Haven' been there but it's now on my list for next summers trip list. ;)

I've seen big P. strobus at Itasca park and actually have a large specimen in a field nearby here that has to be near 4ft dia at the stump.

There are large P. resinosa right on my property, the largest (below) a twin leader that I think the loggers must've left for seed.

There's also a 12a. stand on the state land next to mine with some trees that make mine look a bit on the scrubby side.

This pic was taken yesterday. Very unusual. The trees are ready for winter, but this little thing (I don't know what it is) is taking advantage of the unusually long fall we're having.

Anemone quinquefolia Wood Anemone

Still a few bees buzzing around here! Strange.

This could be the end of it: winter will arrive.

Yeah, I'm hearing about this one. Looks to do more your way than mine.

Just a quick post to help us all through the winter blues. :-)

Beautiful sunny day, temps soared to 35df. We only have ~6" of snow, so I headed out to the country and cleared brush around the trees I'll be moving. Figured it would save time later.

The first one is about 5ft. tall (same one as original pic), maybe <1" dia.

The second one is taller, maybe 7 ft. with a good 1" dia. Both these trees are very narrow so should be perfect to move without fighting a full branchy specimen.

Both these trees will be destroyed anyways so that's what made them candidates to get moved. I call it 'tree rescue'.

When I was finished, I drove over to where Picea mariana grow quite well. Those are the places with deeper, more clayish soil, tends to grow them with a very tall, sharp spire.

Headed over to see some the P.m. in my area, they seem to grow with more open branching than the previous pics. A little more sand/gravel underneath?

Edit: Changed this picture 12/23/16 as the original may have been white spruce.

On the way back, snapped some pics of our "up north" scenery. Here's about 100 acres of Tamarak on a floating bog. Goes back about a mile and there's some big old Grampa trees back there. I hiked through that area (once) back in my younger days.

Next: A shot of our willow swamps with fingers of ground that's high enough to grow trees that tolerate water a good part of the year. Mostly birch, aspen, red maple and red oaks.

You never know what you'll see around here. There was 4 of these within 20 yards of each other perched in the trees. I couldn't zoom enough with my Nokia to get a decent picture of them all.

Nice pix of a nice area. Thanks for the update.

tj

The grouping with the very sharp spires makes for a dramatic and beautiful backdrop! What is shown in your other photos is very much similar to the landscape here.

I've been eyeing a beautiful 3 x 3 ft wide specimen, though it's along a busy secondary road with no shoulder and no place to park for a substantial distance. The darn thing is also growing under and through a barbwire fence, this one could prove to be a challenge!

twros, I'm sure you know all of this and then some: ;-)

How far apart the fence wires are from each other and how tightly they're strung, will determine difficulty. Branches break easily when cold so best wait for a warm sunny (spring time) afternoon. I usually dig the root ball first, then work at slowly pulling the tree out from the bottom, untangling branches as you go. (of course we always ask the landowner if private land).

Where distances are concerned, a plastic children's sled is a lifesaver. I've pulled trees hundreds of yards (back to the truck) this way.

It would be fun to hear how that one comes out for you so keep in touch and don't forget the camera!. :)

best tool ever on my 5 acres ... lol .... ken

Bill, I don't think what you are looking at is all black spruce. What you want to move is certainly P. mariana, but the spires you show on "better land" looks like balsam fir (Abies balsamea) and the more open spruce you show on the gravel would be a white spruce (Picea glauca). Compare the shoots/foliage/cones and I think you'll see. When I lived in Mn, I spent much time in the north woods and only saw black spruce outside of bogs in rare situations alonga few streams and waterfalls along the north shore and BWCA.

sali: It would floor me if you were correct and that's possible but I really doubt that the sharp spires are Abies b. considering you can see the numerous tiny brown cones clustering at the tops. Many of the 'sharp spires' I saw yesterday were way out in the swamp and I couldn't get close enough for goods pics. I will however take a much closer look next time I go by there, which is fairly often. I do know the Abies b. that grow in my neighborhood, all look like any of our spruce and do not have the sharp 'spires'.

