This computer which supposedly had "no hard drive" concerns me. Was this in-store or mail order? Did you buy something that was in a new-sealed up-undamaged box? Or did you buy a floor model...that is, one that was unpackaged and on the shelf? If the former, I wouldn't believe that it had no hard drive unless the tech opened up the machine and pointed out the empty space where the drive was supposed to be. Did that happen? Or could it be that you said "no hard drive" when you really meant the hard drive had failed? I only ask because if what you said is true exactly as stated, then Dell's quality control really failed this time. On the other hand, if this was a floor model anything could have happened and I wouldn't necessarily hold it against Dell.

I've had a computer since 1993 and have probably read tens of thousands of posts regarding computer troubles and nowhere have I ever read anything that made reference to the computer's "immune system". If I ever used that term with my IT department I would be ridiculed and laughed right out of the room and rightfully so. You aren't doing yourself any favors...if you're unsure of the correct terminology, you're better off to not go there at all.

I hope the new Dell works out for you but quite frankly...if I thought it was practical to do so I'd recommend you skip it entirely and get a Mac now. I think you'd be much better off.

azinoh: I think the immune remark was a joke and you missed it. And sure, the drive was probably broken, but that part of the post was really about how nice COSTCO was. The real question was about Office. I don't know, but if Office is an issue, wouldn't it still be similar with a Mac?

FWIW, I got an HP from COSTCO last year with Office and had no problems that I remember. I can't say that I am really happy with these newer versions, but I attribute my issues with the fact that I am old and these versions have to deal with an expanded set of options and external programs that I am not familiar with. I assume that I will just have to put up with them.

That's kind of a weird tale of experiences there.

Microsoft announced yesterday that Windows10 will be a free upgrade for users of Win7 & Win8, so that (hopefully) solves one problem.

For Office, you might want to try the Libre Office suite (link below) since it's free. There's no downside in trying - you can have both suites on board if you like.

It's about the same as MS Office, especially for the basic stuff you would do - could probably hardly tell the difference.
For easy compatibility, just change the save setting to .doc, etc.

Or, buy a slightly older version of MS Office which should work fine and be inexpensive as well. Just check for compatibility with the OS you're going to be working on.

Often there's is no great need to have the latest version, except for document standards compatibility, and compatibility with the latest OSs - and you do need to be careful with that.

Here is a link that might be useful: Libre Office

My immune system was a joke referring to them number of viruses Corinne and I have been through.

Chas is right on all counts. I do appreciate his help. Costco Was quick and good and not to blame. They sent me a new one that I haven't opened. I wonder if they talk to their vendors and does Dell care either. It is sick that we need computers but BB has a horrible reputation and computers are not inspected and the software is buggy. I know there are folks who will say they have not had
problems. But reviews tell me most folks are not computer experts.

Sorry, people. I am looking at the whole picture today and it seems very gloomy. Just throwing money away after saving it. I will look at Libre. I need Outlook too.
This is not just my problem it is everyone's. One is lucky if they get a computer that works.

Oh, I bought this online from Costco. My tech help came from Costco Concierge.

Back in the day when memory and hard drives were measured in megabytes I did some computer repair work. The customer called Dell (or whomever) for tech support and if a part is needed it was sent overnight and installed the next business day.

If you do go with a Mac (and I love Macs) and happen to have an Apple store nearby you have the options of purchasing, for about $100, a year's worth of in-store training. Basically you can go once a week and get a hour's worth of help with whatever problem you're having or learning how to do something. It's great way to get help at a very reasonable price and the folks at Apple just love helping people.

Unless you need compatibility with other Office users, Open Office or Libre will suffice for the needs of the vast majority of people. Open Office is available for Mac and I believe Libre is as well. I've used Microsoft Office 2013 and don't see much of a difference between it and previous version other than the layout of the screen.

Unless I'm mistaken Best Buy sells the same computers with the same operating system as everyone else. If you're having ongoing problems with viruses I might suggest that the problem user error. I've been "online" since before most people even understood what the word meant and I've had one virus in the last 10-15 years. Any number of friends, relatives, etc. have use the same computers, same operating systems and have had significantly more infections. Maybe I've just been lucky...

