I currently only have 17 roses, but 8 have come from Heirloom; 3 from original owners and 5 from new owners. These roses were all incredibly healthy and arrived in excellent condition within the promised time frame. We have lost so many own root nurseries. I will continue to support and buy from Heirloom as I expand my rose garden. Their customer service is friendly and knowledgeable. I am on the east coast, so I actually like having the price include shipping. I am sorry you had such a bad experience in their garden, especially on your birthday. I hope you can forgive them and continue to support this nursery. We need them.

It is not a matter of forgiveness. Sharing my opinion here does not mean that I want Heirloom to close. I am passionate about it not closing. Other customers do not complain or share their displeasure; they simply buy elsewhere. My goal is to get the folks at Heirloom to take notice and make positive changes so that they continue--and part of the process is for them to listen to their customers and take action based on this input.

I am sincerely happy for the online customers who are so satisfied -- although a 50% increase in individual rose prices online and onsite makes it hard for me to believe this. A one-rose purchase on-line is reasonable in pricing, but if you are like me and buy numerous roses, the price point for additional roses is cost prohibitive. For those who have the money to afford this without concern for a budget, you are very fortunate. But many are not in your position.

While I do appreciate the letter from Ben Hanna, that letter was damage control. I was not referring to any "construction" zones. Certainly, that would understandable. I wish that I had taken pictures for you all to see. His statements can in no way justify the neglect of the gardens. As I said we may debate this, but we shall see what happens and whether or not Heirloom will survive with their current marketing strategies.

CJ,

Regardless whether or not it was damage control, I do hope the gardens do not remain neglected. But either way, I think you have done a great service by starting this thread. You have made it quite clear to Heirloom Roses that those gardens mean something to us rose lovers and to your community, and I don't think they will be as lax in their care moving forward. Good on you for blowing the whistle. And I do hope the get the gardens back in tip top shape. Everyone deserves a second chance so please keep us updated on the status of the garden. If they do in fact improve I will be more than happy to continue my patronage to them despite the price hikes. If not....I guess we'll see.

I think it is fabulous news that the gardens are being renovated, and that they are making sure to save all of the rare varieties. I do not think it is reasonable to expect that they would be kept in totally pristine condition in this really, truly, horrible drought with a horrible heat wave on top of it, especially as there are on-going plans to change everything around. The information that the gardens are the subject of much thought and plans for the future made me so happy.

As to deadheading, I don't do that in my own garden - if I did that is all I would be able to do, 24/7. It does not hurt to roses to not deadhead them. In these sort of conditions, some roses survive by going dormant, and not deadheading them helps that process. We are talking survival here, and I would expect the gardens to reflect that.

I haver purchased many roses from Heirloom over the years, and all have been healthy, and except for one out of dozens the correct variety. (I got what turned out to be Summer Wine instead of Altissimo 20 years ago, and Summer Wine has turned out to be a fabulous rose, and a MUCH better color for that part of the garden - don't know what I was thinking of ordering A. SW is still going strong. Now when I want to order roses I only use Heirloom and Rogue Valley Roses, both of which are in Oregon (I am in North. CA). I was recently in Oregon. It was 102 degrees for three days in a row - in June! This is truly unheard of. Oregon does have warm summers, but the overall climate is usually mild and great for roses. Hopefully this winter things will return to more normal conditions.

I have no comment on the pricing. Prices are a function of the market working. If things are mis-priced, they won't sell. This happens automatically, and there is no point arguing about it. If the owners are using prices, and also changing the gardens, so that the nursery can thrive and grow for many more years, I think that is great!

Jackie

I agree that the dialogue is healthy to help Heirloom continue to improve their products, pricing and gardens, and I have a lot of respect for Ben to be willing to wade into this discussion and let us know where he's coming from. We may disagree with his conclusions, but at least there's communication and that's always a good foundation for improvements.

