Help plan circle drive in yard
We are trying to plan out a landscape design for our property, and I think we need some help.
Right now, I am looking at turning our yard into a circle drive for our barn driveway. I have *roughly* drawn it out on a map copy-if anyone with some software skills wants to redo or offers suggestions with a redrawing, please do!
;)
This is what we currently have-the red square on the right is a barn. The grey in the middle is our house and front porch. There is a driveway to the garage (top left).
The 'grey lines' are the drive to the barn, and the blue lines and arrow are a new entrance we put in specifically for that drive.
The driveway to the barn was done previously by prior owners (it loops on the left to the main garage drive on the left), and is just pea gravel and dirt. Not great for a muddy climate with large trailers.
Currently, we have to back down our barn drive (in blue/grey) with horse trailers to get to the barn, which is do-able, but not ideal.
Due to convenants and land topo, this was our only option at the time.....not ideal.
We have thought about turning the front yard into a large circle drive for trailers, where we can pull in, and circle around.....
In the past, we talked about turning it into an arena, as it is the flattest area of land we have, but it doesn't solve the horse trailer backing issue.
I would love thoughts on aesthetics, suggestions on a circle drive, and how you would best recommend starting one-prefered materials? What kind of cost? I have a local gravel yard we have used before, and we would be using them again, but DH and myself would be doing most of the work.
Anyone have a similar situation and photos of before and afters? Would love to see some inspirations for this endeavor.
Thanks!
Comments (12)
8 years agofiddleandco thanked woodyoak zone 5 southern Ont., CanadaRelated Discussions
Help with landscape planning a HUGE!!!! yard!!!!
Comments (18)I'm sorry, I thought that was on topic. I have no way of knowing if you had also recently acquired the horses, but having done the "horse thing" pretty much all my life, I couldn't tell you how many places I've seen ruined from the owners trying to keep them on too small of an acerage. No matter how lush and green everything was when they moved in, within a year they would end up with a swept bare, scorched earth look that had all the charm and ambience of a feedlot at the sale barn. Nobody *wants* that, but people tend to overlook that the horses have created an eyesore because they're crazy about the horses. I can understand that. I keep an old pony around simply because I'm a sentimental fool, though he's on twenty acres, not five. Anyway, my own specific, non professional landscaping advice (drawn from decades of horse ownership experience) would be that if there isn't already a woody, brushy barrier between the horses and the house, you might want to plant one. (min 20 ft wide, more is better) Start with small flowering trees, and stagger medium sized, flowering shrubs in front. Natives preferred, and in keeping for your idea of a woodsy feeling, something that has berries for birds would be best. I'm thinking this could be the "wild" area other posters have mentioned. That way, when a couple of weeks of rain in the spring turn it into muddy slop, or a drought leaves it a dust bowl, it won't dominate the view from the yard you do want to landscape. Stagger the plantings into small groups, and use a number of different species for year round interest. Not sure what would have fall color in zone 8, but an extension agent or the state wildlife department could give you a list of native plants that would be attractive to birds and such. After that, if you're going to DIY, I'd say to wait a year before you start making permanent (and costly) changes just to get familiar with the property. The best place to sit in the early spring might be too hot in July; you'll only know that after you've been there a while. You might want to turn the swing to face another direction, or decide you don't like looking at the neighbors' outbuildings. The point is, give your place (and yourself) time to settle in....See MoreFront Yard Arizona Landscaping - Fresh Start With Images & Plan
