And these are the changes we'd make -- rather light changes:

Garage entrance area:
- Steal 1-2’ from the garage (still leaving the garage at 23-24’ wide) to create a large shelf for storage of crafts, games, cleaning supplies, and more in the utility room.
- Add a large built-in desk (with shelves above). No one will sit at the desk often, but it’ll be used for charging laptops, the printer, office supplies, wrapping presents . . . even folding laundry.
- Move the washer/dryer to the end so the dryer can vent directly to the outside. We aren’t the type of people who care about a large laundry space.
- Add a door directly to the master closet.

Kitchen:
- Double the pantry and do away with the seat and closets. Include a small shelf where the seat is now ��" this would serve as a landing spot for groceries, a place for bread to rise, a place to set desert, etc. Incidentally, this whole thing is 8’ wide.
- Place a pocket door between the kitchen and pantry (to hide mess when we have visitors).
- Should the sink stay where it is? I’d rather have the sink on the peninsula, but I think the overall function of the kitchen is better with its current position.

Living room and secondary bedrooms:
- Change the back bedroom’s closet into a built-in for the living room TV. Add a new closet against the bedroom/bathroom shared wall, which also allows for a linen closet IN the bathroom.
- This bathroom seems small. Would you bump it out a bit to allow the sink to be a decent size?

Master bedroom closet and bath:
- Make the two closets into one single closet, which allows for the aforementioned entrance into the laundry room.
- Master bath is rearranged significantly to allow for an oversized shower.
- That’s a shelf between the toilet and shower, which could be used for extra toilet paper or magazines.
- This allowed for a second, small linen closet IN the bathroom, which isn’t absolutely necessary, but also doesn’t hurt.

i really like your plan and the changes
i have lived in smaller homes very comfortably with 2 children

my only problem is with the two guest bedrooms, they feel a bit tight i think this comes from visiting family members who also have very small bedrooms and i'm always feeling cross while there (it could be the amount of stuff my sil insists on putting in the room) our smallest bedroom is 11x14 with a queen sized bed and it feels pretty tight in there......
other than that i like it a lot..

It's a nice plan!

Not sure why the sink would work better on the peninsula? I like the L. But space looks tight around the sink; where is the dishwasher?

How would you arrange furniture in the LR?

Regarding the guest wing: what if you move the back bedroom out even with the master bedroom. This gives you room to move the bathroom fixtures around, maybe putting the tub on the opposite wall, which lets the toilet move down, making room for a bigger vanity. Although, that bedroom is now only 11x11. Full bed, not queen.

(Oh, and I widened the entry to the Master/rear entry, so you can see the artwork on the wall better :) and to make it easier to get around.)

Turn the stairs in an L and you gain a closet. Is it necessary to have the desk be 8'?

I like the idea of bumping the back guest bedroom so that it's even with the master. I like that it allows a little more breathing room in that tight bathroom . . . without doing a bathroom bump-out, which had been my previous thought.

Yes, that still leaves this bedroom at 11x11. Since I don't plan ANYTHING in that room except a bed and two nightstands, I think I'm fine with that size.

However, to be argumentative, that probably means changes to the roofline, which at this point is simple. I think the answer is to investigate which is most cost-effective: Bumping the bedroom back vs. a little shed bump-out on the side of the house.

Rather unimportant: This will be a tub-sized walk-in shower rather than a tub. We just replaced our hall bath with this type of shower, and my girls are LOVING it. I don't think guests are going to often want to soak in a tub -- and, if they do, they can use the hot tub outside.

The other, slightly larger bedroom, will be the grandchildren's room (at least I hope to have need of a grandchildren's room one day), and it will have a couple twin beds or bunks . . . and no door on the closet so it can hold toys on shelves and a few clothes up top.

Neither of these bedrooms, though, will be used for storage -- they are JUST for guests.

