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joe_fristoe

Need help finishing driveway and sidewalk areas

Bama_Joe
8 years ago

I've started landscaping the front yard. I desire this to be easier to mow around and like the Japanese/Asian theme and have also picked up a few conifers. Two hinoki Cypress at the entry point, with bluerug junipers around the mailbox area. My beds are nowhere complete. Id like to make both sides near the entrance and around the drain where there isnt a need to mow, while having a nice look. The side opposite of the mailbox only has a hinoki as of now.

Also have a black dragon cryptomeria, with two fire chief arborvitae to the sides and two Mugos mops set back from that. The Kwanzan cherry pictured will likely be replaced with a thunbergii thunderhead and the shorter pine already in place at a distance, is a majestic beauty japanese black pine.


I'd like some input on what I could do to improve this, including island beds and also, what to do concerning driveway and entrance beds. I will need to gently curve for easy mow (and aesthetics) behind the hinokis, as well as decide how to curve the bed portion near the black dragon area to connect with the existing bed the purple pixies are in. The corner near the Holly is being enlarged, spireas moved and replaced with autumn sunburst azaleas.


Thanks!

Joe


Comments (32)

  • 19kev77
    8 years ago

    First. I'm an amateur like you, so here is my ametuer opinion.

    ISLANDS - I think you have too many islands. I might suggest connecting the left three islands and make one large boomerang shape island and plant perennials.

    DRIVEWAY - I would probably plant a row of boxwoods along the driveway bed and add plastic edging where you can to keep mulch from migrating. I'd probably add a large potted plant over the concrete drain pipe and mulch around it to cover concrete.

    GRASS - Maybe raise your lawn mower blade (and keep sharp). You appear to be cutting too low.

    EDGING - I would add well defined edging to all of your beds. Beds would look much sharper with a defined cut edge which I can't see. Mulch appears to bleed into the grass.


    Good luck.


  • Bama_Joe
    Original Author
    8 years ago
    I'm still planting and will be french edging when I get a firm bedline, so not using physical edging. I will be connecting some of those Japanese maples, they were recently planted and wasn't sure exactly what I would be doing. My Thunderhead pine just came in and have it at home. Boxwoods and not something I like or would want anywhere (except the two variegated I have by the porch). Have a mostly Asian theme going here. I really appreciate the response, as those seem to be lacking here lately.
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  • littlebug zone 5 Missouri
    8 years ago
    last modified: 8 years ago

    I agree with 19kev77. Way too many island beds. Actually, I would do NO island beds at all. Your yard is too small. If you plan to have a tree in the yard, that's fine, but don't make a bed around it. Don't plant shrubs in the the yard; plant them in beds that are connected to the house or driveway.

    Your mower is scalping your lawn. Are your mower blades bent? I never mow shorter than 3"; it looks like yours is shorter than that.

    And I agree with you about no physical edging. Take away those leaning bricks, too.

  • 19kev77
    8 years ago

    How do you enter your front door? It looks like you have landscaping along the front of steps. Did you remove access to your portch steps/door?

  • Bama_Joe
    Original Author
    8 years ago
    Thank you for the input. I enter via the sidewalk, which is clear, minus the tiered planter I had to move out of the backyard and some clay pots. You can't see it from a distance, but there is a full sidewalk between the porch bed and the bed with the black dragon.

    Lawn - I'm mowing at 2.5", so maybe I need to raise it half an inch. The mower is 48", which is too darn wide. A lot of he areas you see scalped are due to elevation changes and that wide deck now handling them well, but next year I will move up to 3 inch after the initial low cut to get the Bermuda going. I'm also not well versed with a riding mower, but wanted to reduce the area of grass to cut so I can use the Honda push mower. I have done that out back, since the back is pretty large (somewhere over 300 feet of fencing when I had the privacy fence replaced).

