Anyone think crazy? The slow smaller oaks grows: Q. Douglasii, Q. Laceyi. These should be able to stay small, away, and or under. Fast: Q. Phellos, Q. Nuttallii trim them up high and tall to let some sun in and under.

Yes I think crazy quite a lot actually! I don't think you meant to word it that way but anyhow.... I have quite a few Nuttall's oaks but they are not anywhere near maturity. I would guess an eventual spread of 60-80 ft wide and 80-100 ft tall in maturity as a guess for Nuttall's oak. I can't help but THINK Nuttall's oak isn't drought tolerant enough for the west, but, I've never been further west than Michigan. I guess if your state is saying those are good trees, I would go by them, not me. Poaky1

LoL, yes I have come to realize I have went way over board with oaks. I removed the Northern Red Oak and the Quercus Nuttallii Oak. I'm keeping the Quercus Laceyi, Quercus Phellos, Quercus Douglasii and the Regal Prince Oak where they are located in the drawn plans. I plan on getting either small or columnar trees for where the Northern Red Oak and the Quercus Nuttallii Oaks were. Oh, non oaks. Any ideas, let me know?

In my yard I can never have too many oaks! Plant what YOU want of course. I don't know what is best for your yard. Someone here in your climate can help, my offering of Quercus Fusiformis is as good as you'll get from me LOL. I also know Q. Agrifolia is a western evergreen oak, but AGAIN another oak, and one that gets huge, so I am no help to you really, I can tell you what likes more water but not much help with SMALL trees for drought, sun etc. Sorry bout that. Poaky1

Thanks Poaky1, and all.
I desided to move my Regal Prince Oak to this location, instead of it being on my back corner mound. Should do better there as far as room goes compared to where i had the Northern Red Oak.

I am now starting to wonder and second guess myself if I should have even planted the willow oak at all. These get massive! But then again, what oak doesn't. I mean really. In looking at the branch structure of the willow oak tree, they don't seem to get as large and heavy compared to others. They stretch out far, but don't get as thick and heavy.

Thanks all

All I can say at this point is, big trees are good. How it ever came to this, with people afraid to use large-growing species, meanwhile cluttering up the landscape with head-height little ornamental bits. Start with the largest elements first, then move downwards (in terms of eventual plant size), the big guys being the "skeletons" of your yard.

I shudder to think what our towns and cities would have looked like if today's fear of large-growing plants had been in effect a hundred years ago. Pretty hot, sunny place, I reckon.

+oM

The Willow oak will need watered in a drought, unless there are some that are used to less water. I don't want to say anything negative about your selection, but, they are not known for drought resistance out west. If you like them and want to give them a try, with the knowledge that they may need some help in dry (prolonged) situations, I say "go for it", again I have Live oaks I'm trying to grow, where they usually don't make it, because of cold and with the Quercus Fusiformis, too much moisture, POSSIBLY. I will offer again, Dmacsimus, I have a bunch of Live oak Quercus Fusiformis acorns, they will be free, of course. Those I have left will be randomly sown around my area, in Pa. I will be posting on here, that I have them, also. Once they are gone, they are gone. I will save a few for a short while. Poaky1

Poaky1 and others,
I appreciate the information that is shared here and your offer Poaky1. I believe I am definitely trying to over do it with oaks in my back yard. I'm thinking of replacing the Willow Oak with a hybrid that grows a tad bit more narrower and smaller but do not know if it would be okay in zone 9? It is the Quercus Urban Pinnacle oak tree. I'm thinking of potting the Quercus Urban Pinnacle, and letting the Willow Oak grow through a few seasons just to see if it would reveal what characteristics it might have. I've been reading so much lately about its growth rate, I'm having nightmares of waking up to Jack's Giant Bean Stalk !!!! If in 25 years this will be a 80x60, I'm thinking while I have the chance, pot it and plant the Quercus Urban Pinnacle oak trees which has far less of a mature max size specs...... but then I read some and they say the Willow Oak will get 55-65X35-45!! What gives?????? Is the Quercus Urban Pinnacle oak tree good for zone 9 ? How fast does the Willow grow?

Poaky1 and others,
I appreciate the information that is shared here and your offer Poaky1. I believe I am definitely trying to over do it with oaks in my back yard. I'm thinking of replacing the Willow Oak with a hybrid that grows a tad bit more narrower and smaller but do not know if it would be okay in zone 9? It is the Quercus Urban Pinnacle oak tree. I'm thinking of potting the Quercus Urban Pinnacle, and letting the Willow Oak grow through a few seasons just to see if it would reveal what characteristics it might have. I've been reading so much lately about its growth rate, I'm having nightmares of waking up to Jack's Giant Bean Stalk !!!! If in 25 years this will be a 80x60, I'm thinking while I have the chance, pot it and plant the Quercus Urban Pinnacle oak trees which has far less of a mature max size specs...... but then I read some and they say the Willow Oak will get 55-65X35-45!! What gives?????? Is the Quercus Urban Pinnacle oak tree good for zone 9 ? How fast does the Willow grow?

