Quick question - does any of the new plumbing hang below the joists ? SMH

yes, it does

Ask the plumber for dinner and a kiss. Because he just screwed you.

Thanks Cabot, This is what I am thinking as well. Do the good joists need to be sistered? I already have good 2x8 lumber so I figure while the ceiling is opened I minds well..

Yes the diagram should have included sistering the good joists

Through bolt a couple pieces of 6' long 1/4" thick plate steel to each side and forget it.

Like Joe said - check out steel companies in your area - I got a 3/8" thick plate, and they drilled the holes. Through bolted it with 7/16" bolts.

I had a couple of contractors come by and both recommended scabbing on 2x8s to the affected area with 1/2" bolts and construction adhesive. Would this be sufficient in bringing the strength back to this joist?

Edit: Updated drawings: 2 2x8s would be required to clear the trap which sticks out 2" .

Thanks!

Yes that looks good too, but I'd make that middle joist with a notch instead of a missing section.

Just my opinion...

Contractors think in wood cause it's cheap, easy to get, and easy to work, but you might be getting the same level of expertise exhibited by the plumber who caused the problem. do you want to treat the symptom or cure the disease?

If it were my floor I'd look into the metal plate and know it will not fail.

The correct solution can be easily determined by a structural engineer if you want to spend the money to know.

What your contractors have proposed is wrong and is a structural building code violation most everywhere.

Why?

Because once a joist is notched to such a degree as is shown in the original photos, the joist must be replaced.

Circa83 correctly observed that the original 2x8 is now only a 2x2 because so much depth has been removed from the member.

Building codes normally only allow a notch of 1/6th the depth of the joist to be removed, before the joist needs to be replaced.

If we consider that these are 'true' 2x8 joists, then one can only remove about 1 5/16ths of an inch in any notch, even less than that with 'nominal' lumber.

And NO NOTCHES can be made in the middle 3rd of any joist's span at any time!

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Cabot and Rowe's diagram from that post on Monday July 20th is a code compliant way to repair the joists.

Sistering the joists from your (Circa83) most recent diagrams in the manner shown is illegal and a code violation, and really does nothing to help repair the damaged joist.

Considering your joists also appear to be 24" on center, this latest proposal is quite preposterous to say the least.

Sistering only works as long as you install a new, full length joist or joists alongside the damaged joists, and only as long as the new joists are run as full length joists bearing on both ends on the foundation walls or beams to bear the floor loads.

What is shown in the latest diagrams is ridiculous...and no fix at all.

That said, you 'might' get an architect or engineer to design some type of repair of a damaged joist like yours by sistering partial 2x8s ON BOTH SIDES of the damaged joist(s) without the new members extending all the way to the foundation walls, but such a repair would need to be engineered.

What has been proposed to Circa83 in the lastest diagram will simply not work.

Either repair the damaged joists following Cabot and Rowe's diagram from July 20, OR run 1 or 2 full length new joists on either side of the damaged one, OR call an architect or an engineer to design a 'partial' fix...and then GET RID of the 'contractors' who have proposed this latest abomination since they have no clue what they are doing!

Luck!

Since the proposed new header does not appear to exceed 4' and appears to be within 3' of the trimmer joists bearing, neither it nor the trimmers need to be doubled, however, because the plumbing was done before the framing, it appears unlikely that the new framing will fit under the new plumbing without altering the plumbing.

Let's hope those joists aren't 24" on center, because the strip underlayment is laid diagonally, greatly increasing its span and subsequent springiness.

Thanks manhattan , The joists are actually 16" on center but I see your point. Now I just need to find a contractor that will fix it correctly.

In my fair state, the headers need to be doubled no matter the length. Check your local code or just double them as its cheap insurance against doing it twice or spending the time to find out.

Thanks all for your feedback. This seems like the best design given the situation. Fortunately, I think we do have room to get doubled headers in around the plumbing.

Remember to use the metal brackets and correct nails for the brackets.

One more question. The supply lines run though that joist cavity. If we header off this section what is the best way to run the supplies?

Can the new headers be drilled through like this, or would we have to run the supplies underneath and create a soffit?

Wanted to follow up and say thanks to all of you for all the advice. We had a contractor implement this design and everything is looking good!