Mike, user error is always a possibility. The old computer died because it is suspected that I had a refurbished hard drive in it. I work with Landzdown when needed. I can't say I had viruses all the time at all. I did the maintenance on it and had security a little over medium. It lasted 4 1/2 years much longer then the reviews said it would. My last one got a real hard workout because I was working on a Masters and working really hard. It lasted 13 years but it was built for me by a friend. So computers can last.
Best Buy first sold me a computer that was corrupt and a geek squad employee confronted the manager and said he saw it put together. That is when they gave me the same model computer that was in the back room, From the logs and the way it was working toward the end this was a possible reason meaning it was a refurbished computer. It's not that Best Buy gets the same computers as everyone else it's the store's code of ethics. Also one of the members of the geeks squad on site had 2 computer online courses and that was it. I'll take my share of blame but Best Buy is not an honest store. Yet it makes money. The bad reviews are through the roof. I started using computers when we had to write code and there were not a lot of problems with them and Chas was right about the reasons. I also cannot articulate very well what the problems are.i take a beating because of that. One has to be patient with me but I would like to think I am cautious.I would hope that I'm not so bad that I am told that I can no longer use computers and have no court of appeals to try and get my privileges back. Also, what the hen with quality control from Dell and Smart products from Microsoft. The world of snarkiness in computerland is comparable to the criminal oversite of the FDA. Thanks for listening.

For what it's worth, I have a refurbished Dell Dimension that is 12 years old. I ordered it from Dell that way for $250.It's slow (compared to Windows 7 and 8) and has XP so it's not in use right now, but it's still running.

There is nothing wrong with refurbished as long as you get the 'new' warranty.

I agree, you shouldn't be sold a new computer and receive a refurbished, I just wanted to make a point that refurbished doesn't equate to defective.

The problem is, there is a lot of latitude with "refurbished" - it all depends on the procedures and quality control at the refurbishing end.

Apple's "refurbish" is rather famous - I read an article describing how they replace many more parts than usual and have very high q.c. standards.

Myself, I bought a refurb Canon DSLR once from Canon for ~1/3 off - that was spotless and like new. (they have a page on their site for this if anyone's interested.)

On the other hand, for example, I researched Lenovo's refurbs once and many people complained about the poor quality of what they received. (That's anecdotal though - I don't have any experience myself)

If you do a little research ahead of time you can get an idea of others experiences, what to expect, and what risk you might be taking.

But anyone buying what they think is new should never receive refurb w/o a substantial discount and prior knowledge.

However, Microsoft office 2013 has horrible reviews hundreds) everywhere and Microsoft 365 is impractical and you $20 after the $69 initial price. Never thought of the monopoly MS has...and the message is take it or do with out.

Or install Linux :)

Does that mean that Office 365 is $69 with a $20 per year subscription fee, Ellie?

I found Office 2010 for Sale for only $155, that is far less expensive than my old 2002 version was.

>> "Or install Linux :) "

Linux is always worth a look, but last i checked it's an OS, not an Office suite.

Anyway, LibreOffice cuts into the monopoly problem fairly well, and cross platform.

Pkponder where did you find 2010? I have a new Dell computer with 8.1 and feel like I am on a kids page - just thoroughly disgusted. I have not chosen a Microsoft software.

So far I have done nothing but read and look ar youTube videos on the subject.

If I want the classic Shell can I put that on before I pick out the Microsoft software?
kbarb, you come up with good ideas that seem stronger than the usual PC set up but I'm not able to do that myself.

I just 'Googled' it Ellie

Best Buy is selling the DVD version for $155.
Download versions are available through lots of sites, but I always preferred having the disks.

What version do you already have licensing for? You may be able to order a replacement disk from MS for even less.

Here is a link that might be useful: Best Buy

Thanks so much pkponder. You are wonderful to do a search for me. I'll look at it.