Comments (20)It helps to have some personal experience with a different climatic zone and its plants/trees when discussing the pros and cons of how to use them and the extent of maintenance one is contemplating. I'm 100% in agreement with Maria on the preference to work with nature and choose plants that can be left to do their thing rather than fight them constantly by trimming and pruning. It helps to know that low dense canopies for desert trees are a natural response to conserve soil moisture and a reaction to climate and periodic strong winds. Limbing up such trees would require annual thinning, and may also destabilize them in high wind situations if the additional height catches the wind more. I fully realize that Yardvaark has a preference for limbing up all trees as well as controlling for height, but most homeowners don't want the work or expense, and should appreciate comments from someone who knows the trees and their habits, and points out the pros and cons. Other posters like to dig their heels in and make the case for why they are right, or how their approach works well if one is willing to do the constant ongoing maintenance. A difference in philosophy about gardening with nature or preferring to subjugate it... If one is going to propose higher canopy shade trees for such a garden, it would seem to make much more sense to suggest taller growing trees with higher canopies that wouldn't require the constant pruning. Trees such as Ulmus parvifolia might be one alternative, or an evergreen such as Pinus eldarica, or palms such as Brahea 'Clara' or Brahea armata. Some of the evergreen Sonoran/Chihuahuan desert species of Acacias might also be worth looking into for narrower canopies and taller habits. Ultimately I'd agree with Maria that the amount/type of trees as shown in the plan would completely obscure the view of the house from the street, and could be cut by half. If the OP wants full shade across the whole yard at maturity, all those full sun plant choices will need to be replaced with shade tolerant plants at 5 to 10 years out. I'd think the OP would appreciate these sorts of comments on their design as presented and come to their own conclusions about degree os shade/coverage desired and amount of maintenance required before they finalize their design. From people who have actual experience growing the plants in question in a similar environment, rather than a discussion about semantics and discussion about how trees and plants are meant to be subjugated to design philosophy of man over nature. It's one thing to do that for yourself, another thing altogether to recommend it as an approach for others to follow. It takes time or money and certainly extra sweat and fuel and dump fees to constantly trim trees and prune back too fast growing shrubs that the design improperly spaced. More economical and sustainable to pick the right plant for the right spot, and minimize the maintenance to keep it all looking good......See MoreHelp us plan a garden and yard's contents!
Comments (10)All good info and keep it coming. Such a breadth of knowledge here! @missing Yes, it is exciting, but we want to choose wisely and plant well to avoid over extending ourselves. We have 10 acres, so plenty of room to grow. Recommedndations would be great, I don't know much about the online/catalog plant ordering business. I get a few things from Park Seed as otherwise my options are limited to big-box store selections or expensive nurseries. I didn't know all that about black walnut, good to know. I guarantee I would have found out the hard way, it is a variety we are considering. Also good to know about the multiflora, they are definitely not blackberries (I grew up with black/raspberry brambles) so we'll keep them in check. Too bad, they aren't completely unattractive. Didn't know that about the apple varieties either, thanks! @ Karin You're right, there is a forum here for the Hudson Valley, but it's growing tumbleweeds... I found some local message boards, but the posts deal more with everyday flowers and garden varieties than things like Mirabelles and Currants. Re: Schneeglockschen; my Mother is from Germany and most of her family came over as well, so it rubbed off on us kids as we spent holidays and summers with them. My other half lived there for 10 years and has family there as well, so there's lots of German influences in our thinking. I'd never seen Snowdrops (I knew the name) but had visited Husum in North Germany in early Spring and there is a "castle" that has tens of thousands of Crocuses covering the grounds mixed with the Schneeglockchen. I learned later that Snowdrops are essentially the same thing. Absolutely beautiful, and an effect I will attempt to reproduce on an albeit smaller scale in NY. We have the site and drive selected and mostly planned. We are planning trees and the like now so that we know how much to clear or thin beyond these areas. We also have a good idea where the garden and "mini" orchard will be, so that's why I elected to come here. I'd just as likely have bought foolish choices from a catalog or overdone it. Folks here have a good knowledge if what works and what doesn't. None of this is going to be planted until the heavy equipment is gone....See MorePls Help! Any sources re semi-circle driveway=1 driveway?