As for the pricing, I don't see that the most recent pricing change doubled the price of the roses, and it's arguably still the same as most other rose companies, except Chamblees and Burlington that are unusually inexpensive. Most mail order companies sell their roses at around $17-19 each, plus shipping. Roses Unlimited for instance, charges by the distance, and in Nebraska that's $7/rose no matter how many roses I buy until you get up to the bulk order of 66 roses. That makes their roses at least $24 each, which is the new cost of most Heirloom roses with shipping included. True, gallons cost more to mail, but I recently put in an order at Northland and they sell bands. Again, the bands were $17, and the shipping for 12 roses came to $62. That's a little over $5/rose in shipping, or a total cost of $22. If I had only ordered one rose, the shipping for that one rose in their system turned out to be a totally insane amount (it might have doubled the price, with $16 shipping).

It seems to me that this the kind of insane imbalance that the Heirloom system is trying to avoid. Most companies charge a shipping cost per rose that increases with the number of roses, so people like me that buy a LOT of roses from each company still pay a LOT of shipping, and I'm OK with that. I'm no more inconvenienced in the cost than someone only ordering a few roses, but the few rose buyer can get really socked with shipping costs in the system at most nurseries. Heirloom is no pricier than most of the mail order companies at the bottom line, and in my case considerably cheaper than any local nursery I could walk into and buy roses (usually at $40 or higher) except the big box companies, and we certainly don't want those to be our only options.

As for quality, I've been buying a lot of roses yearly for about 8 years, and I noticed a dramatic increase in the quality of the bands from Heirloom when the newest owners took over. I used to have to mentally add a year to the old Heirloom bands to catch up to bands from any other grower, and it was only in their fourth year they "leaped", assuming of course they had enough root system to survive the winter, which they often didn't in the Old Heirloom. I've observed the New Heirloom roses have outstanding root system and are larger plants for band roses than just about any other company I order from. I can't find the photo now, but I took one on my patio of all the dozens of band roses from various companies clustered on a table and the New Heirloom roses in general towered over the others.

Bottom line for me is I am pleased with both Heirloom's quality and pricing, and you've set them a challenge to improve the quality of the show gardens that they can work on. That clearly sounds like room for improvement, but something they can work on.
Cynthia

On a good note:

My Earthsong came today from Heirloom...:-) My other Earthsong from another vendor was planted at the beginning of May but shows signs of RMV and has not grown hardly at all... SO its planted elsewhere in the yard...

Looks like the perfect spot, Jim. I'm looking forward to receiving COUNTRY DANCER from Herloom at the beginning of October. I chose a fall shipping date, because of my hot zone.

I've ordered mostly mini's & minifloras from them because they carry a great variety and many can only be found at Heirloom. Everything I've received from Heirloom has been in great shape and all have grown the way I expect. I just received 2 more today (Giggles & Ingrid) and moved them into 1 gal. pots. When finished, they looked like they came in those 1 gal. pots. They were huge. I'll be trying some of their shrub & and HT's this fall. If they do well in my garden, they have a customer for life. I'm not wealthy by any means but If I find a rose that I want, I'll find a way to buy it. As long as the prices stay close to what I'm use to paying (4 plant's, $100/$120), I have no problems with Heirloom. As far as the grounds go, Give them a year or so to prove themselves. To keep the company afloat, they have to sell great plants first before they can invest anything back into the garden.

Ken, about 2/3 of my HTs are from Heirloom, and I had the same experience as you. Healthy, well-grown plants carefully shipped. I put my bands in the ground right away and they grow-grow-grow. I have only lost 2; one a tree fell on her 1st year in ground and the other a very large-booted teenager stepped on right after planting and broke off at the ground & then stepped on roots & smashed when I was trying to save it! Total freak accidents!

I have 3 roses from Heirloom, all new this year, and they are all doing very well. I have a Benjamin Britten band that is 4 feet tall already. I did buy them before the price hike. I was going to get two more this year but their pricing does have me looking for other resources. Maybe Heirloom can hire some high school kid for the rest of the summer to pull weeds, deadhead, and tie up canes.