Unlike shrubs, trees are accent points in the landscape - what produces a clutter is too many trees too close together - unless these are all the same kind, in which case you then have a grove. It is true that the best effect from shrubs is gotten from planting most of them in a given area in groups of few to several of each kind, rather than one of each. But where trees are being planted as an assortment (in an area that is not many acres) rather than a backdrop or walk-through grove you want to use one of each kind - well spaced out - because, again these read as accent points in the scene, like flag poles and tall buildings, that are too dominant to closely grouped without an oppressive effect being produced. Closely planted trees also have physical effects on a setting, including dense shade, concentrated litter and dense root zones.

I think you made a wise move by replacing the tree you had in that spot in your first post. With the spread and height the the tree you finally put in the spot, will slowly fill the area but not interfere with the houses.

You can now add interest to the area with shrubs and bushes that add a lot of color to that area that would not be a size problem.

We recently planted dwarf Nandena by our patio, for the winter bright red winter leaves. We already have azaleas, near the patio on the one side and will add more around it.

We have a Flowering Cherry "orchard" (3 new trees) starting about 30 feet from it for the spring color.

I would like to add some good smelling bush also but have not decide what.

If it were another type of tree it might be okay, but oak trees can spread out very wide with low hanging limbs as they mature. While still young they can be pruned to grow narrower, but pruning large branches may also leave oaks susceptible to disease.

I have difficulty with this too. What may be a perfect fit in 5 years could become very problematic in 20 years. Trees grow bigger over time.

Thanks fot the further info. I am looking for a partly shady back yard, lets walk around the yard honey and look up at all the birds and stuff in the trees kinda yard. A Well groomed forrest kinda look. I'm going to be keeping a close check on prunning all the trees as they grow, to attempt and have the selected trees to have somewhat of open crowns, or atleast high crowns, and thinned out somewhat. Keeping in mind open port holes for bugs and diseases due to over trimming.

I have chosen to remove the Willow Oak tree, for it in time, it will just get to wide. It was only in the ground for about 4 months. I have a friend that is going to plant it in his yard which has the room for that tree when its mature. Yes! I get to see it grow still!!!! In replacing it, I'd rather go for a more vertical, slender of an oak there to help give room for the surrounding oaks for their ability to grow larger in the future. My local tree guy has the Quercus Urban Pinnacle oak tree in a 15gal. Specs are around 55x25. I'm going to put it where the Willow Oak was. See pic for further info.

Isn't playing in the dirt in the yard so much fun!

You do not have acres, for what you want you need to be choosing small-growing kinds of trees.

bboy, others,
In my selections of oaks, other trees, and placements, with careful prunning, I'm thinking it's all do-able. Atleast for 20 years plus. With the sizes of chosen oaks: Regal Prince and Urban Pinnacle, they will grow tall and verticle. The others: Quercus Douglasii, very slow and normally grows avg 30x20 in 20 years when all things for it are good. The Quercus Laceyi should be about 30x25 in 20 years. These are estimated sizes without verticle prunning. The specs of the trees on the drawings are max figures. With verticle prunning on non oaks, and the oaks, and the one Quercus Urban Pinnacle being pruned to having a high crown, I'm thinking it's a go. With one not having acreage, prunning is a must, and placement is essential. And, if nature has blessed one that grows like it's on steroids, then it may have to be removed...... worse case scenario, or both meeting trees pruned back.

Heck, I'm 48 now, in 25 more years, prob won't care to much about that. LoL.
thanks all

Well, its in the groud. Now for Mr. Time and Mrs. Mother Nature to do their magic. Thanks all for the replies.

Almost got er done. Now if mother nature will do her magic ! Going to add some more plants. Sure is fun digging in the dirt!

Thanks for coming back to update us. I think you made the right choice for that spot!

Update, tree is doing well.

Good to hear. Poaky1

Looks good Dmac- gettin taller. Post pics after some spring growth will ya?

Hey Dmac, great to hear that you have some trunk girth growth, and leaf out, you are in California though so you will have a nice long growing season, your trees should all grow a lot for you. I'm here in Pa, no leaf out yet, so i'm envious of you right now, we will likely get leaf out in May, maybe the first week or second week of May.

I've been planting some Lily Bulbs here, they are still dormant so I guess, it's okay to have a bit extra time here before plants are growing. Give an update when you have some more growth, if you want to of course. Later Dmac

Wow, fast response, you be safe too Dmac!

