Who is going to live in the house? How many adults, kids, ages?

What part of he country are you in?

This came from your architect, so you already have your lot?

Not sure how these individual concerns get resolved, or if they are resolvable as stated. For example, if you flip the garage to the left, how do you get from the garage to the public spaces of the house? How do you get groceries from the car to the kitchen? How do you get garbage from the kitchen to the trash cans in the garage? Do you think there's more to it besides "flipping"?

Is this a plan from an actual architect or a designer/draftsman? And if from an architect where are the elevations?

Where in the country is the house?

What is your lot like?

What is your family makeup? Needs?

How large is your lot and are there any setbacks?

Which direction is north?

The only thing I like about this plan is the separation of sinks in the master bathroom. Even that can use some improvements. The sink in the front will have storage in the corner that is hard to access.

I do not recommend turning the bathroom into a Jack and Jill. That is the closest bathroom to the garage and the closest tot he proposed teen room. Instead of walking through the family room users of the teen room can remain in the more private areas of the house.

What size is the breakfast nook? As the only proposed eating area, I wonder if it large enough for every day use and for guests. It appears there is a wall of cabinets taking up space there.

Is that a sink next to what you've identified as the cook top on the island? That will function poorly as one needs to have space on both sides of a cook top. That's only the start with the kitchen issues. The least of the worries is the island cook top.

How do you plan to use the home office? Will you work there daily or is it for occasional use? Perhaps I'm keenly aware of the need for more office privacy if used daily as my spouse worked from his home office for over 20 years. Consider moving it to a more private area if it's used regularly for real work time and not just bill paying or something similar.

Angled kitchen - easiest way to "date" a house - even a new house! The funky angles never work - you get a weird inaccessible pantry, expensive cabinetry or a lot of filler strips, weird angles to fabricate counters, and a design that feels "forced". You also end up with a weird dance floor behind the sink, and a bad traffic pattern of people coming directly into your work area from the garage. Assume you have teens - they come barreling into the house when you are moving over to the ovens with a hot plate. Disaster. Also - because the house is so deep - the kitchen will be dark and the roof will be massive (if it has a pitch) and look like an oversized hat squashing the house.

Also agree that you are lacking in dining space - esp with the traffic flow in the nook. And also don't turn the back hall bath into J&J - it actually works well shared the way it is! (I'd drop down to one sink and increase counter space - it's more valuable than the 2nd sink - as face washing and teeth brushing can easily share a sink with 2 kids- it's the "prep" that needs room - hair, makeup, 4 tons of Axe cologne for the boys. Ha!

Master - agree with Mrs Pete (on this and her other feedback). The bath needs work. I have a shower with a "g" shaped configuration that does not have a door - lover that part. Yours will be cramped for 2 people (if that's the goal). Ditch the seat - add a foot rest thing to put your foot on for leg shaving - that's the only use my seat gets. Sitting on wet tile / marble or whatever is simply weird / gross when you are naked. (sorry for the visual) The water closet will be claustrophobic.

I am sorry - but there is little to like here. One last ? - I am assuming that there is a lower level or upper level (because I don't see 6 bedrooms on this floor) where are the stairs? I see 5 IF you count the study / office - and that will need a closet.

Thank you all so much for your valuable feedback. We aren’t married to this plan so please keep
firing away J

Our family includes a 12 year old daughter, 9 and 6 year old
boys and myself and my wife. Our goal is
to have a teen room for the kids as they get older (proposed for the current
dining room), a suite for my daughter (so she isn’t sharing the boys bathroom),
a home office (I work from home full time), a bath accessible to the outside
(for a pool) and a nice, spacious kitchen good for hosting. We live in the Phoenix area and the front of
the house faces north.

When I said that the plan will be flipped, I meant the whole
plan, completely flipped (not just moving the garage). The garage will end up facing east. Our lot is 190’ wide, 167’ deep and the
intention is to shift the house to the eastern side of the lot and center it
north to south. The house is 101' wide, 60' deep, 3300 sq ft livable, 5018 under roof. We're currently in a 4 bedroom, 3 bath plus office that is 2500 sq ft and we're pretty happy with it. Ideally we wanted to be at 3000 sq ft, 3 or 4 car garage.

