I would beg to differ with athensmom regarding ranges. One of the most telling demonstrations of the difference between a professional chef and an amateur came when a friend of ours, a restaurant owner and head chef, cooked for us at his home. He make an incredible meal on a 30 year old gas range that must have put out maybe 5000 BTUs max. And topped that with a perfect souffle made in the oven which didn't even have a door that shut completely. Just because Bittman can cook on junk doesn't mean that I can. I need all the help I can get, and a great range is a big part of it. No matter how hard you try, you just can't really sear right on an electric coil stove. You can't really stir fry on a feeble 5K BTU gas hob. So BS and Culinarian ranges really DO cook "better" than builder grade dreck. And even Bittman, in the article about his kitchen, says what he dreams of is "A functioning oven, the best possible stove." So just because he cooks on a tiny low end gas stove doesn't mean he wouldn't agree that a great stove makes you a better cook. Now, I will agree, however, with athensmom, that when we're talking about bluestar vs wolf, that the differences are small, perhaps too small to really make a big difference in how well people cook. At that level, the differences are likely outweighed by other kitchen skills--I'd take a really sharp knife, a Unicorn pepper grinder, and All Clad pans any day over the extra 4K BTU's that a Blustar might put out over a Wolf. So your choice of a sealed burner Wolf is perfectly rational.

Hi Kaismom -- it sounds as if we align more-or-less perfectly in terms of why we bought this machine, what we cook, how and in what manner, right down to cookware. If I could get around the le creuset cookware problem I'd be willing to try the potroast but ... I don't eat potroast! ( my mom and dd2 and dh would though: what is it? It's really dry, tough, tasteless roasted beef, right? ;) ). Still, I do vaguely wonder about what I'm missing and then have to remind myself: you're not. I did once cook a whole chicken in the Miele I think. It was absolutely delicious and faster than the oven. But as you say, there are other rate-limiting factors; almost never is the oven's interior's inhabitants that factor (around here, it's more likely actually getting a child to haul themselves to the actual table. grrr). I've never had a MW before; this is the first time, first one. I find myself occasionally, now, purchasing ready-made trays of food (TJ's Indian food) and just zapping it. But that gets old fast. Even zapping tea I'm finding that it tastes better reheated on a stove: what's up with that? Here's something I will agree a MW is a boon for, not that I've adjusted my habits around it yet: boiling water. I have an electric pot and see that it's fast, safe because it shuts off, and easy. But it's true that I will tend to heat more water with it than I might with a MW-ing mug of just-enough water. Overall it might save energy for "behavioral" reasons. But this isn't really 'speed-oven'-specific. I made a lasagna the other day and decided I'd cook it in the speed oven, but therefore needed to put it in a glass pan rather than its usual resident le creuset monster. I wound up sticking it in the gas oven all the same - there just was better timing doing it the "slow" way. I too bought cookie trays for the speed oven that fit perfectly in response to someone's posting that they had them. It took me three tries to find them but at last in a restaurant supply store I hit paydirt. Never used em. Still, happy to have the pair. So you roast veggies with olive oil? How please? Though I've cooked vegetarian meals for nigh on 30 years now, I've still never really ever "roasted" them. Wacky ... I've stuck em straight on a gas flame, never really in an oven. Wouldn't they want broiling? I've used the speed mode to bake potatoes and I have to say I'm not really sure it was any faster than just baking the darn things. It's unclear to me whether the MW imposes any texture on the potato. But I do appreciate not having to heat and maintain heat in a cavernous 36" oven cavity. Using a smaller space "feels" better aesthetically, though the actual literal energy calculations comparing the two would be pretty interesting; I couldn't even hazard a guess as to which was more "green" for a handful of potatoes after factoring in everything. So on reflection, I guess it's possible that the fancy programming of successive and different modes of cooking might not actually be a feature I do miss afterall. At first I thought it sounded snazzy and I was disappointed not to have it. But it could be that it's of most use in reheating or cooking frozen casseroles and/or meat. And there are ways around that anyway. I've even gotten used to the number of button-pushes you have to go through just to heat water ((i)twist dial to MW (ii)press level (iii) press time in successive 10-second increments only (iv)press OK to set it (v)press OK to start it) Unwieldy but acclimate-able. One major issue I've had is the planning necessary if you want to use a MW after the oven's cavity has become hot. If you wanted to use the oven as an oven, with the metal rack, and then switch to MW, you'd have to place the glass tray into the hot interior: scary. Else it feels weird using the glass tray for the oven, letting it get hot and then wanting to put a cool vessel on top of the hot glass -- that's even worse. I bought a silicon mat just for the purpose of mitigating the shock of a cold utensil on the hot glass tray. It does seem to be a valuable accessory. Anyway, this juggling has been a real pain. You actually can leave the metal tray in during MW but occasionally it does arc. The first gen speed ovens were designed with this ability but I was told they blew it for the second tray and sometimes MWs bounce such that they zap the metal tray; hence it is not recommended (the tray in the two ovens have a different design and in fact the interior of the two ovens are different sizes). And I imagine were it present and you burned out the oven, they'd not be terribly willing to honor the warranty.

You probably know, at least by now, that the 500 series also has the fast preheat. I have been searching and searching through my emails and old forum posts, because I KNOW there is someone who has both a 500 and an 800 series oven in her kitchen. Perhaps Faleash. Anyway, I think the only difference is the knobs vs touch panel, and the lack of telescoping rack. You said the 500 also doesn't do the temperature conversion, but I don't consider that a necessary feature, or even desired for myself. Did you know you can order the telescoping racks for either oven? You could get 2 or 3 for the price difference in the ovens. I consider knobs a plus, so that's what I'd do in your shoes. Truthfully, I seriously considered Bosch when I had to replace my oven recently, but was a little turned off by 2 things: Their service has a less than stellar reputation, although I heard from someone (Mindstorm) whose oven was damaged and she found the manufacturer quite helpful and prompt with helping her. 2) No track record for these new models yet. Mindstorm, who did extensive scientific research on ovens before choosing hers, had the older 'European-born' 700 series Bosch and chose to have the same model put in, even though it was no longer the current model. She was so happy with what she'd had, she didn't want to take a chance on something new and different. Appliance salespeople just didn't know what to tell me about the reliability of these new ovens, as they haven't sold enough and for long enough to have received customer feedback. This tentative attitude from everyone made me a little nervous. If you do a search for my user name and ovens at the bottom of the appliance and/or kitchen forum pages, you will find a few recent threads, and some happy Bosch owners did chime in. Hope it helps, and best wishes on your oven decision.

If we go with a 25 or 26" deep fridge cabinet, the fridge unit will be pulled forward also so it is flush with the stiles of the cabinet. The Thermador Freedom columns are designed to sit flush in a 24" deep cabinet (I assume that includes the plug and water line, but will have to verify.) I believe the door panel will add 3/4" to 1" of depth, so total depth to the front of the door would be about 25", but I expect the same will be true of the cabinets once the doors are added to the front. I saw an in-store installation that I loved, which had the SS column flush in a wall with 3" wide wood trim/filler on each side framing the SS. All the cabinets and appliances on the display wall were tall and flush, so they did not address the counter issue. I had pictured the doors of the columns being flush with the flat panel drawers of the lower cabinets in one straight line. Maybe I could go with a narrower counter overhang so the counter ends flush with the front of the drawers instead of hanging over, or is that a terrible idea?