myk1, there are grapes growing wild up into 40' tall trees at the edge of my property. a few years ago, there was a small bunch of delicious seeded concord type grapes within reach. that's what inspired me to plant grapes. i wonder if it might also be a source of black rot. there's plenty of grapevines growing wild in my area, but i rarely see actual grapes. i try to avoid spraying, and prefer less toxic controls when i do spray. i dont know if grapes are a high enough priority to grow if they need frequent spraying. i grow tomatoes, and only sprayed them last year [due to the late blight outbreak in the northeast] my plants didnt get it, whether from spraying or luck, i dont know. i grow raspberries, which dont seem to need spraying. i wouldnt plant tree fruit because i know how necessary frequent spraying is. i was hoping grapes were more like the raspberries, or that i'd love them so much that i'd be willing to spray if needed. i thought there were only a few clusters, a meager crop, until i went to cut out the infected fruit and saw how bountiful the crop could have been. i'm still undecided. the one time spray of myclobutanyl sounds intriguing.

It appears that the reference that I gave about the problems of wood mulches and the advantage of compost could use some backing up by more primary scientific material. The link below is to an Ohio State University Extension Fact Sheet, Plant Pathology, 2021 Coffey Road, Columbus, Ohio 43210 Title: "Control of Nuisance and Detrimental Molds (Fungi) in Mulches and Composts" Please note the following and put in context of the full article (also note the appearance of statements such as "These bacteria compete with fungi to reduce the potential for the development of major mold problems.") "The best way to avoid all these problems and bring about beneficial effects by mulching is to add nitrogen to woody and hardwood bark products followed by composting to lower the carbon to nitrogen ratio. Blending of grass clippings with wood wastes before composting is one way to achieve this. Addition of poultry manure or urea to supply 1.2 lbs. available nitrogen per cubic yard of material satisfies the nitrogen need also. Some landscapers add 10-15% by volume composted sewage sludge to hardwood bark or wood wastes, and this makes an ideal product that has performed very well in landscapes. These amended products should be composted at least six weeks. This process kills plant pathogens, eggs of insect pests, and produces a nitrified product that releases plant nutrients rather than ties up nitrogen. As mentioned above, the microorganisms that have colonized these products reduce the potential for growth of nuisance fungi and provide control of many plant diseases" "What to Do Once the Problems Occur Sometimes very little can be done to control nuisance fungi other than to spade the mulch into the surface soil layer followed by soaking with water. Another option is to remove the mulch, place it in a heap after thorough wetting to allow for self-heating to occur (110-140 degrees F). This will kill nuisance fungi. If fresh dry mulch is placed on top of mulch colonized by nuisance fungi, the problems may occur again the following year or even earlier. The best control strategy for homeowners and landscapers is to purchase composted products low in wood content. Fresh, finely ground woody products should be avoided for many reasons unless composted first. Coarse fresh woody products are much less likely to cause problems unless applied too deep. It is important to soak all mulches immediately after they have been applied. Generally, mulches should not be applied to a depth greater than two inches. Mulches and composts applied in this manner provide many types of beneficial effects rather than nuisance problems, or worse, plant diseases. Sour mulches should be avoided altogether." Here is a link that might be useful: link for above

First of all, thanks for all the suggestions and taking the effort and time to educate me and help me. I decided to buy Ruby seedless and Perlette after taking the list on this thread to a competent nursery person and discussing it with them and also based on local availability. I have also placed an order for a Kyoho - just because I like the fruit so much that I am willing to try growing it. homey_bird, what I was told at the nursery I went to is that if you are in a cooler area, you need to buy varieties that require less heat to produce fruit and ripen (btw/ what I did not mention is that i also had a Thompson seedless that i planted at the same time as my ill fated Concord and it got a really bad case of white mildew 2 years in a row that I decided to remove it several years ago - I was not spraying anything on them at that time). You may want to keep your Thompson vine for a couple of years (I hope you planted it in full sun) and see if you get fruit - you might be luckier than I. If not, you can always get another one to try. As for me, I am keeping all my new grapes in large pots for a couple of years and move it around until I find a place in my yard where they fruit reliably. Good luck - as someone told me in another thread, this is just a hobby and supposed to be fun :)

I've been growing grapes in the Puget Sound region for a number of years. Pure Vitis Vinifera type grapes are prone to many root and foliage diseases. The "Champaigne" grape is very sensitive to powdery mildew. I have about 80 varieties of table and wine grapes up near Tacoma and could suggest several, depending on you growing season length and heat accumulation. Most grapes need at least 1,700 degree days accumulated above 50 degrees F., during the season to ripen their fruit. Most of the well-known Vinifera types need over 2,000 gdd/50 to ripen. Contact me for some more details. You can grow some awsome grapes in the Northwest, but you won't find them at the 'big box' stores. I have one called Richard Walden that is very resistant to botrytis and mildew that does pretty well locally, and is seedless. It has Flame Seedless as a pollen parent and is also seedless.