-Elevations are attached

-House is one story.
What is shown as the second bedroom/study will actually be my office
(doors facing the entry way) and we probably won’t have a closet in there.

-As for windows, the master bath has 16x20 windows in the
closet, shower, two 16x14 over the tub and a 20x30 over the toilet. Master get an 80x66 and the other bedrooms
are between 50x50 and 60x60.

-Thanks for the feedback on the master bath. I’m actually ok with that layout. The size of the toilet room, swing of the
door, etc, is very common out here and it seems to work fine.

-Good point on the dryer vent. I suppose it would vent through the roof our
out one of the eves?

-The nook is about 15’ wide and about 12’ from the wall to
the island. We plan to use a 6 top most
of the time and add a leaf for an 8 top on occasion. We’re also debating on whether or not to keep
the door in the nook. The issue is that the 16’ slider in the family room would
be the only other exit point. It seems
like it might be a bit of a walk to go from the kitchen to the center of that
slider in the family room.

-Ok, so now the kitchen.
This is the biggest issue that I have.
Below is a rough concept where I blew out the old kitchen and went with
an L-shaped layout that seems to make more sense (ignore the three vertical
lines near the family room – scanner issue).
I’d have to then use the dead space between the kitchen and laundry room
to accommodate a pantry, close for bedroom 4 and some kind of storage/coat
closet with the remaining space. What
are your thoughts and ideas on this approach?

Thanks again!!

How did you arrive at this plan? Are you tweaking a stock plan? Honestly, I think you need to scrap this and start over.

Also to ask more questions:

Do you need a 4 car garage?

Does it need to be attached to the house?

What are your lot setbacks?

I like that your house is oriented north/south. That is the one good thing so far.

However as others pointed out, the house will be dark and especially the kitchen.

I asked if you're using an actual architect or a designer. I say that because everything about this plan looks more like a designer/draftsman created it than an architect. Too many strange things about it like all the exterior bump outs. A good architect or person of design talent will create a streamlined interior/exterior without resorting to bump-o's to try and make the house interesting.

The kids bedrooms seem to be just stuck willy nilly wherever a space could be found for them without any thought of keeping them somewhat in their own wing.

And your daughter's bedroom next to what will be the teen room? So the boys are in there playing some loud video games, whooping it up with their friends and your daughter needs to get some early shut eye or study for an important exam?

The kitchen and its location is a hot mess as mentioned above.

You work from home. Do you need it to be somewhat quiet or will the noise from the living room not bother you while working?

Do you really want to be shlepping laundry all across the house from your master bedroom? Frankly, I'd rather it be closer to the master and get the kids to shlep their own to the laundry room on your side of the house.

Have you considered creating more of an L or H shaped house or even a T shape?

With a T shaped house that is flipped on its side, you could have the public rooms on the long part of the T across the front of the house, and then the master at the top of the top part of the T looking out at the yard, while the kids bedrooms could be at the bottom of the T. Your master bath/master closet and the laundry room would separate the kids rooms from your rooms.

I was curious what stock plans were available that meet your criteria. Here's a William Poole that has a fourth bedroom/teen hang out space and a formal dining room near the master that could serve as an office with the addition of doors. It's a 2 car garage, though...

ETA: I'm not a fan of jack/Jill baths, but this one looks like it can easily be modified to have a single entrance from the hall.

Thank you all so much for your valuable feedback. We aren’t married to this plan so please keep
firing away J

Good! I'm glad you have a good attitude toward criticism. It will save you much heartache in the future.

As for windows, the master bath has 16x20 windows in the
closet, shower, two 16x14 over the tub and a 20x30 over the toilet. Master get an 80x66 and the other bedrooms
are between 50x50 and 60x60.

No, no, the point: It's not about window size; rather, you want rooms with windows on two sides. Light coming in from two sides makes a huge difference in the feel of the room.

Thanks for the feedback on the master bath. I’m actually ok with that layout. The size of the toilet room, swing of the
door, etc, is very common out here and it seems to work fine.

Yes, these problems are common -- but don't you want to change things very slightly so that they work BETTER and are OPTIMAL instead of just "eh".

Good point on the dryer vent. I suppose it would vent through the roof our
out one of the eves?

