Honestly I think a better solution would be to find a fixer upper in a great neighborhood and spend the next several months making it look good again. That will hold value better than anything Pulte builds

I would keep any upgrades to a minimum if possible as most tract and production builders will really gouge you for them and your ROI will not be there since you are considering moving within five years after purchase.

Although we currently own a home, we were much like your situation in experiencing frustration with searching for land and the time involved in building custom. At one time, we talked to a local production builder (Pahlisch Homes) about making a few modifications for one of their homes that was "OK" but the cost was higher than what we will be getting with our build that is larger with much higher levels of finish and build quality.

I can empathize with you ODD. The entire process is very draining and difficult. I wanted to give up many times and it took some joy out of it. We are breaking ground Monday and I have curtailed any excitement until we see some progress.

Good luck and perhaps this gives you a bit more time to plan for the next home.

I built a tract home aka cookie cutter with Centex Homes in the Dallas area in 2005. We could only do/choose what they had listed as their options or upgrades. The biggest choice we had was to enclose the formal living and make a study. We were supposed to stay for 5-7 years, then the market sucked and we are still here, although just started the custom home plan journey. The good thing to that is the equity we built.

Around this area, it seems the houses that are priced over 300K do offer more options, like moving walls, etc.

Iagree with others, don't pay for upgrades unless you know it's best to do while the house is being built. Our only upgrade regret was not putting in a sprinkler system. We should have done it then.

Oh, fixer uppers... We had that discussion and it didn't last more than 15 seconds, lol! It is a good idea, though.

Sigh.

At least, by getting out of this rental, I can go get a dog! (Landlord forbids animals.)

If anyone else has any production house info or tips to share, I'm all ears. This will be our second time building a tract home, which also makes the process more familiar and comfortable.... And I'm sure there will be more learning experiences to be gained. ;-)

...Like whether or not painting pork chops is a good idea, lol.

@One Devoted Dame

We went through a similar process recently (just out of attorney review and this is what I found)

• Windows -- there were a predefined list of areas where windows could be added as an option.
• We wanted additional windows in our walk out basement and were told no way. But with enough nagging he added 2 additional windows.
• Cladding - I am not sure but if it is something that you want, ask and be persistent.
• 3rd party inspections -- we are allowed 2. Asked about additional inspections and were told no.
• We added the optional 2ft addition to our kitchen but looking back we should have asked for even more. By the time we asked, we had already signed the contract and it was too late.

Look at the brochure/plans that the builder has, post them here, ask for suggestions, make a list of your wishes and take them to the builder. Worst thing he can say is no.

One Devoted Dame -

What is the purpose of building new house if you intend to sell within 5 years? Most experts advise NOT buying a home if you plan to be there for such a short period of time.

All of the transaction costs associated with buying & selling in such a short time will likely eat most/all of the home appreciation. There will also be many upfront costs of a new build (window treatments, landscaping, ect) that you will not recoup.

Also, if the development is not fully finished within 5 years, it may be very difficult to sell your home, while competing with the builder's new builds.

If you are dead set on owning, why not buy an existing home? You aren't thrilled with the new build and your husband "wants to be done quickly." Given this, and the info noted above, an existing home seems like the way to go.

ODD, Shakespeare or someone said, "Haste makes waste!"

I'm sure you and your husband want out of your rental. But take a deep breath and think about the options. Buying and selling in 5 years is an iffy proposition. Maybe you will and maybe you won't. As other posters have noted, a tract home finished by December (?) may or may not be saleable in 5 years at a profit. So many variables, especially with tracts. Finish cheaply and quickly; sell cheaply but perhaps not quickly.

Have you considered (seriously) looking at existing housing stock, either to buy as is or to buy and remodel with an architect's and builder's consultation?

For a five year investment, you may need to look at your real estate investment in a different light, i.e., buy something in a neighborhood which is already desirable, so that in a relatively short five years, the investment has matured into an even more desirable investment for someone else. Believe me, five years goes by very quickly. Location-location-location!

Just a thought!

Y'all are totally on the same page as me. I have the same concerns, and have brought them up. The reason we wanted to go the custom route to begin with was because we couldn't find anything we really liked that currently existed.

The day he told me he wanted a new Pulte, I sent him links to existing homes in the area (with nicer finishes than what you can get in a new tract house), and the suggestion went over like a lead balloon.

Competition for existing housing is fierce here, and he doesn't want to deal with bidding wars (and I totally don't blame him there). He also just likes new stuff, especially houses. I can't change that. ;-)

Believe me, I have tried. And tried. I'm the kind of girl who refuses to buy something unless I absolutely love it, and I am super picky (which naturally results in few possessions, lol). I consider it a waste of money to buy things that I don't absolutely go crazy for.