Update, 11-23-18, new shed addition, growth, girth, and fall colors. Quercus Regal Prince oak tree. Happy Holidays.

11-24-28 CONT: girth has about doubled this year. hardly no height gains. has filled in some, and out some.

Your oaks look great Dmac, too bad they didn't get much taller, but, the trunk thickening is good. I got a handful of acorns on my regular Q. Robur closest to the house. I may have gotten some last fall, I got a few more this year. My other Q. Robur is in a place in my yard that was pretty waterlogged in several places this year, I didn't check it this fall. We got too much rain, and out west didn't get enough. I THINK it is because of an El Ninio year. I am not sure, but, I THINK El Ninio's make it wetter in the east and drier in the west, and La Nina's do the opposite. We have gotten really hot (for here) springs and summers. I THINK you are out west, right? Maybe I remember wrong. All your plants look good anyway, NOT drought stricken. Later.

Hey Poaky1, it's good to hear from you. well, just this oak didn't grow taller very much, and as you can see on its height, more trunk is welcomed. My others have done very well thought. I have found out through trial and error, water has a big influence on oaks.

This is my Scarlet Letter oak, and it doubled size this year, height and girth. lovely oak. I have a thread on this tree from its first day in the ground to today. Happy Holidays, cheers.

Nice fall color on the last 2 pics, same tree in both pics I'm guessing. Are the last 2 pictures of the "Scarlet Letter" oak? I am asking since the second image seems to show a YELLOW fall color on the tree NOT Scarlet, BUT, trees may show fall color influenced by the soil it's growing in.

Sorry if I am a bit confused on each tree in each picture. You are going to have to say what each tree is in each picture, or I will get confused, sorry. Anyway, it seems that your trees are doing great. I am assuming that you've had good rain this past spring and summer since you did have really great growth on one of your oaks. Mine have done pretty good also. Okay, Later.

Okay Dmac, I haven't had much good fall color on my trees. My Q. Velutina ( Northern Black oak) got a bit reddish, my Q. Montana's (Chestnut oak) got a bit yucky yellow. My Swamp white oaks got a crappy yellow, my Q. Palustris (Pin oak) got a bit red, but quickly turned crap brown, it usually puts on a nice long Russet red show before the crap brown. my Q. Alba turned a bit yellow on one and a bit red on the other, but, not anything great. My other trees I didn't really look at. My regular Q. Robur doesn't really make any decent fall color. I have 2 of them, but, the other one is a ways from the house, so, I don't know what the leaves look like now, it's swampy in the area of that Q. Robur, NOT right where it is, BUT, about 40 feet from it.

Anyway Dmac, how are your other trees? I am thinking you had a bunch of trees you were planning on planting, did you? Later.

sorry about the very late responce Poaky. all my other oaks are doing well.

Update on the Regal Prince oak tree. All leaves are gone of course. excited to see the growth this summer! Cheers to all.

I'm fine with a late response, nothings really growing yet anyway, well, not here anyway. It's a week before spring on the calendar. My calendar says March 20th is the beginning of spring.

MY yard will likely NOT have any leafing out until mid to late April, MAYBE even May, depending on the weather. I know some trees go by daylight length, BUT, I am hoping that temperature matters also, BUT, we've been getting some warmth in the 60'sF in the daytime, BUT, 20'sF and 30'sF at night. Anyway, once you get some growth maybe you'll update then? Later.

How does 'Regal Prince' seem to hold up to Visalia summer heat?

update 7-2016. tree is really pouring on the growth as you can see in the pic. I can't hardly wait for it to provide some useful shade on the house for the morning to noontime sun for the summers.
again, and i'm sure a lot if you already know, but for those out there that don't. when choosing a tree to shade the house, especially large ones, make sure its deciduous. that way in the winter, it lets some sun shine through to help warm the house and it helps keep surface molds down on the roofs and ground concrete etc.

oops, typo on date of prior update. the correct update date was supposed to be July of 2019. duh me....

Your tree is getting some width growth compared to the last pic. The subject of fall color above has me wanting to mention that I have added a Nyssa Sylvatica to my yard, Black Gum or Tupelo tree. They get great fall color or so I've read. I bought 3 by accident. I have 1 in the ground,1 in a pot and 1 is in a raised bed, and I am going to TRY Bonsai with it. I will transplant the potted one this fall. I am not sure where it will go yet. My yard is getting very crowded, I wish I could give it to somebody. I meant to buy only 1 of them. That Regal Prince will get how wide in maturity? About 15 feet? I forget, sorry. My oaks are doing fine, a few have had Japanese Beetles really eat alot of leaves. Like my Q. Velutina. It has had some issues with what LOOKS like "Butt rot" or a fungus type thing at the trunk bottom. I've been using a fungicide on it, and it seems to have healed the original scar. That is the only REALLY decimated tree (Japanese Beetle infestation) in my yard, and, I am guessing because of the Fungus problem making it weaker than all the other trees in my yard. The rest just had some leaves eaten that didn't harm tree. I need to do an update about that tree (the Q. Velutina) on GW BUT, I can't post pics anymore. I had posted and taken a pic or 2 showing the tree wound. I want to do an update, but, I can't. My computer didn't recognize the disk when I put it in my computer. Anyway, enjoy the rest of summer Dmac, I am waiting for Fall, and it's cooler temps, I can't take this 90"s F crap having. Later.