Can that be done? How would you clean your dryer vent? Venting directly to the outside is always best /cheapest /safest. The easiest fix in this situation would be flipping the machines to the garage wall ... you cannot vent directly into the garage, but you can run a vent along the edge of the garage wall, and a vent that you can touch is easier to clean /replace ... but you're looking at a lengthy vent. Honestly, though, with all the other problems, this is a second-rate issue. I really think you need to start over from scratch.

The kids bedrooms seem to be just stuck willy nilly wherever a space
could be found for them without any thought of keeping them somewhat in
their own wing.

Yeah, that's true. the separation of public and private spaces could be better.
Have you considered creating more of an L or H shaped house or even a T shape?

I was thinking that an L shaped house would accommodate these rooms better.

Here's a William Poole that has a fourth bedroom/teen hang out space and
a formal dining room near the master that could serve as an office with
the addition of doors. It's a 2 car garage, though...

I like William Poole houses. In this example, the exterior's more uniform, so it'd be a less expensive build. I agree that the three kids' bedrooms are clustered in a more reasonable manner (and every bedroom could have windows on two walls), though I would still like to see bathrooms that're more than minimal /have some storage. The hallways make sense, and the dining room could easily be an office. The kitchen is much nicer /more functional than the oddball triangle kitchen in the OP's original design. Make a kids' hang-out in a FROG, and you're set.

Mrs. Pete -- what's a FROG?

Good advice here, I think you can do better with a plan from one of the online sources. I have to agree with the others that I don't think you have the right architect working on this project. Or maybe you took something you drew up yourself to the architect and paid him to "clean it up" without making major changes? The interior is dark and fragmented which will make living in it difficult and will make resale harder than it should be. When you carve out the pathways around 3 sides of the family room you may even find that room becomes a little tight. I'm not fully following your proposed changes to the kitchen but I think they are a step in the right direction.

Furnished room over garage.

I have long thought that whenever I see diagonals in a floor plan that it's a failed plan which simply did not have enough thought, time or designer experience devoted to a creative solution.

My humble suggestion is to ditch the diagonals and start with a clean sheet of paper.

For me...I would try like crazy to orient the plan east/west...just seems that all the rooms that need light are facing the wrong way, or blocked by the cut up configuration. For my taste, house is way too cut up, I am much happier in more open floor plan...consider double doors to shut off rooms ...but leave them open when you want.

My advice to you, is go on open house tours....lots of them! They let you take pics, usually...take pics of what you like about each house..then sit down and REALLY prioritize!

Just as a word to the wise...builders can include just about anything in any configuration...but if you add it AFTER the initial contract/plan...the cost can be HUGE...think this through..every room ..light switch, door knob, everything.Good Luck!!!!!!!!

I would try like crazy to orient the plan east/west...just seems that all the rooms that need light are facing the wrong way,

East/west is absolutely the worst orientation in the south or most anywhere because it means the lower west light during the late afternoon is entering the house and heating it up.

Mr Virgil- what specifically are you referring to as diagonals in the plan? The angled hall/kitchen? Trying to learn what an excellent plan consists of.

West facing windows in Phoenix? That sounds like a terrible idea.

Question: in a climate like Phoenix is it generally best to put the garage on the west side to insulate from hot late afternoon sun?

Providencesparrow wrote, "...Mr Virgil- what specifically are you referring to as diagonals in the plan? The angled hall/kitchen?..."

Yes, that's the area where there's an excessive amount of circulation space to essentially connect two bedrooms and a bathroom to the rest of the house. And the space will be dark with no natural light. The plan is very deep in this area of the house--three plus rooms deep which means not only little to no natural light but also a very large, out of proportion roof dominating the exterior. The four-car garage, with side-by-side 18-foot wide doors is another scale-busting element for that side of the house.

Seems to me you could do much better than this.

At a minimum, you should add space for another 2 car garage and 3 more bedrooms!

Disclaimer: I've skipped over most every comment, my apologies if I repeat other things.

There are countless little things I see wrong, which I'm sure people are screaming scrap the plan. So instead of just screaming that, I'll point out some of what I am specifically seeing.

Hallway between dining/teen room and kitchen is much wider than needed.

Angled hallway to the back makes a super awkward kitchen. Nothing about that kitchen appeals to me except maybe the nice size (but awkwardly shaped) pantry and the extra wide fridge. Nothing about that back hallway seems nice either. Dark, dreary and long.