If the house isn't worth selling within 5 years, then we'll just stay there until it is worth selling. I don't like it (like I mentioned previously, tears were shed), but this is what he wants to do. He really and truly believes this is the best way for us to achieve our life goals.

Y'all have no idea how much this pains me, but my soul mate has
decided (for now, anyway) to go shopping for a new house. He wants to
build a quick tract home, live in it for no longer than 5 years, and
then sell it.

We have a ton of these houses in our area, and quite a few of my friends live in them. Know what? It's an okay choice. My thoughts:

- These houses are relatively economical to build, if you don't go crazy with the extras, and my friends' houses are decorated nicely and are cute.

- You'll go in knowing the cost of your house, something you'll not do with a custom house.

- People on this board are into optimization of layout ... and tract houses don't have that. Expect the pantry to be on the opposite side of the kitchen, the laundry to be far from the bedrooms, etc. But this is what most people have --while it's not optimal, it's also not awful.

- They tend to be built builder-basic. Expect low-quality windows, cabinets, etc.

- The lots tend to be very, very small. This appeals to some people, of course.

- I do not think planning to live in such a house for 5 years is a great idea. Thing about theses houses is, They are plentiful and near-identical, and you won't be the only person selling ... thus, you either need to sell for the lowest price OR have something unique that'll attract people to your house.

(1) Can I add windows?

Remember that if the builder says no, you can always call in a handy-man and install a window on your own. For a cost, obviously.

(3) Are 3rd party inspectors allowed during construction?

My guess is no.

My personal take on this whole process: I'd be okay with it ... for a short time, if I knew I could build what I really want, designed just to my taste later. I'd say "no" to the extras with the idea that it's not going to be forever and they wouldn't add big to the resale. I'd also say "stay neutral" in your colors and choices.

My daughter and her husband just bought a tract house on the re-sale market; I think it's a fine first house for them -- they're 23, just married, focused on their first professional jobs, and so in love that they'd be happy living in a tent. However, I suspect the original owners lost big on this deal. They put plantation shutters on all the windows (those run $400-500/window), they put in an in-ground pool and hot tub and privacy fence, they put in a big brick patio, they put in granite countertops, they put a big shed in the back yard ... all in a 1600 sf tract house with a one-car garage on a 1/4 acre lot. In a nutshell, they tried to turn a tract house into a luxury house. Good for my girl -- she's getting all this nice stuff for not much more than the other houses in the neighborhood; she can enjoy it all -- but bad for the original builders. Don't follow the builder's example.

Competition for existing housing is fierce here, and he doesn't want
to deal with bidding wars (and I totally don't blame him there). He
also just likes new stuff, especially houses. I can't change that. ;-)

My daughter and her husband "lost" several houses before they succeeded with the one I just described. It's a seller's market in our area.

Believe me, I have tried. And tried. I'm the kind of girl who
refuses to buy something unless I absolutely love it, and I am super
picky (which naturally results in few possessions, lol). I consider it a
waste of money to buy things that I don't absolutely go crazy for.

I'm with you: When we were first married, we furnished our house with "Colonial Hand-Me-Down" and "Contemporary Yard Sale". Aside from sofa sets, which don't last forever, we have only purchased furniture that we intend to keep forever. It's a philosophy that's worked well for us ... so I understand that it's hard for you to say this is a temporary house; however, I can tell you that the house I want now at 50 is not the same house I would've built if I could have done so in my 20s. I've learned a whole lot about what I like by living in other houses.

Do a thorough search on Pulte and then show your husband. It won't be pretty.

Pulte Reviews

More Reviews

And even more

There's a lot more too.

One other thought. It seems to me that both halves of a couple need to be happy with a decision and it shouldn't be one sided. Why isn't he taking your feelings into consideration?

The first house we purchased was a new Pulte house. Unfortunately it was a couple decades ago in the Chicago area. I think the quality very much depends on the construction crews in a particular area. We never had any problems like those described above. As I recall we did have 2-3 designated walk-through's. We were not allowed to be onsite whenever we wanted to visit. I seem to recall an inspector being mentioned, but it wasn't common then so we didn't do it (and we were young and ignorant). I suspect some of this will depend on TX laws about real estate.