I would like the sink on the penninsula because I foresee that'll be the prime prep spot. I'm completely sold on an oversized high-function sink -- probably the Kohler Stages 45 -- and I like to face out towards the room while I prep. But I think the whole look of the kitchen will suffer if I place the sink on the penninsula.

Where IS the dishwasher? The plan doesn't indicate, but if the sink stays in its current position (which is likely), I think it'd go between the sink and the refrigerator. If it goes to the "inside" of the U, it'll block cabinets when it's open. I'd be happy with a dishwasher in that spot. I measured it out, and I can have the large 45" sink AND the dishwasher in that spot.

Overall I think an L+ island is the most functional /most bang for the buck kitchen layout . . . yet I really have a thing for U-shaped kitchens, and my favorite kitchen I've ever had (in a college rental house -- isn't that a bit sad?) was a U. This is a bit of a hybrid of those two layouts.

How to arrange a living room . . . I think that's what I have the most trouble imagining in a plan. I think I'd place the sofa parallel to the fireplace, maybe a loveseat with its back to the foyer, and then a single chair on the side near the back doors. Open to thoughts.

I don't think I'm very good at living rooms, but this one is EXACTLY the same size /layout as my current living room /dining room. . . except that my fireplace is on the side instead of the end, and this one has much nicer windows . . . and my kitchen is on beyond the dining room.

I'll have to draw the stairs differently and see how an L stair works in this space: I can't imagine that in my head -- but another closet sounds pretty good, and since the stairs don't really "show", their shape is pretty much irrelevant.

No, it isn't necessary that the desk be 8'. When I moved things around in the utility room, that's about what I figured the desk COULD be. Actually, now that I look at it again, I think it crowds the laundry/closet door a bit. I do want it to be a LARGE desk since I think it'll get a decent amount of use for a number of things.

Thanks for the advice. Please keep it coming.

This post was edited by MrsPete on Thu, Feb 5, 15 at 18:01

Overall, a wonderful house plan! I put my sink on my peninsula because I have a good window view right across from the dining nook (and can, when I have guests, keep conversation going). Your window is at least another room away, so I would suggest keeping it where you currently have it.

Re small guest bath -- if you plan to have frequent extended stay visitors, or if you plan to have it as an alternative age-in-place bath, you might want it larger. Otherwise it can work. I do like bpathome's adaptation a lot.

Make sure you math is accessible for a wheelchair. Cheaper to do it now.
Also no steps into the garage.
How about French doors in the foyer for the bedroom?
Nice home.
Jo

I think it'd be so nice to sit at the peninsula with your coffee in the morning, but not with a sink. You need room for the crossword!

I think what's making the kitchen tight is the refrigerator in the corner. Can it go in the pantry, but facing the kitchen? That lets the counter run to the wall, and when you open the fridge it's right next to the counter. You lose pantry space, but gain kitchen upper cabinets. That blue square is the dishwasher, plenty of room now above it and beside it for putting away tableware.

In the master, will you put the bed under the window, so no one has to walk all the way around the bed? (I love my bed under the window)

One thing that I find a negative about many of these square plans is that the living area ends up buried in the middle of the house

Overall, it's nice, but I'm not in love with it. I agree with palimpsest in that the living room is going to be dark. Also, the foyer looks a bit tight.

I do like the changes you've made though, and I really like bpathome's idea of refrigerator placement.

Yes, I see the point about the windows being some distance away. Mainly, though, I like doing my cooking prep facing the room. I can talk to people or watch TV. I think I'll end up leaving the sink where it is, and the penninsula will be available for prep too -- just not with the big, functional sink.

I don't know that long-term guests are a reality for us, but I do want a comfortable-sized bath.

I just lost my grandmother, who was almost 100 years old, so I'm very much in touch with what works for elderly people -- and I'm comforable with this layout in those terms.

Yes, the plan shows a couple of steps at the garage, but we'll talk to the builder about that.

Sorry, bpathhome, we're not on the same wave length today! I don't drink coffee, nor do I like crosswords! Not that your point isn't still valid.

