a sunflower plant that had been under a 450w MH to a 750w LED they were testing. The LED was a good 2ft above the plant and you would think would be fine but it fried the plant in a couple days. Not from heat but light. Leaves curled up and died. The plant recovered under that same LED but the leaves were like half the size they had been under the MH. Anyway, I am sure that's not what is going on with you seedlings but that's what I was referring to. It's kind of like when you harden off plants to go outside and get them used to temp and changes gradually. Plants are very reactive. To answer you question, seedlings need a lot of light so they don't get leggy. I use dual 4 ft 32w t8s for mine placed about a inch above the seedlings. Sometimes I'll use my T5s but you gotta keep them farther away since they put off more heat. That light you put the link to is not much light. Problem with the question of will it work or is it enough is that you could propagate under that and grow lettuce but it'll be slow going and you'll have leggy seedlings. So it'll work, just not real well. Look at this way, plants grow in direct proportion to the amount of light they get.
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<neighbor did some concrete work across the fence while we were on vacation last week. Maybe some dust from the bags blew over onto the plants and burned them??> That could do it. While I have no direct experience with concrete dust on my plants, concrete dust is extremely alkaline and burns skin all the time. If concrete dust got on your plants and then it rained lightly or you had heavy dew so that the concrete residue beaded up and pooled in droplets that beaded and pooled on foliage, that could definitely cause burn that looks exactly like what you have. Luckily, the situation, while cosmetically annoying, isn't dire the way weed killer drift from a neighbor would be. Just prune off the damaged foliage, and new foliage will be healthy unless repeat exposure happens. <Like I said, they were doing pretty well and looking healthy up to this point. Maybe the hot weather and inconsistent watering is the cause then? Aside from the size of the containers.> I wouldn't "aside" the container size. That's probably the major thing. 90 degrees is normal summer for the mid-Atlantic and tomatoes in adequate growing conditions should be doing do quite well in those temps. The larger plants' root systems get, the more stress they experience in too-small containers. Those plants are already very stuntedfor plants that have been in their final pots for 2 months, and it's almost certainly most due to the container size. What are their varieties? Unless they are very small dwarf plants that top out, they will do increasingly poorly in such small containers. They're still manageable enough to pot up into larger containers, and in MD, you still have time for the plants to recover from the overcrowding and give you some fruit before frost. How large the pots need to be depends on what varieties they are and how large those varieties can be expected to get. What are they? As for the plants in the box, that's a good-sized box, but 6 is too crowded. What are the varieties in the box? What you should do will depend on those varieties' growth habits. Also, be aware that container plants require regular and frequent fertilizing, preferably with liquid fertilizer. If you're not doing so, expect your plants to go downhill very quickly once they start setting fruit, even when they're moved to containers that are large enough for them.
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PcolaGrower
7 years ago
You might still be able to salvage them, but like Rodney said....They are too big for those 4in pots. They need room to grow.
Stu Zone 7a NY
Original Author
7 years ago
Thanks for all the suggestions! Makes sense that they outgrew the pots. Last year they really outgrew them so I started the seeds two weeks later this year. Still too long I guess. It has only been 5 weeks since I planted the seeds. I water them only when they are dried out but that ends up every other day. The peppers next to them go 4 days or so before drying out.

Well, after watering and then letting them sit outside for the day the Amish tomato leaves flattened back out and the stems perked up mostly. Everything going in next weekend so hopefully they make it. I hate to plant things out this weekend with the temperatures forecast to drop again this week.

Oh, and the soil i am using is Johnny's 512 mix- says it is good for starting, transplanting and container growing.
Stu Zone 7a NY
Original Author
6 years ago
Those Amish paste tomatoes turned out to be a pretty finicky bunch! Clearly had outgrown pot, but other tomatoes did as well and were healthier. I found when hardening them off that if I didn't water one day, the stems would droop and leaves would curl. After watering they sprung right back up and uncurled most leaves in a few hours. So i just watered every day while in the pot outside. Planted out in the garden a week ago and now they look just as healthy as the other tomatoes. No drooping or curling- guess they were just dying to get outside and play in the dirt!
gorbelly
6 years ago
Those are pretty huge for 5 weeks from sowing!

Seedlings with spots/curl

Comments (6)

PcolaGrower

theforgottenone1013 (SE MI zone 5b/6a)

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Seedlings with spots/curl

Comments (6)

PcolaGrower

theforgottenone1013 (SE MI zone 5b/6a)

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PcolaGrower

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gorbelly

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Stu Zone 7a NY
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