I do have to agree with the above comment concerning available land. More importantly, how built out is the specific neighborhood? How many houses are planned? The neighborhood I lived in had about 350 houses. Anyone that tried to sell before most houses were built had a lot of trouble. By the end of the neighborhood, Pulte was giving away free basements (that hurt since we couldn't afford one) and other premiums. That hurt our equity. The advantage to buying when they first opened was we had a premium lot that backed to a 13 acre park. (It's what helped sell our house 6 years later). Something to definitely consider.

He really and truly believes this is the best way for us to achieve our life goals.

I'm 62 years old and think I've seen quite a bit in my years. I can tell you without a doubt, he's wrong.

He's totally taking my feelings into consideration.... It is rare that we disagree, but when we do, he's the captain of the ship. We've been together for over 20 years and it works for us. :-)

Best of luck to you. I am glad you have a system that works for you. I can honestly say that my husband of 23 years would not, could not, make a unilateral decision about something this important that was causing me this much unhappiness. We'd keep working to find a compromise of some sort. I think buying an existing home is such a compromise. It makes more financial sense, and you can get your puppy. I just can't imagine you'd get any sort of equity in 5 years in a Pulte house.

DD...you might want to ck here for small track builders in your area....

http://www.bing.com/search?q=small+track+builders+in+central+texas&qs=n&form=QBLH&sp=-1&pq=small+track+builder&sc=0-19&sk=&cvid=35E10CB7DE7D41B88C48FA234619B98E

In all fairness to my husband, he's out of town on business at the moment, and has not been home to *see* the extent to which I am having a hard time dealing with this situation (and for that I'm actually kinda grateful). We are discussing things via email, where I can calmly and elegantly express myself.

I don't want to make him feel guilty by crying in front of him over this. I just don't. I'm sensitive, he knows that, and he's sensitive to me, and I know that. I know I'm being emotional/irrational about it, and I just gotta work through it, ya know?

I was very much looking forward to working with an architect, getting a super awesome house, and having this really neat learning experience, and then it was all suddenly like, "Could you live in this house for a few years? [link to Pulte]" not more than 3 days ago. And I was like, "Okay, what just happened here?" lol The disappointment was real, and it hurt, but it won't kill me. ;-)

He explained everything to me. I listened. I shared my concerns with him. He listened and tried to soothe them. This will make him much happier in the short term, and when he's happy, I'm happy. I'm sure that once he comes home, his excitement over all of this will be infectious and I won't be such a whiner anymore, lol.

I guess sometimes in life ya just gotta take one step back for every two forward. I have put away my architecture books for now, but I won't get rid of them. :-)

And I was like, "Okay, what just happened here?"

So what did just happen?

Why did he suddenly switch gears to building a tract home?

And what is his rationale if he only plans to live in it "for a few years"?

ODD

Have you ever bought a tract home before? I have, 3 times. You pay significantly more, for less quality. I have no experience with Pulte, but I do with 3 other reputable tract home builders in my area. Every single house that we have had has had significant problems that have required much revision after we bought the house.

House 1, the linoleum floors in the kitchen were so uneven that the builder had to come in and rip up the floor and the floor joists creating a complete opening from my kitchen into the basement. At the time I had a toddler and an infant. Not fun!

My second home, we realized when the first big snow hit, that the builder forgot the drain tile around the house! Every single window and some cracks in the walls in the basement were leaking into the basement, as well as the door in the walk up because the drain was not big enough. Whenever it rained or snowed, water would come pouring into our basement! I remember cleaning it up in tears one day! They had to come in and dig up all around the house, and for some reason they dug the dirt and it was in a pile in my basement! (Again, tears!) They ended up making the problem better, but it was never completely eliminated, as it always leaked a little.

Next, third home. The air conditioning system on the second floor was inadequate. They sized it improperly, and when the air conditioning sub went back to the tract home company and told them that the unit that they installed was too small for my home, they fired him. That's right, fired. After that, for years, whenever we would call to have the system looked at because it was over 100 degrees in my upstairs, they could only send someone to check the system when it was a cool day, and they would stick that stupid little thermometer up into the ceiling vent and look at me and say, "it's blowing cool air, so it works". We ended up having to have the unit changed and put a fan in the attic. Problem solved, on our dime!

Don't even get me started on my family members home where the bathrooms weren't waterproofed properly so after 6 years, when the whole family was getting sick, they realized they had black mold. Sure enough, they started ripping out the tiles, and the tract builder had made some major waterproofing shortcuts, meaning he didn't waterproof at all, and they had black mold almost through all the bathrooms!

We are building a custom home now, and I would say, wait. You will not have any equity in a tract home in 5 years. The first 5 to ten years of any loan are interest heavy. You also have no idea what problems this house might have, and most of the time the tract home builder is able to absolve themselves of liability. On top of the fact that you pay for quality, how do you think that the tract home builder makes their money, but they deliver garbage. Having done it, my husband I decided that we would never do it again.