No, I'm happy with the amount of cabinetry, and I wouldn't want tog ive up any pantry space. At not quite 5' tall, I don't value upper cabinets greatly!

I was imagining the master bed under the window, but I won't say I"m married to the idea. I was also considering the idea of adding a slider in the bedroom (for more immediate access to the pool /hot tub), but it would have to be so close to the head of the bed -- I'm iffy on that.

Yes, I can see the criticism about the living area being "buried", but with the back windows and sliding door, I think I'm okay with the amount of light that this room will have.

Why not put a prep sink in your peninsula? You can prep your food and dishes will be behind you.

I hadn't considered the possibility of a prep sink in a kitchen this size, especially since I am planning on a LARGE sink.

Overall I'm not a fan of prep sinks . . . but I'll do some cabinet math and consider this possibility.

And I just came up with a previously-unmentioned concern: Where are my towels going to hang? (I thought of this while I was in the shower.) I can see one towel hanging on a hook on the end of the short bookcase that forms a part of the division between the shower and the toilet area. But one towel isn't enough.

Just throwing this out there, but my 5' cook of a mother (now she's 4'10") designed her kitchen with 34 1/2" counters, and the upper cabinets are lower accordingly. (My similar-height DMIL had standard counters, but lowered the cupboards.) At 5'4", I find it comfortable height to work at, though washing too many dishes by hand can get to me. With the prospect of replacing their dishwasher (a scary one, at that, given how it was installed, below floor level) I learned about ADA-compliant dishwashers which are designed to go under various heights (wish Mom had found one 47 years ago). And of course, dishwasher drawers. Think about it :)

For your bath towels, what is the wall between shower and tub? Is it glass? Can you put a towel bar on it?

There's a lot to like about this plan...the one floor, the split plan, the exterior looks very welcoming.

But there are a few things I'd think about. Mainly about being infirmed and wending my way to the bathroom or the kitchen. Unless the hallways are wide enough, it will be difficult to get in and out with a wheel chair. Having just survived a month of no weight bearing on my broken ankle, it's still very fresh for me.

Also, I was in a house that had a large, tall great room with the kitchen off to one side in a lower-ceilinged area by itself. Even though it was a good size (this house was a huge mc mansion) it felt very small and dark, like an arm pit that was looking out over the great open space. It wasn't pleasant. It was due to a lack of integration between the spaces and the ceiling heights. You want to be really careful about that.

Skylights in the screen room would give you more light in the living room.
Bay windows would make the BRs seem bigger.

i also liked bpath's idea for the bedrooms a lot

my 45 in kohler apron sink is in the penisula, which is extra wide and open to the gr and i really like it for the same reason's you mentioned however, putting a prep sink in my island would be one of the very few changes i would make in my home the apron sink feels pretty large for lots of little kitchen functions but i would not trade it for anything
my gr is surrounded on two sides by a 12ft deep screened porch we have 4 24 in by 6 ft windows and 3 glass doors and 2 transom windows over the doors, it is very bright in the gr and we rarely turn on any sort of lighting during the day the room and the porches face south with one door facing west we were pleasantly surprised at how bright the house is

Yeah, I used to be 5', but now I'm more like 4' 11 1/2". I was surprised when the nurse told me this during a physical -- I actually asked her to measure me again. At 48 I thought I was too young to have begun losing height!

I had thought of shorter cabinets, but it's not something I've investigated yet.

I certainly don't want an armpit kitchen, but today I saw something VERY like this on an HGTV show, and I noted what "made it work". It had a beam at the place where the ceilings met, and it was done in light colors. I'm going to see if I can look it up online.

I am considering the possibility of going with a Kohler Stage 33 as a prep sink on the penninsula . . . and a plain, large Kohler sink under the window (with dishwasher adjacent). Good idea or bad idea?

The screen porch has four skylights. I'm feeling okay about the quantity of light in the whole place.