Good eye! It could be that I did choose white spruce depicting the more open growth, my mistake, but black spruce is very abundant in northern mn. And around me they all grow with the more open growth like the pic I posted earlier in this thread. I'll post it again:

Edit: went back and swapped out the possible white spruce picture with picea mariana.

Now you make me want to take another 'check out the tree' trip. :-)

'best tool ever on my 5 acres ... lol .... ken'

Worthless without a rope.... :p

Bill, I once had planted a 100 ft long hedge of picea mariana, these being from a muskeg on our property. In spring, I selected the best of specimens being 3 1/2 to 4 ft tall and then plunging my pruning saw deep into the sphagnum moss and cutting half way around them at the drip line. I then had left them for the growing season for the roots to heal and regrow. I returned in early September to finish the digging job and bringing them home to be lined out as a hedge. I placed some extra good soil around the roots and gave them a good sprinkling of fertilizer for a boost and to help overcome transplant shock. I had excellent results and only replaced one specimen that wasn't up to snuff and another that had gotten buck rubbed.

For that nice under the barbwire fence specimen, it's along a cattle pasture and yes, it's wise if I were to get the landowners permission, I dislike stepping one inch onto someone else's property! Now, I need to get one of those plastic children's sleds!

An old hood from a junkyard works too. We used them as sleds when I was a kid.

Wide is okay for out in the open. Light & narrow for in the woods. The green ash I moved last fall, had to go in between other young trees and willows. I used an old, flexible snow saucer one of my grand children discarded. Laid the root ball on with the tree angled toward the rear, almost laying flat. Less chance or damaging the top of the tree, rather than drag the top through the crowns of the other small trees.

twros, can you get an ATV to where you'll be working?

My days of doing any major tree digging are behind me, I'm not yet all that old, though my shoulders are telling me otherwise ... so, I'll only be going after those hard to bypass "managable" specimens. I would though like to obtain several more balsam fir and know of a few locations in which to look.

I really dislike moving plants, but the list of trees waiting to be moved in spring gets bigger every year. I've moved a few Fraser Firs, which seem to handle it well. The conifer I have not had good luck with is Scots Pine.

Twros, any chance of showing us those birch trees at your place?

It's not the moving I like as much as seeing a scrubby tree, fighting for it's life in the wild, get moved to a place where it can recover and thrive in a few years. That's where I find the satisfaction in doing the work.

You have some large birch twros?

'best tool ever on my 5 acres ... lol .... ken'

Worthless without a rope.... :p

===>>> you will note.. its brand new ... as i wore out the one with the rope ... lol ..

trust me.. it got a rope ...

there is also the garbage can lid and wheelbarrow for smaller stuff

ken

twros, that is one beautiful specimen of Abies b.. Looks like I'm seeing a seedling on the lower right of the picture? I have a few very small specimens available to me from the woods and I might move one of them to my town yard this spring.

ken, yes anything you can do to save on the back is worth the money lol: All I can tell from your picture is some kind of conifer? Dwarf of some kind?

Another shot of the spires. To far out to get a close up but definitely a spruce swamp.

Very sharp spire are almost surely balsam firs. This is their exact appearance. I can't see cones in the first pics, the ones in question. But I'd be willing to bet my next paycheck that we're looking at balsam fir in that initial photo-not of the tree to be dug but the next one with the very spire-like trees. Those are balsams and while I like them and while they surely do perfume the woods, lumber-wise it's considered a weed tree. Not used for much, I guess that's not really our viewpoint here. But at least in the northern half of Wisconsin, this is a tree that you shag out of the ditch somewhere, not one you pay money for. I'm not making that value judgement. I'm simply saying that the tree is readily available and is coming up in roadside where it will be destroyed eventually anyway.

My step-grandfather used to own 160 acres of steep, hilly land in the north of this state. Many balsam fir were growing in the ditch one day years ago when I was up there with him. He wondered if some of those firs could be transplanted from the roadside ditch into the yard around the cabin. It was already mid-June, hot and humid, but I went and dug out numerous small balsam fir-already flushed out in new growth-and transplanted them anyway. They survived the move and are big trees now, some twenty years hence. An easy thing, but a good thing, even if the producers of our raw materials aren't impressed. This tree is worth is for the smell alone!