Sorry to be the bearer of bad news, but maybe you can change your husband's mind, and even if you have to stay put, and wait for another 2 to five years, you can get what you really want, in the end! Best of luck!

So what did just happen?

Why did he suddenly switch gears to building a tract home?

And what is his rationale if he only plans to live in it "for a few years"?

I don't really know what sparked the sudden change in direction, but I know that he isn't the kind of person to spontaneously do that; he's been thinking about it for a long time. He waits until he has thoroughly turned over the situation in his mind -- sometimes for weeks or months -- before he approaches me, which I appreciate. (Conversely, I have to "talk to think" so the poor man gets all of my scatterbrained thoughts as they come pouring out and then has to sift through all of the irrelevant stuff, lol.)

The rationale is this: Buy a smaller, basic, no upgrades house in a nice, more desirable area. Wait a few years, be happy that we aren't renting anymore, lol, learn more about house care, and as the market goes up (it's been crazy here; unsustainable in my opinion), our payments will be used to help build equity instead of paying our landlord. Rent is atrocious, and for junk houses. Everyone says not to rent for more than 3-4 years if you plan to stay here; we've already been here for 6.

Housing inventory can't keep up with the growth. He believes this will continue for the foreseeable future.

I really can't argue with his logic; it all appears sound to me. Except that last part, but it's not a matter of logic; it's a matter of opinion.

Have you ever bought a tract home before?

Yep. :-)

You will not have any equity in a tract home in 5 years. The first 5
to ten years of any loan are interest heavy. You also have no idea what
problems this house might have (...)

Most houses built here are tract homes, and everything has experienced an insane increase in value over the past few years. Since most of the existing stock is tract, I can't see how a tract home built in 2012 (or 2007, or 1997) is any less problematic than one built in 2017. Having a home inspector evaluate the house should, in theory, help us avoid the big issues.

i may have missed something above...why not just buy an existing house and renovate?

We bought the worst house withthebest lot on the block 3.5 years ago, fixed it up and now i think it's worth around 60% more than our all-in investment.

So what I'm hearing is that the funds aren't quite there for the custom home you want, and you both are sick of renting, so he figures the next closest thing is a cheaper tract home new build.

"I can't see how a tract home built in 201x is any less problematic than one built in 2017."

Because the older tract homes will already come with fully landscaped yards, window treatments throughout, potential upgrades from the builder-grade fixtures, and be in fully developed communities with no new construction.

You will spend thousands of dollars on the stuff noted above to make your new build tract home livable. You will also spend thousands in closing costs & other related costs. When you go to sell in just a few years, you will lose 7% to realtors, plus another rounds of closing costs/fees.

It will be VERY difficult to make up all of those costs when you go to sell <5 years, especially if you will still be competing with the builder's new homes.

Stinky Muffin

You said exactly what I was thinking. People who buy tract homes that have already been lived in are looking for upgrades. Finished basements, upgraded kitchens, outdoor living, window treatments. All will cost tens of thousands of dollars, or more, in my case. Noone wants to buy a builder grade tract home that someone has lived in, that hasn't been upgraded, and pay more than a new tract home.

P.S. Regarding timeline... The whole house renovation took our GC less than two months. The house is small at 1200, 3 bed/2bath.

Sigh.

lol

The funds are there. We will be putting a hefty down payment on the tract home.... The money that would have been used for 1+ acre of land plus a budgeted $20k of architect's fees (I assume that would be enough). My husband simply does not want to wait any longer to own a home, and going custom means we will wait another 2+ years.

I am perfectly okay renting. Yeah, it's tight, and slightly annoying, but I'm ultimately fine with it. We have been casually looking for land since we got here, but hesitated to buy because our vision is a bit unique, and we would like professional assistance in selecting a parcel to make sure it will work. We also haven't really found anything we're totally in love with, which totally doesn't help with his patience.

I asked him this morning about buying a foreclosure and rehabbing it. He is not interested. It is a really good idea, though, so thanks to everyone who mentioned it, including those who private messaged me.

It's a good thing I've been around this forum for a little bit, because if I was new here, y'all would have run me off already. :-) Here I make it clear in my OP that I don't want to discuss specifics, and I got sucked into it, anyway. My fault for answering the questions, obviously... I gotta learn to ignore people!

So, y'all are gonna have to forgive me for being rude, but I'm not gonna try to appease anyone here, or justify anything else.

