I would break out the shovel and move it to another location or whatever you plan on doing with it and get a rose that will perform... Maybe something is wrong with that certain rose bush maybe try another one? Maybe someone that grows Koko Loco will chime in...

Best of luck with whatever you decide! :)

I grow Koko loco. But I'm in southern California so I might not be the best person to answer.

In my yard it bloomed it's little head off the first year. Barely bloomed and grew the second and third year.

I'm in year 4. It's not bloomed much but it's finally sending out lots of strong new growth.

But if you aren't happy with it would probably just move it somewhere else.

No reason to not stick a great performer there.

I do see it planted around here, and when it takes off it sure is a good bloomer. Lasts a while in a vase for me too.

I would give it to a neighbour, it will make you feel good...I don't have the heart to Shovel prune or just chuck a rose bush

Often putting the shovel or bin next to the rose is enough to scare it to perform. And if that fails... well at least you don't have to go far to get your shovel! :) Ha!

I would put it in a pot with the intent of pampering it. Then I would forget about the pot because I tend to emotionally focus on the good performers. Then the potted rose would die and I wouldn't miss it.

I'd say it depends on how attached to it you are. I put up with Jubilee Celebration, for some odd reason (such a wimp), for 5-6 years before it finally decided to grow up and become mature--and I'm not sorry. It is beautiful now! But I've had others, nice enough roses in certain ways, but they never made my heart sing, so if they declined or just wouldn't perform well enough, I tossed them and immediately found a rose a really, really, really wanted (like Love Song!) to put in that spot.

Our gardens are for our enjoyment--so if a rose is irritating you, that's grounds for a quick spading!

Kate

Thank you everyone for your advice! My Koko Loco must have somehow got wind of this conversation thread because in the last week it put out a bunch of new growth... still, it's on thin ice! Since we're getting into hot weather and I'm not keen to move stuff around, I'll probably give it this season to change my mind. If not, I've got an Astrid Grafin von Hardenburg tucked in a sub-prime location that would love to move up in the world!

Kate, you're right about making the heart sing. I have a few iris and a peony or two earmarked for my "replace with ones I truly love" list. I'm hoping Koko Loco improves, because I really do love it when it's good, but if not, it's out!

rose_crazy, where are you located? I'm in southeast Toronto - maybe you could be my 'neighbour' who gets KL if it doesn't improve for me...

Thanks redwolf I would love to take it off your hands butttttttt,
I would rather have another David Austin rose I will be going to Vandermeer
soon I intend to get Othello( I’m really getting obsessed with red roses this
year I don’t know what it is )..I live in Markham and have a very small Area to
garden in , please check out the my recent post to see my small garden in the
Rose Gallery( Titled -Than and
Now\Spring and summer)

Rose crazy, if you're becoming obsessed red roses, you must grow Ascot. Palatine is the only one I know that sells this rose--is Palatine Roses far from you?

Fragrancen, as a scientist, how can you believe in such magical thinking--ha? Diane

Ascot

One more...just one plant.

I grow KL and I would never call it a vigorous rose. It has wintered for 3 years and it does give me a few flushes a season but it's no hero in my garden. It can be spotty and the blooms do blow rather quickly, particularly in the heat, but it has that rare changeable coloring that I like so I keep it.

Hey Nanadoll...I did get Ascot from Palatine when I visited them this spring, Palatine is about an hour to two hours drive..sorry redwolf for taking over your thread here

Yes, redwolfdoc, I apologize for going off topic. I guess magical thinking works because somehow your KL got wind of your conversation and started doing some growing. I hope the growth and blooms continue so KL can stay at your garden.

Diane

Diane, I'm a biologist and I still believe in magical thinking! Sometimes you need it as a gardener! :)

Thanks everyone - and no worries about hijacking the thread.... I'm just as interested in the new direction! Diane, I've admired your photos of Ascot before. Rose Crazy, I'd love to know how it fares through the winter for you!

Seil, your photos are so lovely. It's that chameleon colour that I love about KL, but it just hasn't grown well for me after the first season. So sad!

Diane, I'm a surgeon and I'm used to removing things that aren't doing their jobs! (Roses included) Magic works wonderfully. Every birth is a little miracle!

Many moons ago, I was a premed, and I did get my degree in zoology, but my magical thinking doesn't extend to the garden. I use MT mainly for eating situations. If I regularly eat lots of fruits, veggies, and whole grains, then all the crapola like candy, ice cream, and cookies I love is OK. The "good" foods cancel out all the bad stuff that I regularly eat, heehee. As a doctor, fragrancen, you know this is absolutely true. Diane

A fellow zoologist! Wonderful!

I'd like to remind all you non-zoologists following this discussion that "there's no zoo in zoology" (like the title of the book with the same name says).

