Please help us determine the health of our new succulents!
Hi Everyone,
I run a small business and we've been working with a local florist that is wonderful. She's outfitted our office with a small army of succulents of different varieties. She's been great in helping us with timing of watering, amounts, etc. But I still have a lot of questions and know our office needs to take ownership of these to ensure their health and longevity.
Two of the succulents we have are showing signs of a peach fuzz-like cluster of webbing. On one, in the vicinity of the fuzz, the leaves are crusty and brittle, break right off. On another, within the fuzz, there are tiny dots - almost like dust. In both cases, it appears only one area of the plant cluster is affected.
I'm not sure of the variety of these, but they're now in quarantine in one room while the others that appear to be healthy (at least to my eyes) remain in another on sills by windows (winter weather outside, not sure if perhaps the chill of the window might be injuring them? Our florist hasn't said anything about their location by the windows...).
Any insight here would be fabulous, and thank you in advance for taking the time to comment!
Best,
Pete
Comments (17)
Peter
8 years agoRelated Discussions
Yikes, mold on new lumber used in our remodel
Comments (20)"We have decided to pay for the remediation of the mold ourselves, but I was surprised that there are no regulations about using dry wood". Since you have already taken action to have mold remediation performed, you have wisely decided your health is more important than other concerns in this situation. If you spent an enormous amount of money for mold remediation and health treatment, you may wish to consult your attorney to see if the framer is liable to reimburse you for these costs. The remaining long post below is for others who wonder what is all this hype about mold. I am a licenced contractor who deals with mold issues in connection with water intrusion damage to homes. In my years dealing with mold problems, I have come to understand mold from a different point of view than the average contractor or homeowner. To start, some background about mold. Mold is any of the thousands of kinds of fungus which inhabit the earth. Most mold is parasitic, and feeds off wood or vegetable matter that is found in nature. For various kinds of mold, there are different environmental conditions that promote their growth and survival. We usually associate warm, damp conditions with mold, but mold can live in many conditions from very wet to nearly dry, cold or warm. As partr of their reproductive cycle, molds create spores which are released into the air and settle on new surfaces where they can grow as new molds if conditions are favorable. Mold spores are microscopic spheres which can become airborne. But these airborne spheres usually have a coating on thier surface consisting of myotoxins -- (poisons that can cause allergic reactions or severe health problems when inhaled, or adhered to your skin). However, some mold spores are more toxic than others, and some people are more sensitive to these myotoxins than other people are. So we see a vast variation when we read reports from different people that mold is a health problem. Also note that theses mold spores are in the air even when there is no known mold that can be seen growing nearby. Mold spores are as common as dust in the air. Most people are acclimated to the normal levels of mold spores that are suspended in the air that they breathe. But if there are places that have a heavy mold growths, we often hear complaints from people that they can smell the mold, or they are experiencing allergic reactions. Perhaps I am one of the lucky people who is more resistant. I have been in areas with heavy mold growth which have caused homeowners to move out of their home because of their severe reactions, without returning until our crews removed the contaminated materials and treated the mold. On the other hand, I have seen most of the mold testing usually shows that penicillin is one of the most common molds found in most homes. This is known to be a kind of mold that is used as a medicine to fight bacterial infections. Because of the undefined health risks of mold, there have been no laws that specifically determined what levels of mold are acceptable, or what methods must be used to treat the mold to make a home safe and habitable. It seems to be more of a personal choice for each indiviual to determine what is acceptable or not. But there are certain established methods of mold abatement which are accepted in the industry. Before we get into the mold abatement methods, let's take a look at the other side of mold problems with wood. Some kinds of mold can attack the wood in a manner that makes the wood weak, so it does not serve its function as a structural member. But other kinds of mold are relatively harmless to wood or to people who are near the mold. As an example, some new lumber at the lumber yard has a spotty black coating on the surface when you buy it. These black spots are mold, which is usually found on "green lumber" which may feel wet or damp to the touch. But they are not generally harmful to the wood structure, because they are only growing on the surface, and they usually stop growing after the wood is nailed in place and has a chance to dry out. But if wood is stacked so it does not dry, then other kinds of mold can grow which appear often as white webbed strands on the surface, that can weaken the wood so badly that you can break it by stomping on a board. This usually takes some time for mold to penetrate that deep into the wood, so it is rarely seen home construction because the construction wood has a chance to dry from the time it is nailed in place. A second kind of mold damage to wood is seen in exterior wood that is exposed to the weather, especially