I am still very much interested in people's experiences with various homebuilders and what they were/were not permitted to do, and how/if they successfully overcame an initial "no". :-)

Thanks!!!

Aaaaaah!!!!

Miss Magdalena, I love you! I'll be sure to tell my husband that you helped me feel better about all of this. :-)

I mean, I'm still a little hesitant, but I don't feel quite as fearful now. I would love a private message from you; I looked on your page and couldn't see the button, otherwise I just would've messaged you directly instead of asking you here, lol.

We also have plans to upgrade very carefully... 4th bedroom (we have 5 kids, and they'll be 1-2-2 in the rooms), lot/parcel orientation (I wanna maximize our sunshine), and elevation. Everything else is gravy, and we'll be prudent (and neutral) in our selections.

I'm not as concerned about being on top of my neighbors, because well honestly, the rental is a production home on a tiny lot. I can almost lean out the window and spit at my neighbor's house. ;-) Nearly anything else will be better than what I'm in currently.

Bless you, Hon. Thanks.

(that's totally off topic, but One Devoted Dame, I truly feel a soul spirit in you..but you speak English much more beautifully which is understandable lol..so you've no idea how much I'm enjoying your posts and try to learn from them)

we did live in a new build once..well it was our opportunity to own just something, since we won a lottery for subsidized apartments..wasn't in the US. We waited for it to be built for more than two years. Then everything was crooked to the point one wall looked like this leaning tower of Pisa..when we moved I think electricity was the only thing that worked lol..the subsidized apartments were kinda put in between higher end ones, but finished much cheaper of course..the kitchen was close to being non existent..just a box with a sink, that's all..we had to put our own, after some short time, since this thing was non-functional. Well that was an exceptionally bad builder, the homes became a talk of the town(so when we sold eventually we sold for the same price we got it, and we got it very low due to that lottery thing, not a market price ..the buyers told us bluntly "everybody knows your problematic homes"..well we couldn't argue that..as all the neighbors were trying to sue the builder at this point..:)

But. It became to be great location once developed. It was beautifully landscaped..walking distance to schools, preschools, new amazing playground. stores..not a rare thing where we lived but it did come together quite nicely and looked and was a great neighborhood, after a couple of years.

And of course it was my very first my own space ever. So as bad as it was built, and as long as it took(and we were very young and mortgage plus rental plus daycare plus bills-we barely could afford to eat properly while they took their time building) -I was elated. And I remember it fondly.

I'm not sure I was trying to make any point..:) Except maybe that it takes time for a new community to become beautiful..but you know that. Just sharing.

Oh my gosh, Miss April, do you know that immediately after I saw that you had liked another post of mine, I went straight to your page and couldn't find your Message button....

I was gonna write you a personal note, and almost asked you here in the thread, lol, but since you hadn't actually posted a reply yet, I thought, "Maybe it would be a bit weird for me to be like, 'Hey! Message me!' for no discernible reason, lol.

I've no idea where the Message button is but I'll be very happy if it starts blinking or something..:)

Hi ODD, re tract homes and upgrades. I'm not sure how it works in Texas, however, where we are, it is much better never to put upgrades in through the builder. This can be done much cheaper once you own and live in the home. Builders will charge xtra xtra fo upgrades. I've seen people move into their homes, and a year or so later, rip up carpet and put down hardwood, for example. They felt this was way more cost efffective than having the builder install wood floors. As far as adding windows etc, I guess it depends on the builder. In our area big production builders will not change a thing. Whereas, smaller builders seem to be more flexible. By the way, there is nothing wrong with a tract home. Believe me, i have lived in many, in different cities and countries. Location is way more important, however.

My experience with tract homes in my area is not good. Maybe the code in other states makes them an okay choice, but where we are, they seem to have a lot of big problems. I'm always of the mindset that "good things are worth waiting for". I can also understand impatience, because a custom build is a very long road. We are approaching year 5, but the first 3 there was no rush, so we took our time with the architect. Good luck! I wish you all the best and I hope that you and your hubby find exactly what you are looking for!! Blessings and best wishes!

We are just breaking ground on our "tract" home. First home we will own after 20 years of marriage so I am thrilled. I did however do my homework and in our area there are no less than 8 new large housing neighborhoods and at least a dozen builders. Some larger that are national, a few medium regional companies, and a few local family owned, after touring all the neighborhoods we could afford and all the builders in those neighborhoods I picked a smaller family owned builder. Their basics are in many ways upgrades to most of the other builders and the floor plan we picked the minute I walked in just felt right to me. Tons of windows, great flow, my choice of three nice exteriors (one which i fell in love with), and basement is standard with a rough in for bathroom down the road. Many builders here do slab and being from ND originally and the tornadoes there I can't imagine not having a basement.