I don't think the quality of their roses was ever in question. I think it was more the outrage over the gardens looking unkept. Add that to the price hikes and we were all in a tizzy. The fact that the owner saw this post and assured us the gardens would be updated and rejuvenated made this post well worth it.

Yes, SoFL, it is true about the quality. I've lost a few, but generally the quality has been good, so this really wasn't the main issue for me. A negative comment or in this case constructive criticism, does not mean that Heirloom is all bad and that their product is bad -- nor does this criticism have anything to do with the potential of losing an original rootstock rose business--because we certainly don't want that. The main reason I wrote was because of the state of their grounds, and I am not talking about any areas under construction, but the over abundance of weeds and lack of general maintenance on all the roses. Blaming the state of the gardens on construction was a red herring. Also, it is the fact that they are charging people who come to the gardens the same pricing for a rose than what is charged in the catalog when no manpower is used and no shipping is involved. The "buy 5 roses and get one free" just doesn't cut it for me. I'd love to hear some comments about this. Hey, I love Heirloom -- as it was and hope it will continue and improve in the coming years.

You've made your point (a few times) and it has been addressed by the owner. What good does it do to keep throwing mud? Does anyone think they can change anything by continuously throwing mud? Let's get back to the positive.

Ken - I agree, let's be positive. I challenge you to reread what I have written and instead of focusing on the negative comments or as you put it "slinging mud", recognize all that I have said that is positive. I have a great love for Heirloom, their roses and the gardens. If I didn't care, I would not have written this thread in the first place. I was simply refocusing the comments toward the original issues. There is no question about Heirloom's great products

I've ordered roses from so many sources and heirloom has always been the most satisfactory. They've always arrived on time and very healthy. Last year I got three roses from Chamblees and all three were diseased and didn't make past their first summer. I got twelve roses from Heirloon this spring and I'm amazed at how healthy and how much they've grown in just their first three months in my garden. I live all the way across the country from Oregon, so I can't visit their nursery. As long as they keep sending me healthy roses I'll remain a loyal customer.

Have to say that I must have a "let them eat cake attitude" towards roses and pricing. I love cut flowers. How much is a nice bouquet of loose flowers from the florist? the grocery store? $15 to $50? So, if I order a really plump, healthy plant from Heirloom and it costs me $25, I hope that it lives to grow many seasons, but, if it doesn't , I don't consider it money lost. I will have gotten lots of pleasure, and lots of roses out of it. I have been very happy this year with the plants I received from Heirloom and don't consider their pricing out of line. Most of the people on this site are wonderful rose growers and I recognize that you need to buy much more stock than I; however, the market is the market…if Heirloom's quality is good, then we need to pay for it. (I also buy delphinium every year like annuals…can't grow the darn things to save my life, but want them in my garden!)

Guys, cut them some slack. It is hard enough to keep a small business/young family going and they are not obligated to have a display garden. If they have one, we are lucky to get a free ride. If they don't, well, they own us nothing. if $25 and free shipping is too expensive, then don't buy from them.

I just re-read this entire thread, and came away with the impression that Heirloom is one of our rose nursery treasures, and is taking steps to get better and to thrive into the future! So many many people talk about their good experiences buying from them. I personally am looking forward to how the gardens come out when they have been renovated - hopefully after a nice wet winter this coming winter. If I was planning on completely re-doing my garden, and changing everything around, and there was a truly historic drought, and unheard of high temperatures, I think I would let it go dormant in the heat, and not fuss with it too much. In my personal garden the roses have gone dormant - they don't look as pretty, but they are staying alive and will wake up in the Fall.

We have lost so many rose nurseries in the last few years - I am so happy to hear about this one, which has a plan for the future. Good for them for raising their prices to where they can continue in business! The market will determine what prices will work - if you don't like the price, don't buy from them, but I certainly intend to.