    Island beds - If you're referring to the area around the end of the driveway, that was a real big pain to mow and I kind of like it. There are two Japanese Maples out in the yard, with a small Majestic Beauty pine that will get much larger. I also have a Rutgers Constellation Dogwood on the left front corner of the lot, but no island beds on the left side (unless you count the sidewalk/foundation bed as an island. You would just leave the Japanese Maples by themselves? We are removing the Kwanzan pictured this weekend, 25 gallon planted almost one year ago. Not happy with it.
  • daylily
    8 years ago

    Re: island beds: I think the other posters are referring to the multitude of small circles in the front lawn that hold a single shrub/tree. I think they are suggesting that you get rid of most or all of them. I believe that most professional landscapers try for one or two larger sized beds with multiple plants within. If you google landscape design plans or drawings, you'll mostly see a large bed, and rarely will you see lots of small circles with a single plant. So I think that is what everyone is referring to.

  • Bama_Joe
    Original Author
    8 years ago
    I had planned on making two or so beds there, connecting some. Not a good idea? I know things don't look good right now, but it sure wasn't finished by any means.
  • daylily
    8 years ago

    So you have a large bed across the front already. Are you saying that you want two or more beds in front of the existing bed that will hold more stuff?

  • Bama_Joe
    Original Author
    8 years ago
    I wanted to add that Chantilly Lace and the Green Hornet near the driveway. The pine isn't an island bed (I just mulched it), but will be a large tree when grown.
  • daylily
    8 years ago

    To be honest, I can't tell from the pictures which is the green hornet vs the pine vs all of the other plants you refer to in your original post. I think that poster littlebug was suggesting that you remove all of the circles with a shrub in them - I think that is what he/she meant. And poster 19kev77 was suggesting remove them as well, or at least connect a few of them with a bed. For example, here is a picture I took from the internet. This landscape has a bed along the perimeter of the house, and then it looks to have a separate bed in the corner of the property near the street. (I can't tell if the bed closest to the street is connected with the bed near the house). I think that is what poster 19kev77 meant in that you could perhaps connect a few of the circles at the far left of your property near the street and make a boomerang shaped bed. But overall, everyone suggests not so many individual things that are mulched.



    If you planted a large tree to the left of your front yard, then yes, it could have a round circle of dirt and mulch at its base, but putting a round circle with a shrub in it looks odd.

  • Bama_Joe
    Original Author
    8 years ago
    I don't have any shrubs in the yard by themselves. The Pine is behind the Chantilly Lace and was a 5 gallon, so it is growing. Should be behind the Japanese Maple that has new growth (red in color) on the top. I definitely won't be leaving circles by themselves, but didn't want those laceleaf weeping maples in containers any longer.
  • daylily
    8 years ago

    Sorry again - I can see a red Japanese maple that seems to be right beside the path going into the house, but I can't really make out any of the other plants that you are referring to. Maybe some of the other posters will be able to help, but I am a bit lost.


    Just wondering though, if all of the plants in the circles are not shrubs - will they all become large trees? If so, it would seem to me that you will have too many large trees in front of your house. I would suggest one large tree towards the left side of the front yard, framing your house, would be good. But no more than one.

  • Bama_Joe
    Original Author
    8 years ago
    That shows them a little better.
  • littlebug zone 5 Missouri
    8 years ago
    last modified: 8 years ago

    I think I understand now. What we are seeing as "island beds" are small trees with mulch around them.

    Too too many trees! You might have room for ONE, placed preferably to the side of your yard opposite your driveway. Your yard is very small. One of the trees you have mentioned will be plenty. Do away with the rest and move the mulch elsewhere.

  • Bama_Joe
    Original Author
    8 years ago
    Those trees are weeping Japanese maples, so will not be huge. Also, cherry tree is gone, replaced with a Thunderhead Japanese Black Pine (much smaller than the cherry would've been).
  • melle_sacto
    8 years ago

    What advice did you want, exactly? You've rationalized all your decisions, effectively dismissing most of what people have suggested.

    Bigger, fewer beds and random plants in the grass will make your mowing easier. Less grass will make mowing easier.

    Your tree placement seems haphazard, what was the reason for their positions? I recommend connecting them all in a large bed so you aren't having to now around individual trees.

  • PKponder TX Z7B
    8 years ago
    last modified: 8 years ago

    It's too visually cluttered to have this many trees with no relation to each other (spatial, not species).

    I can't see how you would achieve a Japanese Garden feel with trees, regardless their mature size, just dotted all over the front yard.