As we are just in the first stages I am hoping for the best, but after doing research and adding the options I wanted (some which were not something they usually do but they are and for reasonable pricing) I am looking forward to my home this fall.

The only thing we compromised on is a smaller lot, 8300 sq ft. But there is a small hill in the back and green space behind us. So once the landscaping is in it will be very private and a manageable size. Originally we thought we wanted a one story but the two story I fell in love with means more yard space for the dogs and many other perks I hadn't thought of with a 2 story vs a one story. Eventually we will finish out the basement in time, no rush as the kids are in college and don't live with us.

I would seriously look around in your area for a smaller builder that has great reviews and you might be surprised what you can get versus the big building companies. Good luck and I understand not looking at preowned homes as here the minute a decent one hits the market there are a dozen offers and bidding wars. My poor nerves couldn't take that, so now we build and wait!

Hey ODD, glad I could help! I think I checked the thing that needed to be checked to enable messaging. Would love to hear from you and answer any questions you might have.

Full disclosure, I was a tract home snob up until we decided it was the right thing to do for us. Had it not been for the neighborhood and location, we would not have done it. Most tract home builders have terrible reputations due to shoddy workmanship and cutting corners for more profit. I think that's changing (slowly in some areas) since they realize a good product is the thing that keeps people coming back and legal fees suck up those profits. My builder is a national one, and they offer a few different types of neighborhood price points. Some are much less expensive, catering to first time owners and some are higher end catering to retirees. We purchased in the latter. The lower price point neighborhoods, based on online reviews, seem to be the the ones that get the bad reviews. I found most of those reviews to be based on unrealistic expectations.

Regarding upgrades, now or later: We have wood floors throughout the main level except bathrooms and laundry. That totals approx 1800 sf and our wood floor upgrade was $13k for an Armstrong engineered hardwood 5in wide plank. It's a good product, but certainly not the best. I got a couple of bids, and they were pretty much comparable. I'm sure there were other things that would have been less expensive or we would have had more choice on the product had we done it on our own, but I just didn't want to deal with the hassle of ripping something out and replacing.

It's a good thing I've been around this forum for a little bit,
because if I was new here, y'all would have run me off already. :-)
Here I make it clear in my OP that I don't want to discuss specifics,
and I got sucked into it, anyway. My fault for answering the questions,
obviously... I gotta learn to ignore people!

You know how topics ebb and flow on this board. I'm sorry our off-topic responses hit you hard ... at a time you weren't in a mood for /weren't ready to accept anything except consolation.

My best overall advice: Don't hurry. You may convince him to stick with the original plan, or you may -- unlikely as it seems at this moment -- come around to his way of thinking. But don't rush into either choice while you're not in agreement.

We sold our huge, as-custom-as-it-gets home last year

Keep in mind that "custom-as-it-gets" doesn't increase the value of your house ... to another person. Custom means you built it for yourself and your specific needs, and those don't necessarily match other people's specific needs. For example, we're not putting a toilet in our master bath ... instead we're placing the downstairs half bath adjacent to the master bath. That's a custom detail because it's something that suits us, but it's not something that most people want, and it would probably hurt us on resale. Similarly, my husband hates the color green ... if it's your favorite and you've splurged on green tile throughout, it may be custom /may suit you, but that customization wouldn't make my husband like your house better.

An analogy: Let's say you have a dress or a suit custom-made, and it is perfect: The color, the cut, every detail is just right for you. That doesn't mean it would suit me at all.

Full disclosure, I was a tract home snob up until we decided it was the right thing to do for us.

Like I said earlier, a good number of my friends live in tract homes, and they're not bad. They're cookie cutter and may be problematic at resale, but I'm not saying I would never, ever go that direction.

"Keep in mind that "custom-as-it-gets" doesn't increase the value of your
house ... to another person. Custom means you built it for yourself
and your specific needs, and those don't necessarily match other
people's specific needs."

Absolutely agree. My point being, that although I picked out every single detail of our previous home, over time, it didn't suit us anymore.

"They're cookie cutter and may be problematic at resale..."

I really think that value at resale is more of a function of the quality of the neighborhood and location. Many tract home neighborhoods are located in illogical urban sprawl areas and are clear cut which removes any topographical interest. I would stay away from these neighborhoods. I would also stay away from any neighborhood that has an expected completion date years into the future.