in decks and in outdoor patio covers and trellises. It is usually called dryrot, but it is actually a mold which grows in wet conditions. The dryrot mold grows when the wood is drying after becoming wet. The mold likes the damp wood fibers, and will penetrate into the interior of beams and deck planks, especially in corners and seams where water is trapped so it cannot dry quickly. Dryrot mold can destroy the fiber strength so it is so soft that you can push your finger into the surface of a board. This is the reason why deck planks are usually spaced at least 1/4 inch apart, so the water can drain, and air can dry the space between planks. So we see there are two problems with mold -- a health problem and a structural problem. The structural problem can be solved by replacing the contaminated wood members. But if the wood has not lost its strength (no soft spots), then there is no reason to replace it. You can simply kill the mold so it cannot spread, then take precautions so new mold will not grow on the wood. How to remediate mold that is causing health problems? For the health problems, the usual method is to first remove all the mold from the surfaces that you can find. Then kill the mold with a fungicide. Ordingary bleach (sodium hypochlorite) will do this (You can also buy a commercial fungicide to kill the mold instead of using bleach). Dilute your bleach with half water or use your fungicide and spray all the surfaces that were contaminated, where you removed the mold from. Be sure to scrub the surfaces with a green kitchen scrubber or brushes soaked in the bleach solution. Then after everything dries for a day or two, paint it with primer paint like Kilz to encapsulate any microscopic mold spores that may be remaining on the surface. The primer will coat these remaining spores so they cannot escape into the air where you can breathe them. Note: These mold spores still contain the myotoxins even after you use the bleach or fungicide to kill the mold, so they are still a health threat. If you are sensitive to mold, then be sure to wear a mask with a filter so you don't breath the spores while you are working. Also wear rubber gloves, and even tyvex overalls taped at the wrists and feet to keep the spores from getting on your clothes. You can throw the overalls and gloves away when you are done with the mold abatement. This is the general procedure that people pay thousands of dollars to hire a professional mold abatement company to perform. About the particular problem of mold from the porch header circulating through the house, here are my thoughts: Generally speaking, there is no code that specifies when a piece of lumber has too much mold on it to be used for construction. There may be some local codes, but I can not imagine how they could specify the exact dividing line where the amount of mold or type of mold is acceptable or not. Ususally, if there is an ugly mold growth, a framer will discard the contaminated lumber and replace it. But this seems to be a judgment call by the framer. From the scenario above, I have visions of a framer who was thinking that its a whole lot of trouble to dig that header out and replace it, so it is good enough to leave it be. If the mold was really bad, the building inspector could tell a framer that the wood he used is not in good enough condition to pass the inspection, and require that he must replace it. I have never seen this done, but then I have never seen a framer use lumber that had mold actively growing on the lumber that he used for his remodeling other than that black spotty mold we often see on new lumber. If your building inspector has no problem with the header, then the only remaining objection is the objection that you raise. Your concern may be that you simply don't like the idea of using moldy wood to enclose inside your home -- (an objection which I agree with). Or maybe someone in your home is having health problems because of the increased mold spore levels inside the home. In any case, this is a problem you need to address with your framer, because there are no laws I know of that require him to remove it. It is best to specify that all the moldy wood is to be removed before any work starts, and have the cost of remodeling include this work. Otherwise, you are dealing with problems that could have been solved in the beginning instead of later. Some other notes about remodeling and mold: The mold from new lumber is not as toxic as some varieties which grow when persistent water is leaking onto surfaces in your home. Any surface mold on the studs is contained within the walls, and will stop growing when the wood has fully dried (less than 90 days). I doubt any of the spores will find a reason to move from the surface of the lumber past the drywall or to the ductwork where they can migrate to the interior of the home. During the remodeling, there may be higher levels than normal for mold spores and dust levels. But this will subside to normal levels after the construction is done. Unless someone in the home is super-sensitive to the surface mold that sometimes is found on new lumber, it does not seem like it will be a problem after the construction is done. You can take precautions if you are concerned, such as special air filters fitted to the furnace or even an electtrostatic collector to remove tiny particles suspended in the air stream. To answer the question: Is the framer required to use new lumber instead of lumber that was weathered outdoor for years? Probably not. It depends on local codes and what your local building inspectors will accept. Hopefully your framer will replace old weathered lumber it to keep you as a happy client and reference for future work he does. You can read here to learn a little more about residential mold problems: http://www.cdc.gov/mold/stachy.htm con_j...See MorePlease help us choose our flooring!