Bathroom tiles: I'm playing with a different layout for the bathroom -- and I'm not forgetting towels in this one.

How important is symmetry to you? The great room has a cathedral ceiling and the fireplace is centered under the center of the ceiling. What length couch will you be using? If you center your couch on the fireplace, will you still have enough room for a loveseat with its back to the foyer? If you plan on having stools/chairs at the peninsula, you need to figure them in when you consider the walkway from the garage to the bedrooms. I'd layout the furniture in the room and see if you think it will work. Now if you are not planning on having the cathedral ceiling, then I would consider centering the fireplace on the wall rather than in room.

I want the cathedral ceiling in the great room /dining room, but I plan to lose it in the bedroom (for cost issues as well as the fact I fear it won't have a cozy feel).

I hadn't plugged in the word "symmetry" to my questions . . . but since the great room /dining room is the same size as my current house (except my fireplace is on the side instead of on the end) . . . and I actually scooted my furniture around yesterday to see if I'd like the size /look of it going the other direction. It DOES mean that the sofa will be "off center", but I was fine with it.

Stools at the peninsula is a bit of a question. I don't really want them, but my husband does. In our current house, we have two stools at the penninsula, and no one EVER sits at them. Regardless, he has made so few requests for the house . . . I feel like I have to say yes to them!

Back to the subject: The house plan seems to show a standard 24" cabinet with just a bit of curve added -- I agree that's not enough. I want to make this deeper, the space cutting into the kitchen, not the walkway.

I am pretty adamant about wanting a small kitchen in this house, so I don't see this as a sacrafice. If we go 36" wide with the penninsula, the middle of the kitchen will be 6' wide. Recently I stood in a friend's U-shaped 6' kitchen and asked myself, "Would this be big enough?" and I decided that -- in conjuction with a good pantry -- it would. I currently have a large-but-inefficient kitchen, and I hate it.

I appreciate the thoughts -- keep 'em coming, please.

This post was edited by MrsPete on Sat, Feb 7, 15 at 20:58

i like your prep sink idea
i also liked bpathome's refrigerator placement idea
i'd plan that pantry and the kitchen cabinets to be just what i wanted and i'd go with it.....

Hi Mrs. Pete-I think you will be more than happy with that wall removed in your master closet. One of the side bene's of my closet that sort of seemed like a waste of floor space in the center of it is that we use it for dressing and I really like it. I don't feel like it's cramped and since we use it for that it's not really wasted. We never ever dress in the bedroom or the bathroom. I also stretch in the closet from time to time after running before hitting the shower and it's perfect for that too. I also *love* that I can get to the master through our laundry/bath as well. It was a good call for sure. I actually rarely go through our bedroom to the bathroom except when going to bed. 99% of the time I am in the laundry room or bathroom/closet so I head that way first.

I like your pantry as well.

I'd want a window in the hall bath. We don't have one in ours and I do regret it. A smaller window even really sheds a lot of light and opens up the bathroom space as well as the hallway beyond - whether you have people using it regularly or not. Just my 2 cents.

I see you are back to a ranch plan. :) Now that we are on the other side of building a 1 1/2 I think the difference for us mainly would be if we'd have done a ranch with daylight and bedrooms in the basement there would still be privacy and separation but the whole house would be finished. As is we have the privacy/separation with the upper floor but the basement is unfinished (and we are pretty much tired of spending money, lol). So in the end it is definitely more room but also more costly. Could have went either way and with it all said and done I think we would have been just as happy with a ranch as well.

I enjoy watching your plans evolve. :)

Yes, I like this bedroom /bathroom /closet layout -- it seems very convenient. Not only because it's open to the laundry room, but because it allows for that little hallway off the bedroom to keep light /sound somewhat separated from the bedroom. I'm thinking that the hall linen closet could be more like a dressing cabinet . . . a built-in cabinet with space underneath for a laundry basket, and shelves up top for jewelry, a mirror, and photos. I'm thinking that the little hallway would be great.

