The custom cabinet business I used uses Conestoga doors as well.

The KD I used works for the cabinet company, I think that's not unusual. I also ended up using the contractor who works with the KD (& the GC used his builder, electrician & plumber) and I used the KD's sub for my countertops.

The plusses to using all people who worked together were significant - focused accountability & no one blaming the other for problems. So much easier for me. Downside is that everyone is getting a cut down the line, so it's a convenience you're definitely paying for.

The downside to the KD working for the company (that sells cabinets, or anything) is that they've got incentive to have you spend more $ on that stuff, and are likely to suggest upgrades.

I wish I'd gone w/ fewer cabinets/smaller cabinets and a bigger window - maybe, if the KD wasn't making $ off the cabinets, she would have suggested that...

It's very common for smaller custom cabinet makers to outsource doors, drawer fronts, etc. Building doors requires much more complex tooling and assembly systems than boxes. If a custom place makes their own doors, they have to have a separate facility for machining parts, assembly, sanding, specialty parts, etc. Not very cost effective for a small operation. Outsourcing these things allows the small cabinet maker to offer the thousands of door styles that the big door places do, without the overhead of all the tooling and systems needed to create those choices.

I don't think that practice is looked down on in general, though I have seen it sneered at on here as being a sign of "custom" (in name only) joints that slap together boxes and site finish etc.

My cabinetmaker outsources doors, drawer fronts, and side panels as well.

My cabinet maker also gets doors and fronts from another company--fortunately someone local and not Conestoga. :)

We looked at two - one was a large operation that went with outsourced doors, the other was basically a one man shop who did everything (and cost much more)....

The cabinet maker I talked to outsources the MDF doors but wood doors are done in-house.

Sorry but parts assemblers are not custom cabinet makers. If you wanted RTA, you could go that route yourself.

Not to mention that a good half of the cost of cabinets is in the finishing, and if you're not getting a durable factory finish, exactly what are you getting? Does he hand it off to someone else to finish too? Some painter with house paint and a $1.98 sprayer rather than cabinet finisher with a clean room and conversion varnish?

Real custom is NOT cheaper than manufactured cabinets. If it is, then you are being shorted somewhere in the process.

Sophie -- I didn't get the impression that they finish the doors. I think they order them completely done from Conestoga. He said, "Contestoga makes them for us" -- which I took to mean that this place designed certain door types, and Conestoga fabricates them. I also took it to mean that they are not a typical door available to order from Conestoga.

I like the idea of a one-stop shop that does it all from start to finish.

So why not order it all from Conestoga yourself and DIY it? What do you need a ''cabinet maker'' for that doesn't make cabinets? Just hire a cabinet installer.

We thought about that (RTA), but really can't handle all the work involved (one reason we moved was to get more family time... which is still close to zero). My husband is also completely able to make kitchen cabinets from scratch, but it would take five years to get done!

That said, I didn't say I went to a "cabinet maker"... I went to a kitchen and bath design center. I don't really want just a cabinet maker, I need someone who can tell me what drawers/inserts/features I need to make the kitchen work the way I want it to, what widths I need for everything. I also need someone who can demo a wall and replace flooring, and someone who can run this whole show because we're new to town and don't have the resources/time/energy to find all our own subs for each part of the project.

What I don't know is, does that mean I need a KD? Or does a GC do all of the above if I already have a design in mind?

scoutfinch72:

Venom? Please.

Some of us have higher and lower tolerances for things than others.

Sophies's directness is refreshing. And I disagree with her on this issue.

When I worked with a KD, there was no real help figuring out what drawer sizes would work best (beyond what would fit in the space available). And the only help with inserts and features were hard sells to try to get me to buy a bunch of stuff I didn't need. I'm sure some KD's do a better job helping define storage needs than others but I really think this is a task you need to take on yourself to get it right.

Point of use storage is generally recommended. Especially for commonly used items. Items used occasionally can be stored a bit farther from point of use. Items used rarely can be even farther away.

You will need to look at your kitchen's design and determine work flow and where you want to be able to stand while doing a certain task. Then go into your kitchen and gather all the items needed for it, group them in a way that makes sense to you, and then measure the groupings. This will tell you what interior drawer space is needed for that group of items. Then determine where in that area that size drawer with those particular items makes the most sense to be placed.

I don't think any KD is going to do that for you. Sure, they might have certain ideas on what types of sizes of drawers or inserts typically work best in this place or that place but they might cook quite different meals than you do, using different tools, so you might get the best kitchen for them but not necessarily for you.

Yeah, it's a time-consuming task but the time saved meal-after-meal, year-after-year will make it worth it.

Our GC is handling and capable of providing everything you're looking for but we also did our homework and got very luck with him. It's in his best interest to get something we love and not sell us on features we don't need.

For our cabinets everything is being made in house.

A KD will not do all that work regarding size of drawers etc... What they will provide as a service for fee is the layout with elevation. You need the elevation for the GC and cabinet maker to work from.

It's very rare to find a true custom cabinet maker anymore. No matter what people were claiming, all except two companies that I interviewed was actually custom and did their own doors. My neighbor used a very high end "custom" cabinet maker and all they did was build the boxes. The doors were sourced from somewhere else and the drawers were from a local millwork.

Buying the doors and drawers are very standard with cabinet companies and kitchen companies.

I walk through each and every cabinet in the design with the client. And of course I take inventory of how they cook and what they have to store. Just not down to the 1/4". Unless there is a specialty item that needs a dedicated spot. All Kitchen Designers will do this. Maybe not cabinet sales people or contractors or cabinet builders. But a Kitchen Designer, absolutely.

I am not looking for a cabinet maker. I want something akin to the cabinets at the big box stores.

What exactly do "custom" and "semi-custom" mean? Does "custom" imply cabinet making?

Custom means any wood, any door style, in any dimension, to your exact specification. It is NOT synonymous with quality. If someone says they are custom but won't give you one of those attributes, then they are likely not truly custom. They may not even make anything at all.

Where do you draw the line between mixing flour butter and eggs for scratch cookies, from baking lumps of pre done dough, or warming up the bakeries cookies in the oven. One might be "making" cookies, while another is simply "baking" cookies, while another is totally"faking" cookies.

Manufactured lines can be fully custom as well. I used to sell Omega, which will make anything anyone asks, as long as it is structurally sound and the material is available. They make a wonderful quality cabinet, and for a lot less than artisanal cabinet shops, which is what most people think of when they think custom, but is far rarer than you think.

Semi custom means that a few to a lot of alterations can be made to the cabinets. A 31 1/2" W base cabinet? Sure, in some lines. The ones with the thick spec book. Semi custom is a broad term and can cover low end to high end. Some only offer a couple of alteration, like you can increase wall cabinet depth to 15" instead of 12" or you can get glass doors. They will still call themselves semi custom

You have to do your due diligence. Pick a great KD, and they can get you a great product, appropriate to your budget. They will have contacts with installers, electricians, and even full service contractors. Again, if you have the dream budget to go along with the paper kitchen of your dreams.