Comments (21)Thank you to everyone who responded to my post here. Just to close the loop for this post, here's an update. We ended up choosing santos mahogany, variable planks of 3" and 5" wide, for our kitchen floor. It is browner and redder than the wood floor in the rest of the house. The color variation between the santos mahogany and the oak flooring in the rest of the house doesn't bother us. Although, now the oak flooring looks tired and in need of refinishing to keep up with the new kitchen floor! The santos mahogany floor is sanded and finished on-site with oil-based sealer, 2 coats of Bona Traffic Satin and 1 coat of Traffic Semi gloss. The floor is unstained. When the first two satin coats were put on, the floor looked pinkish and very dull. I almost cried in despair. But GWer kitchenkrazed helped me out and mentioned that to change the sheen, we could put Traffic semi gloss for the third coat. We asked our floor guy to do that. Amazingly, after that last coat, the floor is no longer pink but beautiful warm red brown that we LOVE, and instead of being dull, it has a gentle lustre that looks great! It is hardy with our dog's drool and slobberiness. We have had scratches from dropping a drawer onto it (it was a loud crash!) but other than that, the floor has held up very well since January this year. No scratches from our dog yet... As far as cleaning, it is a cinch! It's wonderful that I don't see black dog hairs as easily as I did on my previous white vinyl floor. Water stains (or drool stains, more accurately) are more visible but easily wiped off with a damp cloth. Dust is hardly noticeable, but maybe because I enjoy cleaning my floor now and do so more often than I did on the old vinyl floor. Lol! Below is the photo of the floor, and the link to our "just finished" kitchen reveal. Here is a link that might be useful: White Kitchen Reveal...See MoreHealth check and ID for 2 succulents
Comments (23)I lived there 30 years, Lauren. I feel your pain. I remember one summer when the intersection of Indian School and...something had to be closed because the asphalt had softened so much in the heat that cars were misshaping the roadway. And people in the East will say, "yeah, but it's a DRY heat!" LOL. They just can't imagine it. Godforsaken climate. Your overnight lowes right now are what, about 90-95? I bailed out, and only ever returned when I had no choice, like caring for my dying father. And the monsoon and 60% humidity are coming soon! And it won't cool off substantially until October. You can come up here to the PNW, Lauren. Nobody owns air conditioners. The clouds didn't clear this year until 2 days ago, and we're having a mini heat wave of 93, 100, 93 and everyone thinks the world is ending. Clouds are scheduled to return on Tuesday. ;-) Oh, and there's some nut job here in Eugene who drives around in an entirely chrome Magnum- chromed instead of painted. Can you imagine a chrome car in Phoenix? It'd be like some kind of death ray machine....See MoreOur winter greenhouse garden, and Succulent lovers, need help
Comments (21)Trail, i'll try to get a pic later when I'm feeling better. I'm on day 4 with a low grade fever because I have a tooth abscess and the dentist won't see me in person until Jan. 6th after the antibiotics have worked. Covid, you never know. Dear Lord the pain. Have any of you had an abscess before? I thought I've suffered every dental pain out there, until this. The dentist gave me only 8 pain pills, Lortab low dose..woo.. and it took two of them plus 2 tylenol and 2 ibuprophen to make the pain stop 30 min. later and for only an hour. Outside, Crassula sounds familiar and I do think they grow like an Ivy. Thanks!...See MorePeter
8 years agolast modified: 8 years agoPeter
8 years agolast modified: 8 years agoWow, this is all wonderful feedback, thank you!!! Posting pics of the plants in their pots now in anticipation that if these were potted with only aesthetics in mind, there may be more at stake that I'll need to quickly address.
Peter
8 years ago
lmontestella
8 years agolast modified: 8 years agoHi Peter,
Not sure what the point of the video was, except to say sadly, the plant is rotting from its base up. That's my conclusion from the leaf-by-rotting-leaf demo you've shared.
Those brown-based leaves pull off like that cause the plant is rotting from its base up. This is likely due to the unfortunate & seemingly insurmountable combination of too organic a soil (too much peat), no drainage hole in the pot & too much (or too frequent) watering. Too much water w/ no place to go in short, rotted out the plants.