Yeah, I assumed that the hall bath would have a window added. I never said it though.

Yes, we HAVE been through a number of iterations -- you say you've enjoyed watching, but sometimes I feel a bit like I'm comic relief. I started with the idea that I wanted a 1.5 story /Cape Cod /Southern house . . . and then my husband convinced me that a ranch is more practical for our retirement years . . . then I pushed back and returned to my original idea . . . and he's pushing again. i know that his desire for a ranch is more practical than a 1.5 story house, and I should give in on this one.

As for the house being FINISHED, this is one of my requirements. NON-NEGOTIABLE. I have put up with wait-for-this and we'll-do-that-next-year for too long. Whatever we plan, we are going to FINISH NOW -- non-negotiable. Didn't I already say that? Well, I meant it. Since we are planning a house well beneath our budget, this is possible. Except for one thing: We're planning to build a bonus room, but it will JUST be storage. If we later need another room, we're halfway there.

And a new thought concerning the kitchen and dining room:

I'm wondering about switching the kitchen and dining room. The two spaces are actually pretty close in size, but IF we flip them, we could have nice large windows in the front of the house . . . in both the front bedroom AND the dining room (these need to match). IF we do this, we'd move the pantry door so it would face the kitchen. This would remove the problem of where to place the sink, and it would set the dining area over in a private alcove. We could also open the dining room up to the foyer, which would enlarge that small space visually.

On the other hand, I really do like a U-shaped kitchen, and I like the current walk-through pantry tremendously. I do not love the dining room in its current spot, but it is plenty big and functional. And keeping it "as is" would be cheaper because it's already on the plans.

So glad you can still post, Mrs. Pete. And I'm glad to see you have a staircase to decorate at Christmas. ;-)

With the 1.5 story there you face less expenses for the construction of the foundation and roof and a more efficient, boxier, building than with a ranch. This frees up money to use for the features that you want.

In terms of aging in place, simply make your staircase wider and this gives you future room to install one of those chair escalators.

MrsPete-comic relief? No. Smart to do your due diligence now vs. after it's too late! I don't want to derail your ranch thread but I thought I'd share the couple of things I don't like about the 1.5 that may affect how you lay yours out should you go that way.

Oh p.s. I was really like your kitchen in the front. Ours is laid out how you are proposing and I really don't care so much for the kitchen being so front and center. I am good with the dining room that way but I like the kitchen tucked in a little bit for at least a semblance of it's own space. I prefer the adjacent layout vs. all together in a straight line with the family room layout. Could you not have a nice 6' window in both the kitchen and the bedroom there? I think that would be fine and I'd love to have that nice large window in the kitchen letting all that light in! Plus with a gathering you could make your dining room extend into the living room if need be in it's current spot. May be more difficult if you move it. But I am biased so....take it as it is.

Stairwell-ours is a U shaped stair going up and down since we have a basement and a full wall there it does make the foyer dark. The windows from the stairwell light the stairs great but because it's solid wall by the foyer it gets little to no light and it's dark there. If I could do it over I'd put a transom over the front door to add light or move the stairwell so those front windows shown into the main room/foyer area. Also the stairs - I can hear noise from upstairs more than I thought I would? It's not a large space but I think if we had the stairs turned and enter from the back entry/kitchen it would keep the living room more quiet. I have no proof of that though. ;)

I already discussed the 'would have had a finished basement already' downer. Stick to it - I hear you loud and clear - it will be finished! Yay! I was spoiled in our last house with our finally finished basement that included a work out room. It's back to cement slab for now (I know poor me).

I guess those are my basic hmmmmmmm thoughts about the 1.5 but those could easily be designed away.

What direction is your house facing again? I can't remember now.

edit for spelling errors. oh my.

Oh, Autumn, you're sweet, but you just think that because you and I share many opinions! I know my strengths and weaknesses: I'm strong on spacial reasoning, but I totally stink with color choices. And while I'm highly rational, I change my mind too much.