The water heater is in just about the most remote corner of the garage. Have fun waiting for your shower to warm up or even your kitchen sink. (Or if you're even the slightest bit environmentally concerned, that's a lot of wasted water to wash your hands).

Unless you live in a house where people often get muddy and gross and strip their clothes off and throw them in the washer before stepping any further, I see no point in having the laundry room at the garage. It's a dated feature from when people used to walk through their laundry to get to the garage or when they combine the mud/laundry. There is no reason to have it where it is. Place it where it's more convenient for laundry (either close to kid's beds, close to master bed, or close to rooms where you generally are while running laundry such as the kitchen.)

The door swing from the garage gets in the way of the coat hooks/bench area. But it allows easy access from the garage to the laundry room, which...maybe is needed? (sarcasm).

Bedroom 4 has an awkward jog in it. The only reason I see it having this is to allow entry to the bathroom. Either shift the bathroom down or flip it. Closet could be built into the garage too giving your hallway a straight shot instead of having a jog in it.

As currently drawn, the bedroom 4 bathroom and laundry room don't align. That is a waste. That extra 6" of drywall will cost more than the extra 6" of space you would get in the laundry room.

The massing of the front is bothering me...the entrance 'mass' is lopsided/assymetrical, so it feels 'wrong' to my brain.

Thank you all for your feedback. You've made some great points and we're now weighing our options to either massively overhaul this plan or start over with a new plan. Our architect (draftsman) has given us a handful of other plans to work with but so far nothing is exciting us.

Based on your feedback, we've narrowed down the list of things that are important to us:

-Teen/bonus room, ideally positioned somewhere that the kids can be loud and not disturb the great room and master

-2 bedrooms that share a bath, 3rd bedroom with its own bath (plus master suite)

-Bath with outside access (for the pool)

-Home office with privacy (full time work from home)

-Side entry 3 or 4 car garage (facing east)

-House faces north and we need a patio configuration that supports outdoor living area to the south to southwest (not the east of the house)

-Large kitchen with an island that seats at least 4 people

-Nook large enough to seat an 8 top if needed (6 top on a typical day)

-Don't need a dining room

-Santa Barbara elevation (like the original plan)

Thanks again for your help and I'll be back soon!

Furnished room over garage.

I would've said Finished Room Over Garage, but let's not quibble!
My advice to you, is go on open house tours....lots of them! They let
you take pics, usually...take pics of what you like about each
house..then sit down and REALLY prioritize!Yes -- and don't rush through. Stop and measure things. This is how you figure out what you consider a perfect sized shower, how you decide how much space is okay around a breakfast table, how big a fireplace you consider good.

Based on your feedback, we've narrowed down the list of things that are important to us:

This is good. You're analyzing what you actually want ... in detail.

Our architect (draftsman) has given us a handful of other plans to work with but so far nothing is exciting us.

Do yourself a favor and forget your draftsman. He/she has proven they are not a designer and don't have the design skills needed. I had the same problem with my draftsman. He considered himself a designer. He wasn't. Thankfully though, I do have some design skill and I also had lots of help from the architects and excellent laypersons on this forum to create a well laid out house.

A true designer or architect will be able to create a house working both the interior and exterior at the same time. Additionally, he/she will consider your land at the same time.

He/she will not just hand you other plans to work with because a true designer or architect knows each house has their own challenges and requirements based on the land and the clients. (The one exception to the land question may be a small infill city lot but even those have their own conditions.)

Please go find yourself an architect or real person of design talent. One who can take your wishes and give you a house you wouldn't have even imagined, but one you'll love and be able to live in for years.

Ok folks, we've been back to the drawing board and we've decided to stay with the current floorplan but we have reconfigured the kitchen and adjacent areas as shown below. The plan has been flipped from what I previously posted.

I'd like to ask for your feedback on the new kitchen layout and the pantry/walkway areas.

We're kicking around the idea of making the current island into a double island. How do you all think that would work with this layout?

Thanks in advance!

Why are you sticking with the same floor plan?

You still have a convoluted hallway leading to the two bedrooms.

You still have everyone who will be walking through your kitchen instead of going around it because people take the path of least resistance, so why bother with the hallway?

You still have a very dark kitchen that will get no natural light.