Jackie

Well on another good note the new baby band Earthsong I bought and planted from Heirloom on July 17th is growing very well!

That's amazing growth. It's hard to believe Earthsong just went in the ground. It must like your garden, Jim. Diane

This is a Sharifa Asma purchased as a band from Heirloom Roses and planted in May of 2014. For just being in it's second year in my garden I can't believe how much it's grown and how healthy it is. This is what I really appreciate about Heirloom Roses and why I am a loyal customer.

That's beautiful, James. You're another James/Jim who grows lovely roses. Diane

From what I understand the Heirloom prices include shipping. They're actually cheaper than ARE and Rogue Valley where I just paid over $32 after shipping and handling charges for one rose each.

I think what we are all observing in all of the remaining old rose nurseries could have been predicted by the supply/demand/price curve on page 10 of any introductory economics book. We know that the supply of nurseries offering old roses has gone down in the last 4-5 years, unfortunately. So, if the demand has not gone down as much as the supply has (and I do not think it has), prices go up, period. I love it when markets work as predicted!

It is what will keep the remaining old rose nurseries in business, and hopefully eventually cause more to get into the market. Luckily the rose market has not yet been taken over by the government!

Jackie

I have also ordered from Heirloom Roses for several years and only lost roses in the beginning when I really didn't know what I was doing!! I had a Zephrine that was probably 15 years old when her entire rootball was eaten by voles. She was huge. I also had Darlow's Enigma which grew to about 6ft x 8ft wide. I lost this one trying to move it one too many times. I purchased about 10 HR last year during their sale and didn't lost one Cream Abundance rose that was wintered over in a pot in the ground. All were extremely healthy when I received them and well packed to survive the trip to Massachusetts. I have ordered from them again this year and have received healthy roses again.

Shipping is expensive. Chamblee's Roses shipping to MA doubles the price of the rose, Northlan Rosarium the same so $27/ rose including shipping is not extreme. Even Rose Unlimited, which is much closer to me, still has fairly expensive shipping but this is not the fault of the vendor. UPS and Fed-Ex have extremely high shipping costs. USPS is more reasonable but they and offer the same convenience as UPS/Fed-Ex so I'm not sure why vendors aren't shipping USPS but that's a bit off topic. At least with Heirloom the cost of the rose is known upfront. As others pointed out shipping for one rose pushes many of the other vendors prices very high. It's an expensive hobby but one usually can't find the variety available in their local garden center. Even Knockouts are over $30 at my local HD. David Austins range from $40-46 in my area at various nurseries and they are not own root which is my preference. You're lucky to have access to so many wonderful roses that you can purchase on sight after careful selection of the healthiest largest rose or sale items. Many of us can only dream of having this kind of choices so readily available.

Todays 1 month since I planted our Heirloom Roses band of Earthsong. Hopefully it gets settled in before frosts hit...I prefer planting in the Spring...

Beautiful rose, Jim, and what progress it's made in such a short time. Hope your winter is a mild one. Diane

My heart is broken. Yesterday, I drove by the Heirloom Gardens to see how things were going only to see a sign saying that they were closed and that the gardens were no longer open to the public. Looked across the street and the cottage was gone. This wonderful place, a place that we would travel to 3 times per year to stroll the gardens and buy roses. . .no longer standing. The new owners say, "We're a family-owned business that treats our customers like family." Only if you purchase on line. Horrible. I would always go there and purchase 3 or 4 roses. Haven't purchased anything from them in 2 years and now don't plan to. Wonder if there are other folks out there who feel the same way. So sad.

Webuser,Oh noo, I was planing to see heirloom garden this June for the very first time and today I read on their website that closed the garden for public and Found the news in here , oh no,Im wondering why?do they going out of business?

I have been ordering from Heirloom Roses for about 25 years now and have only once received a mislabeled rose from them--and that one was clearly done by accident during the transition to new ownership. So I hope they will stay in business. I second the comment about the health of their plants, a point which is very important for my short season climate. Possibly, just guessing, they can no longer afford the staff to maintain display gardens.