How about this to give us a more accurate idea what's going on:
Spread some newspaper & then turn that pot out upside down on top of the paper & spread out the contents, brush the dirt aside & let's see what's left. I'd guess mushy roots from the way it comes apart a leaf at a time.
I'm not famlliar w/ taking my plants out to other folks' care. I've been coming here & learning along w/ going to local gardening clubs & making plant-friends w/ fellow growers & amateur collectors for decades.
Succulent are marvelous plants & I'm sorry you've gotten off to a bumpy start w/ them. Yours are lovely plants in handsome decor, sadly designed to be short-lived.
Hang around here for a time, you can learn how to care for these beauties yourself if you like.
Here's an old favorite Haworthia of mine, H limifolia, one of my very first succulents, I love the spiral & it helped hook me on Haworthias.
Lena
Peter thanked lmontestellaPeter
8 years agoGreat tip Lena! Thank you! Ha, and sorry for the video length - we were astounded that it was just falling apart. Just dismantled one pot and pics below. Three of the remaining succulents were in soil but the 4th was not! Was just sitting in rocks and does not appear to have a root system. The one in the video was similar with just a stump at the base. Is there any way to save this one that just has the stump and wasn't in soil?
Looks like packing peanuts were in the bottom as filler and the base of the pot was extremely warm and moist, you can see the sheen.
The local garden solution is really more of a business solution, but if I knew where to start in terms of instructions I could take ownership over these and care for them myself. Just not sure where to start, I'll scan these forums as you mentioned and will see if I can find some starter threads.
Thanks everyone for such great input, will see if I can save these!
rina_Ontario,Canada 5a
8 years agolast modified: 8 years agoIt looks like they just took plants out of their original pots and plop them on top of peat that didn't have even perlite added. The rocks, I assume, were from the top dressing. And I am glad that you can see for yourself how wet it was inside the containers.
Shake off - tease off (helping yourself with a chopstick) all the soil from the roots. You can have plants sitting on some newspaper/paper towels for a while. It will help to suck-up extra moisture, and they will nor die. If you get bag of perlite and maybe some grit (grains should be approx. size of aquarium gravel), or pumice, or scoria - you can make great mix yourself. If only perlite available, sift it using kitchen sieve and use only what remains in it; mix 50/50 or 60/40% perlite/soil. Grit is very good for drainage, if you can get it I would use 40% of each grit & grit and rest of soil. And they needs to be in planter with drainage.
If you really want to use decorative containers, you need to take plants out as I mentioned before, for watering and draining. I would keep saucer underneath and keep checking if any water accumulates - if so, empty it. Otherwise just return them :) Use containers with drainage and a saucer.
The rootless plant may grow roots. Just set it on top of the mix and in a while - if healthy - it will start growing roots.
Here are some Haworthias in similar container as yours except it is thinner and I have drilled drainage holes into it. Plants have been potted into it almost 4yrs ago:
Grit on top is bigger than grit in the mix (you can use the pebbles you already have). Mix in this container is made of grit, perlite and turface and very little bark.
Peter thanked rina_Ontario,Canada 5aPeter
8 years agoRina, the instruction is amazing, thank you! Went to the gardens place this afternoon and spoke with their succulent expert who echoed much of what has been posted here. She sent me home with some trays with holes and succulent-specific soil (which I'll use for now until I can shoot for the mix you suggested). The thinking is to repot everything into the drainage-ready "triage" set of trays in order to get them out of harms way. Then spend the next week or so figuring out how we can still use the decorative planters.
I followed your instruction of the chopstick-teasing and have unearthed the three plants above (yours look amazing by the way, that's incredible!). I'm seeing a lot of browning on these though and the leaves are semi-soft to the touch in the brown areas. I'm tempted to trim these away and let the succulent scar over a couple of days before trying to repot in the triage tray. Is this the right thing to do?
Also, should I trim away the root system if I'm going to trim away these brown leaves?
Or are the brown leaves entirely normal because they were rubbing against the brown soil? I've attached two pics below, one including the single plant without a root system, which has leaves that are crisp and quite green! Making me think these others with brown at the base are already halfway rotted.
Thank you!!!
lmontestella
8 years ago
Crenda 10A SW FL
8 years ago
Nancy (zone 8a)
8 years agorina_Ontario,Canada 5a
8 years ago
lmontestella