You still have a powder room that butts up against your master bedroom, so if anyone stays up late and uses it, and you're sleeping or visa versa in the morning, you'll be hearing them using it.

The back hallway will still be dark and dreary.

The water heater is still in the garage.

The laundry room still hasn't moved and will be difficult to vent as well as dark.

You still have lots of jigs and jogs that will add to the cost of your build.

So to answer your question, "How do you all think that would work with this layout?"

I think the problems go way beyond the kitchen layout still but you seem married to this idea for your house design. I ask the question, Why?

Hi cpartist. We're sticking with the plan because we feel that it will work well for us with these minor tweaks. You bring up some good points so let me address them.

You still have a convoluted hallway leading to the two bedrooms.

I don't have the doors labeled but the two bedroom doors and the bathroom door are all clustered together. Seems pretty efficient to me.

You still have everyone who will be walking through your kitchen instead of going around it because people take the path of least resistance, so why bother with the hallway?

This is a great point. We considered going with an L shaped kitchen (eliminate the walkway near the fridge) but we were worried about the resulting access from the garage. Any thoughts on how to improve upon the current layout?

You still have a very dark kitchen that will get no natural light.

I disagree. We have a similar amount of windows now and we have plenty of light. Our property is situated such that all of the windows will be uncovered. Plus, its PHX so sunlight is abundant.

You still have a powder room that butts up against your master bedroom, so if anyone stays up late and uses it, and you're sleeping or visa versa in the morning, you'll be hearing them using it.

Good point but I'm not concerned about that.

The back hallway will still be dark and dreary.

Considered that we expect that the glass double doors on the office will help that.

The water heater is still in the garage.

We're using a recirc pump so we'll be fine. You won't find a new home out here with a WH anywhere other than the periphery of the house so this is common.

The laundry room still hasn't moved and will be difficult to vent as well as dark.

We've confirmed that venting isn't a problem and we'll rely on a solar tube for natural light.

You still have lots of jigs and jogs that will add to the cost of your build.

We'll be looking at possibly cleaning some of that up but the cost to re-engineer may not justify the savings in construction.

Thanks again for the feedback and I appreciate any advice that you can lend on the current layout!

I stand by my comments. It will not be an easy house to live in.

Yellow is all your hallway spaces.

The red arrow is your path from your bedroom carrying loads of laundry. Better you than me.

The green is your kids moving from the public room to their rooms.

BTW: Solar tubes are great but they don't take the place of walking towards natural light, i.e.: windows.

You still have a convoluted hallway leading to the two bedrooms.

I don't have the doors labeled but the two bedroom doors and the bathroom door are all clustered together. Seems pretty efficient to me.

It's not the fact that they're clustered together. That is fine. It's the fact that it's a twisted hallway leading to their bedrooms. If using the real hallway (and not through the kitchen), the bedroom furthest from the main part of the house would require 4 turns just to get to the main hallway.

Why would you want to make 4 turns just to get to a bedroom? It's just POOR design

You still have everyone who will be walking through your kitchen instead of going around it because people take the path of least resistance, so why bother with the hallway?

This is a great point. We considered going with an L shaped kitchen (eliminate the walkway near the fridge) but we were worried about the resulting access from the garage. Any thoughts on how to improve upon the current layout?

Not without redesigning everything else.

You still have a very dark kitchen that will get no natural light.

I disagree. We have a similar amount of windows now and we have plenty of light. Our property is situated such that all of the windows will be uncovered. Plus, its PHX so sunlight is abundant.

Will you be putting a deck on the back of the lot?

You still have a powder room that butts up against your master bedroom, so if anyone stays up late and uses it, and you're sleeping or visa versa in the morning, you'll be hearing them using it.

Good point but I'm not concerned about that.

You might be once the kids are staying up later than you or having guests.

The back hallway will still be dark and dreary.

Considered that we expect that the glass double doors on the office will help that.

Please explain to me how having double doors on your office will help light the hallway with the twists and turns. It won't!

The laundry room still hasn't moved and will be difficult to vent as well as dark.

We've confirmed that venting isn't a problem and we'll rely on a solar tube for natural light.

Where will it vent?

Even with a solar tube it will still feel like being in a closet because we as humans want to feel as if we can look out. With some real thought you could actually build it closer to your bedroom and have real natural light.