Meanwhile, I just received my third mislabeled rose from another nursery; this is getting to the point where that nursery's attitude towards their customers is insulting. I don't want sort of what I ordered, or something of which the name looks kind of the same, I want what I ordered.

More than likely it will go out of business. The prices are expensive and with no retail, the gardens are so far off the beaten path that there isn't any incentive to go there any more.

I still have slide shows and pictures from our 2 trips to Heirloom roses few years ago. It was a paradise. Sad to hear about the demise of the garden. They should charge for visiting the garden and use the money for maintenance.

In year 2022, Wollerton Old Hall is priced at $60.

The thing that kills me most about this thread from 7 years ago is the sheer entitlement expressed by some people who used to visit their gardens and were outraged that there were weeds and roses not deadheaded, this during a transition time when new owners bought the business. The thing that makes me smile is all of the satisfied customers who got great roses from them, even at the exact time this post was made. Count me in the long-time (20+ years) satisfied customer group, with the old owners and the new owners. Yes, they've increased their prices over the years, but get a grip. And Austin has made it much more difficult and expensive for nurseries to offer their roses in any way, hence most dropping carrying them at all.

A five gallon Austin in Austin pot and with tags is $41 at my local nursery as comparison. Diane

Susan,

I totally agree, so many rose specialty nurseries have gone belly up over the years, and Heirloom is still able to provide a unique, enormous catalog of roses for purchase. They have proved the naysayers wrong and their model still works. Imagine if we had to import those roses ourselves, that would be almost impossible. I have purchased plenty of $8 body bags at Home Depot and Lowes that have grown into big beautiful bushes and rejoiced at what a great deal I got. But I absolutely cherish the option of getting that hard-to-find rose at Heirloom, I’m very thankful they are still around for special service they provide.

Blue For You, purchased at Heirloom Roses for ~$50.

Heirloom (name is a coincidence) saved from Lowe’s dumpster for $1.

I’m happy that I’m able to get a rare rose, and I’m happy to get a bargain, and that in the US we can still do both!

Agreed Susan .

I love my heirloom roses . If I had a complaint it’s that sometimes I can’t get my roses shipped asap . You have to choose a date and if they are busy they aren’t booked out for weeks . But good for them !!

Their sales will make it worth while . Order 3 roses , and you get free shipping usually. I collect roses so not a problem here. Only shop a sale . They are like kohls , they always have sales so you never need to pay full price.

I have an account so I earn ten dollar off coupons all the time ,

They are huge rooted plants that bloom so quickly after they leaf out .

They offer roses I’ll never see anywhere else, the clements roses are an absolute treasure .

And living in California, roses are abundant of course but they are mostly the star / weeks ones . They are always around 35$ to 69.99 for climbers / Austin’s ( 45 for the shrubs Austin’s .

25$ in spring in the pulp pots . But add in gas , at 5.65 on a good day a gallon .. and I’m thrilled to shop from home. I can get unique roses for my garden .

Here’s the thing , I would not pay 300 for a Michael kors purse but I am not going on a handbag forum to complain about their prices . Times change and I’m so glad they are still in business !

Diane , I’m visiting fam in pgh and Austin’s are 39 here and I wish I could load one on the plane haha

I just received Spirit of Freedom from Heirloom this week. I was nervous about ordering because a search brought up threads just like this. I'm glad I went for it anyway - the rose they sent was bigger than any I have received from other vendors. Yes, I paid $60 for her ( and added Plum Perfect to get free shipping) but I am more than happy with what I received. I don't go to movies or out to dinner often so if I splurge on a rose, so be it. My local nursery doesn't carry much besides knockouts, so I have to order to get what I want. I just wanted to add this in case someone else like me is searching them out. The roses they sent were big and healthy, and no, they didn't strip the leaves. Well packaged. And FYI, they are having a sale on Austin's right now. If I had more garden space I would be shopping.