I DO also like the idea that the kitchen-to-the-front in this layout sort of "tucks away" the kitchen in to a bit of a hidey-hole, while also keeping it open to the main living area. The windows were what made me think about the switch: If I had a dining room table in that front spot, I could have tall, lovely 72" windows (like I had in a previous house and LOVED), whereas if it remains the kitchen, the windows cannot go to the floor.

Yes, the ability to extend the dining room table IS one of the things I like about this plan -- and you're right to point out that if I switch the two rooms, that benefit disappears. I like the idea of having a modest table for most of the time (when it's just the two of us), but being able to extend it for gatherings.

Oh, and the directional question. We have a couple possibilities for location. The most likey possibilty is an east-facing spot, which means we'd have the morning sun in the kitchen and the western sun keeping the pool warm in the back.

If we go with a different spot on our land, we'd have a north-facing house with southern exposure to the back.

Well I like that my opinions are in good company. Hahaha!

Hmm, I can see your point on tall windows. They are nice too. Perfect wording - the kitchen in a bit of a hidey-hole. It's not really blocked by walls but yet it's not out front and center here I am look at MEEEEE.

It's so hard to try to get everything just so. Let's see, I stink with color and hired someone to help, change my mind a lot and can't see in 3D so I was a hot mess much of our build. ;P

This plan has the covered porch in the front - I was wondering if you were west facing and that porch would be fantastic for that. I can see why you'd not want to take cover by the pool though so that orientation with West at the rear sounds perfect really.

Yes, we're on the same page with the kitchen: Accessible to the rest of the house, someone in the kitchen can be part of the action . . . yet if you have a mess in there, turning off the lights would sort of make it "disappear".

I'd like to hear about your experience hiring someone to help with color -- I can totally "see" in 3D and manage spacial arrangements, but color is not my thing. How did you find a person? If you don't mind, how expensive was it? Did the color person give you advice or actually help you purchase things? The whole concept is new to me, but I know it'd be a wise move for me.

Hi Mrspete-sure I'll share. Keep in mind I am in the midwest in a smallllll town so I think I got a steal of a deal. I found someone through word of mouth that actually works for a builder as their on staff design person but she also has a side business. It was $50 an hour and more than well spent for my challenged self. Even DH was very satisfied that we went that route and he appreciated her opinion. After a while it was hey why don't you ask her what she thinks.

She helped with the shingles and siding - we chose the siding but wanted confirmation on the shingles and I am glad we asked. We had it narrowed to 2 and then chose and after meeting with her we switched to the other and phew, disaster averted. She can 'see things' that I just don't see until she points them out and even then sometimes I still can't see it (undertones sometimes are tough for me). She also helped choose and coordinate our wood and tile flooring with our cabinets, counters and then paint. The only paint color I chose in our house was the master bedroom, that's it. She helped with the rest.

After it was finished I had her come back and she actually helped with rugs and a few things for the walls. She met with both dh and I so out of our discussions she could get a
feel for what kind of style we were looking for - what we liked and what
we did not AND what our budget was and she stayed where we needed her to as far as item cost. I had just started working full time and that really rocked my world so I had no time to shop and honestly I didn't know where to start - art or rugs or window panels. I go into a store and just see stuff, stuff everywhere. It's way to
overwhelming for me to narrow down to that one picture or lamp in a sea
of items, especially when I was looking for several different textiles
for multiple rooms! Ugh! I also am plain and simple just not a shopper on all fronts unless you count groceries and amazon.com. :)

My head was spinning.......so she shopped once with me and then she shopped for me on her own and brought stuff for us to check out in place. She brought back whatever didn't work in the space. HUGE help. I'd do that again in a heartbeat. She was very flexible and did as much or as little as we needed. She'd even hang stuff if you wanted.

For me it was a great experience and she may be back when we get around to finishing our basement or decorating our bedroom.

I'd be quite satisfied if I could have a similar experience with a color expert, and the price you reference is lower than I expected.