Hi hope037, my DH built a large pergola over a portion of our back deck. I don't grow anything over it but I do grow clematis up the posts. I thought about growing something over the top but several things stopped me: leaf litter, loss of light to the inside and painting/maintenance. We like to dine under this area and decided we'd rather not deal with the debris that might fall all over the deck if we could avoid it. Also, the pergola cuts down on the light entering the kitchen, which is fine because we have loads of natural light coming in through other windows, but we thought a dense vine would shade more than we'd like. Finally, painting/maintenance could become a chore if whatever we grew had to be chopped back to do so. You may want to consider them, too. Just thought of something else. If the vine attracts stinging/biting insects you or your guests may be running for cover somewhere else. ; ) Please don't get me wrong - I love covered pergolas. Just trying to help you explore the pros and cons of a vine covered one over a patio. Diana

I planted a Dawn Redwood 20 years ago in my backyard. Today it is 60 feet tall and last year produced hundreds of cones. I have about 100 seedlings that range in size from 1 inch to 12 inches in 5 months of growth. I had about 10% germination. I planted in several different soil conditions and different sun locations. I have concluded that full sun with daily watering is the most effective combination for growth. Seedlings growing directly next to each other have different growth rates. I have no significant browning of leaves in full sun. I will begin planting the strongest seedlings in the ground next year and continue pot growing the remaining until they have enough root structure to support them. My original tree (purchased as a 1 year old seedling) started slowly and then after about 5 years exploded with a 5 foot a year growth. It did not seed this year much to my disappointment. I think I have found the right combination of growth factors through trial and error. I am hoping to get another chance soon. For those who wish to grow only a few trees I suggest ordering seedlings from a grower. They will have the 1st year of growth out of the way and will be much more likely to survive.

If you're doing a cover crop then part of the sequence is to actually cut the crop before it comes to flower so you get plenty of juicy material that rots down quickly - and has enough fibre to not make a felted mess (like you see with heaps of grass clippings.) The roots stay in the soil and, as they rot down, add even more humus to the soil. It is really important to not bury the cover crop deeply, It can combine with clay to make a bit of a toxic brew for a while. If you live in a rural area observe how the farmers disc in the crop residue (hoping that they don't burn off.) You might also notice that some farmers turn stock onto the crop residue to clean up and add manure before they disc. You'll need to have an acceptable process to add extra nitrogen to the soil as the cover crop rots down. Something slow acting, such as blood and bone could be useful, although it can attract animals. Perhaps dried animal manure would be an alternative. Your biggest hassle would come if you have a perennial weed (like dandelions, dock, twitch grass, or whatever your local nightmare/s happen to be) growing in your cover crop. The darned things LOVE being disced. It spreads little bits of root everywhere - and, being weeds, they usually all grow. A cover crop can be highly useful in a poor soil - and to give protection if wind or heavy rain moves soil in your area. You might also want to consider growing a cleaning crop such as potatoes, or rows of peas that need regular weed control and/or hilling up. If you were to lay down a mulch between the rows, along the lines that lindac has suggested, then you could have 'the best of both worlds'. If you do decide on doing the cover crop - and leaving it over winter (a ryegrass, mustard, lupin, barley, clover, vetch crop would probably all be suitable) remember to leave enough time between the cutting back, digging in - and your planned planting date - for the material to rot down, or plant crops that will tolerate quantities of partially rotted material in the soil. Also think about any fertiliser/liming that needs to be done, too. Those additions need time to become effective in the soil for following crops - and some crops don't like them too fresh.

I'm new to this forum and am so glad that I ran into it - what fun and laughter just reading on 'Venting on squirrels', 'sudden demise of loved perennials due to voles', 'Why Blue' etc. etc, tee hee hee! This time I do need help and since this is a fairly recent vine forum thread, someone might come to my rescue. My Nikko Hydrangea - a gift on Mom's Day 1990 from my 3 kids, planted on the east side, close to our house for better protection, has lost the dappled shade that she depended on, when we had to take down a 25y/o problem Locust tree. Like a nut I enslaved myself covering Nikko, first with a bedsheet then (by end of May ... tired of baby sitting) I purchased a roll of plant shading fabric and long bamboo sticks and temporarity made her a tent, until I could figure out whether to move her to a shady place ... the thought of digging a 16y/o Nikko scares me! By the end of June the makeshift tent bugged me, so I got an arbor for her (just one of those Home Depot ones), not wide enough to prevent her pathetic afternoon collapses, we threw the shading fabric over the arbor ... again just for now. I thought of Clematis or Sweet Pea, since I have experience with them but perhaps with your suggestions and experiences with Silver Lace and Mandevilla or a Climbing Hydra (arbor is not too sturdy) ... will greatly appreciate your thoughts! Ditas Z5 Midwest.