I am actually in the same situation as redwolfdoc. Three of my roses are unfortunately not improving either after three years. They look worst than the previous two years. Swan Lake, Othello and an unidentified white rose are so tiny and I mean miniature tiny this year. I don't want to waste time pampering smurf size roses especially if they are not miniature roses. I want to sp them but I don't want to give up. Maybe another season and see what happens?

jjpeace, could you try magical thinking? It seems like a lot of us believe in it. Perhaps, you could bring out a shovel and put it next to the roses in question. Or go drastic and dig up the tiny unknown rose, laying the "body" next to one of the others. Then sternly tell the two others that this will be their fate if they don't shape up and grow...now. A bit gruesome, but it could work. Good luck. Diane

Nanadoll, you're cracking me up! Koko Loco now has three swelling buds on it, but as they're all hovering only about 8 inches off the ground, I'm not sure how much I'll enjoy them when they do open. Sigh.

JJpeace, maybe we ought to look at this as a golden opportunity to promote one (or three) other roses off the wish list and into the garden! :)

rifis, I looked up that book. Outstanding! Looks like one I'd enjoy... Not particularly related, but it put me in mind of James Nicoll's oft-quoted (at least in my house) statement: The problem with defending the purity of the English language is that English is about as pure as a cribhouse whore. We don't just borrow words; on occasion, English has pursued other languages down alleyways to beat them unconscious and riffle their pockets for new vocabulary.

Redwolfdoc, now you're cracking me up. That quote is pure gold. I need to commit it to memory! Diane

It is almost 1 a.m. And I really need to go to sleep but I blame Diane for posting such a hilarious comment. Don't they say that miracles do happen?

Okay, another question for y'all - what if a rose is healthy and vigorous and blooms its head off, and you just don't love the blossoms? I'm having that dilemma with Cinco de Mayo right now...

I keep giving our Double Ko out front whom thinks its a hybrid tea rose a pep talk once in awhile and finally I noticed today that new life is coming from the base so maybe there is hope after all... he he

Who am I kidding? Even tiny and weak, I love KL....

This is so funny to me because I am a Zoologist too. What are the chances? Are all Zoologists Rose lovers?

Oh good. Zoologists are here! Tell me how to kill rabbits. Bubble gum didn't work, they ate 5 bags of them!

So... exactly how many zoologists are on this thread anyhow? I love it! What are all your specialties?

And summersrhythm, I'm afraid I haven't got any good rabbit-killing advice for you, though I do use Plantskydd to discourge squirrels and find it helps.

Riffles and kitties do wonders on rabbits. Although it is very difficult when you find the tiny tiny babies...Alas, I am no zoologist.

Dogs too...

Thanks Kelly. Have to find some outdoor cats..... not a cat person though, and we can't adopt outdoor cats from SPCA (indoors only)...... we can't hunt in our town......and we can't let dogs run free without leashes......we have a lot of rules here.

Thanks Redwolfdoc. I used to use Deer Fence, that thing smelled sooo bad......

This sounds too simple, but you could try dumping a load of garlic powder on the lower branches of your plants affected. You can often buy this stuff, and other seasonings, by the pound (bulk) in some supermarkets so that the garlic powder is fairly inexpensive. Your garden will smell like an Italian restaurant for a while. It seemed to work here, but the rabbit pressure was pretty low. Now we have very few rabbits around here due to depredation by coyotes, foxes, and maybe the badgers. Poor bunnies. They never did much harm, compared to voles, gophers, and deer. The foxes seem to have moved on now that there are so few rabbits. Probably the worst of all for damage is what the resident army of quail do around here--they're a giant herd of pecking, scratching, dusting, seed eating, plant destroying pests. More about them later. Diane

I use a cheap cheese grater and grate up a bar of Irish Spring soap around the areas the bunnies like. They don't like the smell. I have to re do it if it rains. It doesn't seem to bother any of the plants.

The only thing that works for us here is literally putting chicken wires around the backyard. We put it at the bottom part of the fence buried deep into the soil so they can't burrow through. It is ugly and not for all of you "homes and gardens" lovers out there but at least we can enjoy our garden and pretend the wires are not there. Thumpers are but a faint memory for us!

jjpeace, I feel your pain. You should see my bamboo stake garden, augmented by that low wire fencing around certain roses and other plants out back. It's soo ugly, but bamboo stakes driven into the ground with more lying on the ground, are the only things that keep quail from making their dust bowls around certain roses and plants, and pecking to death other plants they love. Before you all think to yourself "what harm can a little dust bowl do?", think again. You should see the excavating the quail do. They can expose roots and have started some real erosion problems down the back slope. Every ground cover plant and seed for tough groundcovers I try, they devour. I'm onto setting out small lavenders and the native blue flax on the slope, but have to surround those plants with bamboo stakes, and put large rocks and hard dirt clods near the poor plants to keep the quail away. Some of the bowls look like small caves in the raw soil. Dusting is done mostly by females while the male mate stands around and watches. The females can dust for up to 15 minutes, and the poor males die of boredom, but they never leave the females side, and chase off any rivals. Sigh. I know far too much about quail. I'll continue this saga at a later time...there's more. Diane