Comments (12)A few circumstances that could aid your plight are whether you are on a busy street or not, whether you have room to contruct a turnaround (ie, hammerhead), and how far back from the road the inside edge of the circle is from the road. You could certainly have more leverage in claiming hardship if backing out is a safety hazard and you have no alternative method of turning the car around. Most zoning by-laws have a definition section (sometimes they are hard to find). Many zoning by-laws can now be downloaded from municipal websites in pdf form. These are easily searchable, if that helps. I have seen "driveway" defined as an "The travelway for vehicles between the access and the garage or parking area" (this would not be good for you), but I've also seen it defined as a "travel way" (which would be good). Zoning boards have a lot of descretion that is backed up in court. It is very difficult to overturn their descretion when applying their interpretation of an unclear definition unless they have not applied the definition consistantly. If the definition is not written or not written clearly, your interpretation of it is no more valid than theirs, so you will not stand much of a chance of overturning it. I would suggest that you try to force them into writing a clear definition as early as possible in order for them to have to commit to it. This would open the door for alternatives that do not go outside of their definition. If you proposed something that fits the definitionm it would have to be accepted or it would be much more easily appealed....See More- 8 years agolast modified: 8 years ago
PRO8 years agolast modified: 8 years agoConsider an arrangement along the lines of a turnaround circle near the barn, making certain it is sized sufficiently to do the job. (There is a little more room to make it larger diameter than there would be if encompassing the whole yard with an oval.) If the walk connecting drive to house entrance was of hard surface material, it would help "scrub" sand and gravel bits off of shoes before they got to the house.
- 8 years ago
With Grandpa's place in mind, I'd do it somewhat like this - (pardon the messy drawing, but I think you'll get the idea....):
You'd need to adjust the length or width of the rectangle and the driveway width based on what moving the trailer around tells you.... For most horse people, a rectangle is a familiar and pleasing shape, whether your reference is a riding ring or a racetrack, so it would seem appropriate for a house in an equestrian community. It should be possible to make the size functional while keeping the familiar reference shape.
- 8 years ago
- PRO8 years agolast modified: 8 years ago
"...so to put a tighter turnaround just in front of the barn doesn't help. Not sure if I understand how that option would allow more space?
I'll attempt to answer your question. What matters of the turnaround is its most confining dimension. The fact that you add bucketloads of straightaway in the rectangular configuration doesn't help add spaciousness to the tightest portion of the turnaround. This is represented by the green arrows for each configuration. It's probably about 10% - 15% greater diameter within the area not confined by the porch. I'm showing the maximum possible turning radius for each config. (The clearance you would leave from building and fence would be the same degree of clearance for each configuration.)
Another consideration would be material cost. If a given area is served by essentially 2 driveways covering the same length, obviously it's going to require considerably more material than a single drive in order to construct it. Also, once the project is drawn to accurate scale, you may discover that with two driveways, built at a proper width, the grass in the middle may appear more like a stripe. The only way to know is to draw it to scale, using proper dimensions.
"Would our next step be to have our local gravel yard 'guy' come out and quote it?" Say you're kidding! A person can't quote a vague idea. You must work all the details out in a scale drawing that clearly specifies where everything will go. Even if you're doing the construction work yourself, don't you wish to know if everything will be as you envision it ... or have something on which material calculations can be based? You need a drawing that's done at scale. You must convert the "casual" advice you get here to usable advice in order for it to be meaningful.
Rather than first producing a finished drawing that can be "quoted," it might be better if you looked at design as a process. Draw a pretty decent sketch of the ideas that you think are the most workable. Then transfer that drawing to the yard by using dayglow colored marking paint, available from Walmart, H.D. or Lowe's. It'll cost a few bucks but is exponentially cheaper than excavation and gravel actually placed in the yard and discovering it needs to be moved. (I'd recommend buying a long handled "marking wand" as stooping over to spray that large area -- even though you're just outlining -- would be torture and a much more difficult job of marking it out.) EDIT: The purpose of outlining the driveway with marking paint is so that you can explore how well it actually works, and to help you envision how the finished product will appear. (Note on using marking paint and wand: first mark critical points that determine measurements. Walk along connecting these points and creating overall outline with dashed lines. Appraise and make adjustments and refinements with additional dashed lines. Once the layout is correct, repaint over all with solid line. The paint goes quickly so you might get about 5 cans.)
My opinion of symmetry is that while it is sometimes nice to have, it is hardly essential and under no circumstances able to outweigh resolving function. In its absence balance and proportion work fine.
- 8 years ago
- PRO8 years ago
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