What about a smaller, local builder with some spec homes? We have several developments (one I can see as I type this and one 1/2 mile down the road) that local builders are putting up houses. If you get to them early on, they're normally pretty good to work with AND, their work is better than a large tract home builder. It's not custom, but maybe a step up from a large tract developer.

Hi ODD - so, I've done this too. My first ever home was a modular, built by a small local company. I was allowed to make all sorts of changes to the floor plans, and added a few windows. I should have added more but I was young and pretty stupid at that point in my life. Ha ha. That was a solidly-built house, mostly because the local company was a solid company. They used a "good" modular company and then they cared about doing quality work onsite. I loved that little starter home and it still, to this day, is probably my favorite home.

I also just recently bought a tract home, as a second/vacation home at the beach. The town where I bought this second home is "over-run" with production builders. They are everywhere there, every company known to man seems to have a development nearby. I looked at houses for over a year until the right one for me came on the market. What I've found so far about this house is that it is pretty on the outside. There are a number of problems with it though. Build 'em fast and build 'em cheap is definitely the name of the production game.

This is the very definition of a first world problem. :) If you end up in a tract home, chances are you will be just fine. :) Hey, at least you can select a lot you like and get a floor plan that appeals to you. If you are able to be on-site, I would also suggest walking the fine line between making sure they know you are involved and care, without going so far over that line as to incur a PITA tax.

As I understand it, PITA taxes can be avoided if the intruder delivers cookies every time she shows up. Doesn't hurt to wear a dress, either. ;-)

We did this too, and really, it was fine.

We bought a 3500 sq ft house on a pre-sale basis from a mid-size builder in the Seattle area. Overall, I thought the quality was good enough. There was a major problem with the second floor sloping in our house plan and this affected several homes, but the builder was very responsive about it and fixed it. We also had a problem with the front door that needed to be replaced and painted. They did that too, although there was a problem with the painter using a paint machine that got into our heating ducts and spewed fine droplets of paint everywhere. It was not a pleasant experience but I will give the builder credit for trying to fix things. I would say the most painful aspect of owning that home was dealing with most of the not-so-customer-oriented contractors for all the fixes during the warranty period and the drain on my time (luckily I was a stay-at-home mom).

I don't believe that third party inspectors were allowed during construction. But I did have three different inspectors look at the house, but only after the house was completed. One was before the closing walk through, one before the one year warranty ended, and one when we eventually sold it 2.5 years later to be in a close-in neighborhood. The inspectors didn't find anything big and I believe the quality of the build was similar to other new construction homes around this area.

That builder limited our choices to some pre-selected options (unless you wanted to pay $500 to go to the "design" center which was basically the hard surfaces contractor/supplier's showroom--remember this is a mid-size builder in the Seattle area post recession), a couple of room layout options, two lighting package choices, AC and irrigation. We would not have been able to add windows, extra doors, or really anything else outside of the pre-set options, since the market was really warming up to be a seller's market and we bought the house on a pre-sale basis. I don't know of anyone else in the neighborhood that was able to make non-standard layout changes or add/change windows.

Overall, it was a good experience buying and living in that house. It was nice to be in a neighborhood full of children that were my kids age and meet other neighbors that were similar in life stage to us . We made some good friends that way. We lived in a 1960's development before that and rarely talked to the neighbors and didn't know any neighbors with young children. It was also a relief not to have to worry about replacing the roof right away or worry that our old plumbing system would need to be replaced.

I would have bought another tract home if I could have found one with a layout that was good enough, with enough yard space, in a close-in location, and that was at a more "affordable" price point. In fact, I did try to buy another tract house but was outbid (I think they sense that I was going to be a PITA :-). Now we are building a semi-custom house. While I do enjoy interior design/decorating, this has been a very stressful and time-consuming process. I often dream of moving into an already built house so I don't have to obsess over all the details and can get on with my life!

We just built in what I would consider a higher end tract neighborhood. Dunno if I would call the builder small/medium or large - he has an office and 3-4 FT employees - none of whom are tradesman. The house was built entirely by subs. He's built about 900 houses over the last 25 years or so. Anyway, we got to choose from one of 10 or so basic plans. Then we moved walls around, added and subtracted windows, etc. The thing that made the experience good for us is that I was at the house at least daily - often twice a day. Which gave me the opportunity to see what materials were going in and how the house was being built. Once the subs got to know me they would ask if I wanted something done one way or another. But if it cost money I would need to go through the office with a change order. The builder also looked the other way when I would go to the house on a weekend and do a bunch of air sealing or run data or speaker wire. They were also reasonably responsive when I would call and tell them that something wasnt quite right - like the housewrap got torn off in a windstorm or the tile guy was cutting tile in the master bedroom.