    Did you just start collecting a lot of trees and now need to find a place to plant them?

  • Bama_Joe
    Original Author
    8 years ago
    I had originally planned on having beds out back, beneath my pine trees. I couldn't decide on where I wanted them, so I planted them out front, thinking I could tie them in with a bed/beds later on. Judging from all of the comments, I guess that was off course. They can definitely be moved my noobishness has screwed things up and would much rather do that now versus later, since things aren't rooted. I wanted the Hinokis on each side of the driveway and planned on making a bed on the left side of the driveway as you see it. What really needs to be done here? We planted the Thunderhead you see last night, so haven't received input on it yet. The Pine tree near the dogwood will get to appx 20 feet wide and taller, its a Majestic Beauty. What really needs to go, what can be rearranged out front in an acceptable manner, etc.
  • melle_sacto is hot and dry in CA Zone 9/
    8 years ago
    last modified: 8 years ago

    I can't seem to edit my post above, but I wondered if you had an overall inspiration design in mind. It might be helpful to you if you take a close examination of pictures of Japanese inspired gardens. I'm not very familiar w/the design of Japanese gardens, but what jumps out at me are the carefully curated layers and heights of plantings, year-round seasonal interest, asymmetrical balance, deliberate focal points.

    Picture slideshow

    Edit -- it's better to plan and get things right at the beginning. A lesson I've learned the hard way :-/ Also, you can easily have beds in the front yard and the back yard. If you're trying to create some privacy with the trees, I can see that maybe you have the backbone for that in place but it seems incomplete. Once you add the connected beds, additional layered shrubs (large, medium, small), some accent perennials...it will have more presence and not seem so haphazard.

  • Bama_Joe
    Original Author
    8 years ago
    Yes, I got a bit over zealous with the JM purchases. I sure don't want to trash them. Lord help me, I'll probably be eaten alive when I post the pics of what I did out back.
  • Bama_Joe
    Original Author
    8 years ago
    This what I have out back. The mopheads will be gone, but planned to keep the Vanilla Strawberries. I really didn't want a true Japanese garden, but wanted to use the maples and such.
  • Bama_Joe
    Original Author
    8 years ago
    I feel about 2 feet tall right now. Very humbled and feel like I really screwed myself. The pines were over planted purposely for early shade and planned on taking 3 out at a minimum after they grew taller. The area at the rear was for hummingbirds in my original plans. There are 5 camellias near the pine straw bails, knockout roses to their left, butterfly bushes in the back corner. The tree in the center large bed, is a small Redbud, rising sun. I thought I needed some different color with all the deep greens and purples. I have two hibiscus in center as well, with 4 smaller sasanquas that max at 3 to 4 feet wide, with the front camellias by the hollies being a bit smaller.
  • Bama_Joe
    Original Author
    8 years ago
    BTW, this started when my dog was diagnosed with Lupus and Pannus, which are both photosensitive autoimmune diseases. I found myself looking for shade all year out back and wanted plants that worked with that. I saw my first camellia and fell in love, then the Japanese maples and it steamrolled from there.

    I had the mindset that I could plant things, let them become somewhat established and add/complete as the funds allowed. Oh boy, what a mess I have made. The people I purchased the house from just had an ugly above ground pool in the center of the backyard, with a complete deck encircling it. I didn't want it, plus it was a hazard for my German Shepherd, so I tore it down. There were two Yoshino cherries out back, but one was dead and the other you can see and is not being kept.
  • PKponder TX Z7B
    8 years ago

    I have no idea at all about the specific trees and shrubs that you've chosen, I can't grow any of those here in Texas. My comments were more directed at the fact that you've planted them rather haphazardly and seemingly without a plan to the finished design. It really doesn't matter that it's finished as the budget allows. You'll need to develop a plan for how the beds with your specimen trees and your specimen shrubs will be laid out in the long run and plant them with that design in mind. I remember when you planted trees out back in straight lines, more like a nursery than a garden.


    Do you have any inspiration photos?

    Something like this without the boulders and bridge? Maybe with a garden bench and a small water feature that would draw wildlife and give your dog a cool spot to have a drink? My dog loves nothing more than drinking from our water features.