I have not bought software. I trashed my old computer.
I have only 8.1 on and am stuck. A neighbor thought she knew how to help but found things have changed since she started using Mac 10 years ago. She's very physically ill. So, I am reading and YouTubing. Never had to install this much software and deal with Comcast about Outlook and mail settings. Let's see. It would be great to install. This is certainly the wrong time for me to buy a computer with the new operating system and upgrade software.
Thanks again. I wonder if I would still have to download Classic Shell.

I just looked for Microsoft 2010 Office with Outlook at BB and they sell individual software and teaching tools now. I think that is because the new PCs come with operating system 8.1. PC sales are down I read. I looked at other places as well that say they have it but are not reputable according to the reviews and I can't get it at the Microsoft site of course so it appears that I'm going to have to download the 2013 and go into the sanitarium soon after that.

You're probably going to have a difficult time finding a legitimate retailer who offers anything other than the current version of Microsoft Office.

If you want something that "looks" like the previous versions of Microsoft Office use OpenOffice or Libre Office.

kbarb -> "Microsoft announced yesterday that Windows10 will be a free upgrade for users of Win7 & Win8, so that (hopefully) solves one problem."

Link to this information, please/thanks. I'm not finding it at the Windows web site.

Never mind, I found it:

Great news! We will offer a free upgrade to Windows 10 for qualified new or existing Windows 7, Windows 8.1 and Windows Phone 8.1 devices that upgrade in the first year!* And even better: once a qualified Windows device is upgraded to Windows 10, we will continue to keep it up to date for the supported lifetime of the device, keeping it more secure, and introducing new features and functionality over time ��" for no additional charge. We will send you more information about Windows 10 and the upgrade offer in the coming months.

"However, Microsoft office 2013 has horrible reviews hundreds) everywhere"

Everything has bad reviews. I used Word 2003 for a dozen years before switching to 2013. I really only use the other Office applications sporadically so this isn't about them. At first I hated it but apparently it was simply because I like what I'm used to and 2013 had more than casual changes. However, it works better now that I figured out the only slightly different tricks. It's more customizable, which for me means less clutter, and I never get corruption. Take this with a grain of salt as I still miss WordPerfect.

"it is suspected that I had a refurbished hard drive in it"

No such thing (I think). "Used" may be accurate, but hard drives are throwaways and I don't know of anyone rebuilding one. Maybe they meant erased or formatted?

Maybe the hard drive was not connected to its cables.

Another possibility: the spare jumper on the hard drive was on the "slave" position, If the hard drive was set by jumper to be the slave drive, it will not boot up. Booting is done only from the master drive.

Anything is possible at BB. The first one I took back had a corrupt hard drive the second developed so many problems that a very qualified award winning certified Microsoft volunteer who has followed that old computer suspects this is what happened.
As for the new one I had to replace. Costco concierge service did diagnostics on the phone with me and came to the conclusion that it needed to be returned because the operating system was not responding at all and perhaps the hard drive wasn't installed. It was plugged in and had a friend go through all of the plugs as was asked of us by the service. I took out all of the sockets in my place and had them replaced to meet the country wide code and also bought new surge protectors for my computer. I also have not put in any Microsoft software. The more I read the more I am not qualified to put it in and take care of the problems that most likely will ensue. I called a Microsoft store. There is a central phone bank in Texas that answers for all the calls that come in to the stores around the country. They could not get the store near me to answer the phone and suspected they were all busy. They tried three times as I stayed on the phone. I am not allowed to have the direct number to the store. There are many menus and the idea is you can help yourself by listening to these menus. I want to know if I can bring my PC and buy some software and have them install it.. This can all cost about the same price as my computer. I would like to talk with Bill Gates. The stores have also got bad reviews around the country. There are some excellent ones too but din't reign.
I appreciate the idea of not wanting to go through a learning curve for both an operating system that people complained about so vehemently that they made one revision that will help me but then you have software that is either a rental package or a package deal that has difficulty with Outlook That's okay if I have step-by-step instructions or near an IT person which I always had at work.
If Bill Gates is reading this please leave a message.