Your post was deleted for some reason Poaky 1, but I have replied anyways. :)

Hey Poaky 1, The Urban Pinnacle is supposed to be a very vertical growing oak to about the 55x25 size range. I have heard through the grape vine this estimation is around the 30 year age range which should be ideal for I planted it 18.5' away from my house, ie; 1/2 of 25' is 12.5'. And in 30 years, i'll be negative 6' below ground level. ;)

The Quercus Regal Prince is supposed to grow around the 60x40. That is the tree in the pic by the shed, and also should be ideal for it's location.

I have seen the N. Topoledo (Sp?) trees you have mentioned. They have a beautiful fall colors! I even looked at those as another choice of the oaks. Nice choice!

As far as the mold goes, be careful of tree rot, disease etc....Are the trees out of their ideal zones? And the beetles, spray before spring as the leaves have just pushed out and are tender. Hopefully that will protect the tree throughout the warm season when the bugs are out looking for their home and food sources. The beetles have been known to spread "oak wilt" which is fatal to oaks, which i'm sure you know!

It's good to hear from you and thanks for the atta boys. I will try and continue with the lives of my oaks as long as I can. Lakers Peeps

Okay, so your oak will get even wider than I thought. My Q. Velutina isn't out of zone here, it is native in my zone which is 6a. My Tupelo is the species, not any fancy cultivar. I am not sure what to spray in spring to stop Japanese Beetles. I know many people use that stuff to kill grubs, that will turn into the Japanese Beetles, BUT, my yard is huge, so, I can't afford to use that stuff. I am glad that we have some critters that eat them. I am NOT SURE if it is skunks, raccoons or even moles that eat the grubs, I haven't seen the beetles be as bad as this year for a long time, though. I have some powder that will kill the Beetles on some plants, BUT, for trees it is useless, I can't spread the powder way up in the canopy. I am trying to NOT use many chemicals anyway. I have stopped using Roundup for weeds, and it is VERY missed, I wish they'd invent a weed killer that REALLY IS safe.

Hey Poaky1, Oh, no, I do not have Oak Wilt, thank the Lord! I was just mentioning it to you because you mentioned you had a few beetles. Yes, Spray can be pricey, especially for large and for as many trees as you have. There's also the factor of how to spray the high sections of the tree, costly equipment, and ladders can only go so high. Just about all chemicals are bad for peeps, especially the ones designed to kill bugs. Another downer is the bugs that are affected can also make the birds sick, and/or die. One weight of thought is the loss of some birds and bugs vs the loss of an oak tree which will feed many other birds and other animals once they become established. I use Sevin and attach it to the end of my hose, and spray from the ground, for my oaks are still small enough. I believe with any chemical, if one uses the proper precautions, one should be okie dokie. Once my oaks get large, I may seek a professional which maybe a thought for you. I have researched oak wilt, and once it causes the death of one, others surrounding follow death almost imminently.

Glad to hear your Q. Velutina is in the right zone, is it getting enough sun on the trunk? Maybe that would help dry it out and help with mold/rot issues..... Colors to me are not all that makes the tree. I'm sure your Tupelo is going to be a stately nice looking tree in do time. :)

Hey Dmac, My Q. Velutina could use some "limbing up" but, it seems to be healing over it's wounds, time will tell. I don't think that Japanese Beetles will be a big problem again next year and they weren't that bad this year on MOST plants. I will have to limb up that Velutina anyways. I had previous years been keeping all the weeds away from the trunk of all my trees, BUT, since all of the "Roundup" controversy and ads on TV about cancer, I am NOT using it. I would still use it, the kind that is good for 4 months, BUT, my family is VERY MUCH against it. I am NOT using it now, and I now have weeds galore. I can't use a weedwacker myself, I doubt I could even get one started. I wish they'd come up with another weed killer that is NOT cancerous. I am trying to keep most plants away from the trunk. I would never weedwack close to the trunk IF I did use a weedwacker anyway. I am NOT thinking I will always have trouble with the Velutina, anyway. Later.