You might be right tom, I may have assumed too much about these 'spires'. I'll be traveling through there again in a week or so and I'll stop and check out the branches up close. My eyes may have fooled me on those cones, I blew up the original photo and even though it's fairly high resolution, it's iffy that what I saw was cones. I'll get back on this one.

A little intrigue on GW -- I like it!

Looks like I'll be heading that way tomorrow, stay tuned..... :)

Salicaceae said: 'Bill, I don't think what you are looking at is all black spruce. What you want to move is certainly P. mariana, but the spires you show on "better land" looks like balsam fir (Abies balsamea)'

You are absolutely correct! Thank you for spotting that error. I traveled through that area again today and it took me a while to realize where I went wrong.

First I took a close up look at the underside of the branches. No doubt in my mind, Abies balsamea. Then I started looking around more thoroughly and lights went on....

And of course I took pictures of the nicest tallest spires to depict P.m. lol:

Picture of the cones I was seeing:

So, I learned several things. After you look up at the spires, look down at the trunks. If the trunk is grey with lateral lines and silver splotches, you're talking Abies.

Also I learned that Cass county could be the Abies b. capital of MN. They were everywhere and all had the narrow high spired appearance. Not typical of where I lived (a little west of the boreal forest) there were few A.b. and the one or two I protected from the deer, transplanted in the sandy sand yard, grew with more of an open branching, so the tall spires was news to me.

Another thing, never bet with tom, he's right or he doesn't say. :-)

Oh, and Salicaceae, this isn't the exact same tree, but I checked out a similar one that you said looked more like a Picea Glauca, along the Hi-way. Not 100% sure I think these trees were planted by MnDOT. but the needles were definitely longer and lighter color than the blacks. The cones are about 1-1/4"- 1-1/2" L. (whites?)

So, all in all a nice day to be out in the woods. I enjoy it!
And here's a few pictures of some places close by that had mixed p.mariana and Abies b. (and tamarak). It was difficult to tell the two apart unless you got close up and could see the trunk & needles.

Couple more from the road.

That's a heck of a tree topper, Bill. You should probably enter it in that 'decorated tree' thread. :-)

Salicaceae said: ' When I lived in Mn, I spent much time in the north woods and only saw black spruce outside of bogs in rare situations along a few streams and waterfalls along the north shore and BWCA.' The MN DNR has been offering Picea mariana seedlings in bulk, for new plantings, for as long as I've lived here. Those plantations are usually on land that is a little higher/dryer than what would be called 'bog' so they grow well with a fuller, conical shape, until they get large and start crowding of course. What area of MN did you live?

The pics w/the spruce cones/foliage and trunk bark certainly look like P glauca -- don't think black spruce has such glaucous needles.

Are all the bare, coniferous-looking trees in your latest pics larch?

Yes, Larix laricina I believe, it was fairly low ground that would stay wet a good part of the year.

Edit: 'don't think black spruce has such glaucous needles' That and the blacks have a round or almost round cone. And Norway spruce have quite a bit larger cone in comparison so I don't know of many other choices we have around here.

Oh, and I stopped at the Farm store and picked up a new piece of equipment for the move. I'm hoping this will cut the roots cleanly all the way past the topsoil layer, more like a tree spade does. When I used a regular shovel, I've had to struggle to cut roots past the reach of the shovel or ended up breaking them off accidently when tipping the root ball out of the ground.

I use an old pair of loppers. I used to have a sharpened shovel with a notch in the blade.

Sharpened shovel? Good idea. I figure I can make the initial cut with the regular shovel, then use the long blade to ensure everything gets cut clean.

You'll like that "sharpshooter" for under-digging root balls. Ideal tool for that. Looks like you're having some good trips. Good stuff.

Thanks! Glad I got out when I did. We picked up another 6-8" of snow the other day, nearing 16" total. Now the temps have dropped below zero with dangerous wind chill values for several days. Still working full time so that will keep me occupied the rest of this winter anyways.