    Japanese themed gardens, google search

  • Bama_Joe
    Original Author
    8 years ago
    Melle - That was where I was going with the comment about being humbled. I'm trying to become better at that. I can definitely get a scaled drawing, since my sister drew the measurements I gave her in Autocad. I will measure the rest and sweet talk her into adding them in.

    PK - I did have one page I really liked and wanted to incorporate some sort of combo like his, minus the tree he has. I will try and look it up. Not sure about trees planted in a line, all trees are pictured. Maybe you're thinking about something else?
  • Bama_Joe
    Original Author
    8 years ago
    Thanks for the encouragement folks. I got the idea of generic beds with JMs from http://www.mikesbackyardnursery.com/2014/03/23-landscapimg-ideas-with-photos/ and dropped the ball on following through with design.

    I also saw the Thunderhead at a local nursery and fell in love....picture below. I was going to use coral bells like he had, but am afraid the Alabama sun would fry them. Maybe I can come up with some alternatives to what he has and I know the bed shapes would be different, but maybe I can leave some in place and still have it pleasing to the eye.
  • 19kev77
    8 years ago

    Since you have an interest in the Asian style, I see many plants that have potential for Bonsai. If you starting thinning areas out (produce a plan first), pot a few for Bonsai training :)

    You have some very nice plants/trees to works with. In your case I might hire a local professional to design and execute using the existing plants onsite.

    Allowing a designer to walk the space would provide a perspective we can't get. Money worth spending in my opinion. Stop buying plants! Good Luck. Love to see it when done.

  • Bama_Joe
    Original Author
    8 years ago
    I will be buying a few, but have a landscaper helping now. He walked the place and we have some measurements for a new bed where I am removing the three hydrangea beds. Getting rid of the six mopheads and relocating the three paniculatas to the back of my yard. Have a bed that potentially could be 36 feet long and mid 20's wide, depending on how we do things. Want to possibly use some cryptomeria and false cypress types to add different color and texture to the yard. Will modify the existing center bed as well.
  • Bama_Joe
    Original Author
    8 years ago
    My sister just redrew the bones layout in Cad for me and will be emailing it. I've been working really long days, but have a five day weekend, so will be doing some measuring this weekend. Guess it is going to be best to give the Nelly and Edward Stevens Hollies, along with both Needlepoint Hollies to friends. I don't have a local person whom I trust and really don't have the cash. Just forked out $2600 for surgery for one of my pups. Poor guy tore his ACL and had to get TPLO surgery at 3 years old. I will draw in where everything currently is and hope I can make a plan that includes the two weeping yaupon hollies, having everything look proper. The guy I hired to do the back, it's just not at all what I expected and am not happy with it. He took offense when I pointed out he planted the Nellie Stevens with a spacing like the large encores should have.
  • User
    8 years ago

    Hi

    joe is there a papermill near you? if so they have an amazing byproduct

    called "grit", a mix of ground bark and sand/dirt. It could be free only pay

    trucker for hauling. great mulch. my suggesting would be to connect the

    shrubs and trees with mulch and see what you have. If you like what you have then fill in with annuals and perennials. Trust yourself. If you like it

    then it's good. It's hard for us to look at your pics and see your vision.

    please don't be in a hurry to pull shrubs/trees out live with them for a while.

    then make adjustments as needed.

    go to a bookstore or mag stand and look at"Fine Garden" magazines

    beautiful pics and great ideas

    I hope your puppies are better.

    Jo

  • cyn427 (z. 7, N. VA)
    8 years ago

    I think once your trees grow some (5-6 years?), you will have a lovely beginning to your landscaping. I find a lot of people will say "too many trees" when I say, "woohoo!" Once you begin to see how the size of the trees fill in your space, you can start to add shrubs, perennials (with the shade you anticipate, start perusing the hosta forum now for inspiration), etc. I think the back will be amazing! The front needs to grow in to itself as well, but I would connect several of your mulched tree areas together to make an island where you can add shrubs now, keeping the trees as anchors for the island(s).

    I agree with Jo-trust yourself. We have all made mistakes. I cannot tell you how many things I have moved, removed, and added to here. :-)