If I was not allowed in the home during the process that would have been a complete deal breaker. And if they had not been responsive to my weekly (sometimes daily) calls, emails, texts about what I was seeing it would have been a very rocky relationship.

I guess my point is that it is possible to build a tract home and have significant input and customization while also having the builder be responsive. You might just need to shop around for that kind of relationship.

The one thing that did suffer was the ability to make changes that would have impacted trades down stream. For example, the standard windows came with pre installed jamb extensions. Had we upgraded to a higher quality window the carpenter and painter would have both had to do something different. And in production building "different" can be very costly. Had the same experience when I asked about insulating under the basement concrete floor (finished basement). The builder was very resistant because it would have required that the plumber and concrete guy accommodate that change. And they didnt want to do that.

Good luck!

Wow, so that kinda brings up the question, "What does 'tract' mean?" What Dave describes is how I thought semi-custom worked... Moving walls, especially! I guess it's more of a spectrum than a clearly delineated tract vs semi vs fully custom.

How choices affect several trades down the line wasn't something that I really thought about, but it makes perfect sense.

Hopefully we'll go look this weekend, and I'll have some notes to share. :-)

You will not be able to make changes like Dave is talking about with Pulte. Maybe a smaller local tract builder, but not a Pulte sized builder.

Are there other smaller, local tract home builders in your area? Pulte gets a bad rap, but I have seen several builders that do a better job and offer more flexibility. We're in an area that has several spec builders -- ranging from architect designed very high-end to more traditional tract, but because of the size and type of our market (and probably strict and enforced codes) none of the national builders are active here.

Ironically, an arm of Toll bought our subdivision out of foreclosure, but did not make it a toll subdivision -- Toll isn't active here -- too small of a market. Instead, every home in our subdivision is architect designed (a DB requirement) and there are probably about 8-9 different builders building right now in a 62 lot subdivision. A few are high end spec, but the majority are built for the owner.

CP, we are gonna look at several builders (the neighborhood consists of a dozen different ones, I think), at least one of which is a small local company. :-D

We'll see... I hope we can squeeze more than just 2 or 3 in the same day!

Good luck. If they wont give you a key and allow you in and out as you please during construction, I would run the other way. There are quality issues that you will catch (and have addressed immediately) that the subs would be happy to paper over. At which point they will never get addressed.

schreibdave, I wouldn't say that. It really depends on how the purchase is set up. If the builder owns the property and house until it is complete and closed on, there are huge potential liability issues. They are also protecting their asset from shoddy work that could damage the home's value if you back out of the contract. Finally, they are protecting their profit, as add ons/upgrades typically have a much higher profit margin.

My local but fairly large (several hundred homes in work currently) that I just built with, will unofficially let you have access, they strictly forbid any work. The official policy is that you must have a builder rep escort at all times on site due to liability issues.

I am sure that there are liability issues and that they need to protect their investment from shoddy work. Those are real issues. But the other interest that the builder has is for you not to see how the sausage is being made. Twisted framing lumber, ineffective anchor bolts, pine shims (rather than steel) between the concrete foundation and the main beams, missing insulation, lack of air sealing, no window opening flashing, bathroom fan vent ductwork that is so kinked that it will never convey air, unsealed HVAC ducts, a sump pump outlet designed to fail, are all things I caught on my daily walk through. Had I not caught then before they got covered up I never would have known until it was way too late. In some cases the building inspector flagged the issue and the builder still didnt correct them. I am sure that these oversights are common place and none of them alone are fatal. But if I was not permitted to do a daily walk through and flag unacceptable work ... I would walk away. My neighbor is having the siding and sheathing removed from the back of her home to try to address a cold breeze blowing through her family room. That's the kind of thing you get when you dont have the ability, time, interest to inspect for your self.

And this builder is a quality, reputable builder. He's building million dollar houses in this development. And for the Syracuse, NY market that is at the top of the price range.

We bought a tract house from a small local builder 2 years ago. It was the second time we bought new from a production builder. Each time was a pretty decent experience, without any major issues and we were not onsite very often. We were allowed several inspections by an inspector. We didn't do any structural changes in this one, but many of our neighbors did, so it was possible with our builder.

As far as the investment with a tract house, I think it depends more on the location. In some places, they just keep building out. So there is always a new development a couple of miles away. Our first new house was an in fill development and our second new house is close to desirable and limited geography. We had equity when we moved in. There are custom homes in my development as well.

I have always wanted to build custom, but have never been able to make it work. Even though my dad is a small custom builder, the land was always too expensive. Once the house cost was added in, I would be upside down.