At least you got snow. We're in that cold stuff too now, but the snowfall was minor with this one when it went through here. This is the one type of weather that I really dislike-dry and cold-but even here there is advantage: The hemlock woolly adelgid, having decimated hemlocks everywhere to our east, it may just be that cold snaps like the one we're experiencing right now-unpleasant for us-are able to keep this insect out of this area. I don't know-the adelgid has shown remarkable adaptability thus far....but just maybe, these miserable cold snaps will keep it out of here. As it stands today, the largest and best remaining hemlocks in N. America are here in the Great Lakes states. Silver lining in even the most miserable of situations. It's cold outside!

This is the first winter in 3 years we've had any snow to speak of and it's came at a good time because of all the new trees I planted in the yard last summer & fall. The ground isn't even frozen from what others around here tell me. That should even help the trees I haven't dug up yet.

I'm sure people from other parts of the country/world, reading this, will not be able to understand how us 'up north' people can be so glad to have snow*and*cold! LOL:

So far, no HWA or EAB here either but EAB is in the next zone up by Duluth & down by the Twin Cities. Let's hope!

Just an update: Got the 2 spruce moved to the yard today. Funny, they somehow changed from Picea mariana to Picea glauca over the winter. Anyone else have that happen? :-o The needles were only 1/2" long so I assumed, but now that I look more closely, the new branch tips are too white to be black spruce. Too young for cones so I may have to wait to further confirm.

The smaller of the two went pretty good but the larger one had a 2" dia red oak growing through the root zone. Made it hard to get the root ball out of the hole without knocking off a large percentage of the dirt. The trunk of that spruce was more like 1-1/2" dia. and all I could handle was about a 20" dia. cut around the tree. So hope I didn't cut too much of the roots for it to recover. I had to stake both trees as the wind was almost 30 mph, gusty from the south. Well, here's to hope!

Hey Bill, it is that time of year! I'll be moving a couple tomorrow. A bit warmer than what I'd like, but with rain forecast for Sunday and Monday it's a go. Glorious spring.

Those will be fun to watch grow! Nice job!

Yes, he is meticulous. It looks like you've done this a few times.

Since 2 weeks ago, I dug, raised and mulched 6 of my existing yard trees. Dug, balled and gave away one, relocated and mulched 2 others and mulched 5 more before doing these two. But it what's I learned on this forum, I feel, that has enabled me to do as good as I have with all this. I'm even starting to identify things correctly. :-))

There was frost still in the ground when I started and the temps were merely 50's, which was actually great for this. It will be fun to see how they all do this season. It's supposed to rain here too starting Sunday.

Good luck with the projects maackia. It is good timing with no bud swell yet on the spruce here. We're starting to see some maples flower, just barely.

Update on the two transplants:

The smaller 6ft. one that had the better root ball is doing the best with lots of new growth at the tips.

Update:

The larger Picea glauca beginning it's seconds season in the ground has done beautifully. The new growth is not only commendable for a large transplant but the needles are so much longer and bluer than last summer.

The bottom 2 ft. of branches got nipped by the rabbits last winter. I don't think it will be a problem once the lower branches get longer and hang down to the ground like they usually do on this type of tree. The tree is filling in nicely!

Nice. Thanks for updating, always appreciated.

Just an update:

The two Picea glauca have been free range this season with no stakes or extra water although rain has been sufficient. Good growth but the bird knocked over the main leader on the larger tree.

You can see where the red mulch ended up. :)

7-5-2023: update:

The first tree above was moved to a different location, talked about in this thread.

https://www.gardenweb.com/discussions/4793755/honey-the-shed-is-in-the-wrong-place-or-august-transplanting-#n=65

It has done well in its new location. Don't let the main leader fool you, it's a replacement for the ones birds have broke off several times and is leaning about 30d towards you in the picture. ;-)

I not good at guessing height but ~10' is ball park.

The second tree, brought in at ~8-9' should be taller but also has had its share of main leaders broken off by the robins and grackles (the just do it to urk me). ;-)

Guessing around 11' or so today.

It's a 'rabbit pruned' trunk with very little epicormic growth since originally planted.

Picture from the other day with bright sun shows good coloration. Probably why they call it 'White Spruce'. :-)

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