It is obvious that their prices are high when compared to other vendors. A Mercedes Benz won’t really do anything different than my Toyota, but it is simply more expensive. Some people are willing to pay for it and I am not. They do not have to lower their prices for me, or should they? Maybe I am just too capitalist?

They have a business and they price their product at WHATEVER price they choose. Like Jackie mentioned years ago in this thread, if their product is priced too high it won’t sell. If there are people who are willing to pay a higher price for a rose they really need/want then they are in business. They are not forcing anyone to purchase their product. This reminds me of another thread where the Op felt David Austin owes us a discount every year. Heirloom does not owe anyone a display garden or discount. If their prices get so high that enough people can’t afford them they simply won’t be able to sell enough volume.

Sorry all for the super long rant, I did not sleep all night with a sick baby. I guess the entitlement attitude from the original post really got me this morning.

@dianela7analabama Isn't it the worst when the babies get sick and we get even less sleep? I can so relate, my oldest is getting sick a lot this year in 1st grade, then brings it home and gets my youngest sick, too. Then they both wake up and crawl in my bed and cough all over everything including me and my pillow, lol. I hope your little one gets better soon! Yes the original post and the subsequent comments the OP made are verging on ridiculous IMO. I visited a free garden that I didn't call ahead about even though I knew it recently changed hands and it wasn't perfect enough for my sky-high expectations so I'm boycotting the company! Sincerely, Karen.

I too don't see how a business is obliged to have a display garden. Also I'm not sure a business is obliged to hire enough people to maintain one in perfect condition. It is just really hard to both propagate plants and maintain a garden. I don't relate to a perfectionist approach to gardening. So many aspects of gardening take patience , and faith that things will turn out well eventually if various conditions are met. Problems turn up , unforeseen set backs. You roll with it with an attitude that it'll all come together. But if you stomp your foot and want it all to be perfect at all times I don't see how you can enjoy it.

I notice a number of nurseries do not allow customers on site.

@Mischievous Magpie (CO 5b)

Thank you! Yes it is always so sad when little ones get sick because they can’t even tell you what hurts. My 15 month old just finished antibiotics for an ear infection 3 weeks ago, then got a cold from a family member. Finished that cold a week ago and is now again with bilateral ear infections plus cutting his upper lateral incisors. I hope both of yours get a break also and feel better, I can’t even imagine how much more difficult it would be with two sick children.

I do not usually engage in too much criticism or debate online. I do not like judging people since I do not know their motives or challenges, but some times people forget that what is a lovely hobby to us is a business to those people. They may even like roses, but their job is to sell roses to pay for their home, cars, medical insurance and food. They are just trying to make a living like everyone else.

I know I can barely keep up my own yard, much less run a business too. I went to Heirloom Roses 25 years ago (from Alaska) and really enjoyed their display garden but I would never think that that display garden would help a mailorder business survive these days.

They also have sales all the time if youre signed up for their email listing.Ive bought quite a few more Ive really wanted, but couldnt find elsewhere or had to order multiples to make it worth the shipping...Raspberry Cream Twirl comes to mind!🤗

They also have sales all the time if youre signed up for their email listing.Ive bought quite a few more Ive really wanted, but couldnt find elsewhere or had to order multiples to make it worth the shipping...Raspberry Cream Twirl comes to mind!🤗

Geez! Houzz strikes a

I will not order from them again. They lost my claim form, twice. They don’t even send a proof of your submission once you complete the form. Each rose cost about $49, some $60 per rose.

Beside the price, their website got hacked and payment information exposed…

Their custom service? Worst than well designed bots!

I rather spend money in official David Austin roses!

I've ordered from Heirloom several times and have been very pleased with both the quality of their roses and their wonderful customer service when I changed my order multiple times. Just my two cents. Their prices are high but they offer free shipping on orders over $100 and almost always have a sale.

I have had great experiences with Heirloom Roses. Their roses have done very well for me and I have never had a problem.