Chris -- loads of good ideas above for the JB's. You are destined to win! (power of positive thinking.) But about that there dream of yours. I know of two farms (one run by close friends, one run by my niece and her husband) that are 'making it.' In addition to other sales like restaurants, farmers markets, and stores, both run CSA's and have also incorporated the element of education into the financial structure. As you mentioned, people are used to paying next to nothing for their food. But people are used to paying big bucks for their kids to have something to do after school, or for their company to have some team building time, or for themselves to be entertained on Saturday. These farms run programs where they get kids and adults to work the gardens and pay for this privlege! It just needs to be couched in terms of education and/or entertainment. (Quick example: it's a history lesson, a short talk about who was growing gardens in the mid 1800's -- Native Americans, slaves, and free people. Let's choose an identity from one of these three . . . now let's weed! Does this give at least a vague idea of what I'm talking about?) If this sounds interesting, I can write more about it. Would it work in an area where everyone is a farmer? I dunno. But it sounds as though even though everyone is farming in your area, maybe not everyone is growing food to eat? Dreams are meant to be pursued. Here is a link that might be useful: the button farm

Jane: Though I find myself very rarely questioning the advice of Rhizo1 or Dave, I'd go about it differently here in SoCal. First, I'd bite the bullet and go buy a bag or two of Kellogg's N'rich and work that into the soil now along with a mix of organic meals cottonseed or feather for N, bone for P, and kelp for K and other micronutes. I buy mine in bulk but I think Home Depot has a bag that has them all made by Vigoro. In about a month or so, you could start planting things like the brassicas you mentioned, as seedlings. You could probably find some transplants at Armstrong's et al and Home Depot/Lowe's will have common starts like Kale and Broccoli and even spinach starts. If you have light set up for seedlings, you could start them right now, and start hardening them off in 3-4 weeks -- in the ground by mid to late January. Snow peas could be direct sown by the end of December. The veggies you mentioned -- I've grown all but beets. And here's what I've noticed as far as pests/diseases. Occasional cabbage aphids on brassicas, but pretty easy to control with water, soap, or neem oil. The cabbage loopers are pretty much gone by now, but they'll be back next summer. Again, pretty easy to control with BT K. Slugs, choose your method. That's about it for the brassicas. PM or mites -- they're just not susceptible. For lettuces-- I never see anything on them, except last year when I tried to grow some in the summer and whitefly nailed 'em Carrots and radishes -- once again, I never see anything on them. Snow Peas -- mites? Really? I nver see anything on them either, but as Spring progresses, PM is an issue. The best way to deal with that is to treat proactively -- i.e., start treating with a fungicide early on and stay diligent. You can't wait to see the symptoms or it's too late. Spinach, once again, nothing but slugs and maybe earwigs. In all cases, I put 2 toothpicks right up next to the stalk of all my seedlings just so any cutworms don't come by and snip them at the soil line. A note on the brassicas -- SoCal is now home to the Bagrada Bug. So, do some research for pics, monitor, and you should be fine. I saw some on my kale this past summer, squished them for 3 weeks or so and haven't seen them since. And I have all sorts of brassicas planted this fall. Dave: Solarization is a great idea, but I have found it's not very effective during any season but Summer. JMO. Kevin This post was edited by woohooman on Fri, Dec 5, 14 at 16:23

"I've never heard of canary reed grass. Can you cut it & feed it to the goats, and after it has been cut, reseed with native grasses with hopes of them filling in while the canary grass in weakened?" The problem is that unless we had a long drought, there's really no way to harvest this stuff as hay without causing severe disturbance to the soil (the tractor would sink in pretty far in on such wet ground). If we have a no-rain period for more than a week, I could probably put the portable fence in there to let the goats munch the stuff, but goats ain't sheep, and won't eat it to the ground unless I lock them in there for a couple weeks (in which case they might turn to eating the poisonous plants). "I understand from The One Who Knows, these fora do not allow a direct link to the ISIS website." Given our kind host's penchion (sp?) for free speech and proper footnoting, that sounds a bit silly. In any case, thanks, Carol, for the link! FYI: Reed Canary is one of those odd native plants that suddenly becomes invasive in disturbed habitats (Phragmites and Ragweed are two other examples of this type).

The owl house that "Miss Twiggy"(our squirrel)has taken over, at one time housed a Screech owl,cute little guy,until he-she-at all my Koi.I had about 16,i raised from babies, they were my pets,and i loved them dearly.We were dumb enough to place the house right above the pond,never in a million years did we think it would eat our fish.We do not have proof.but coon can not get in the pond it is 4 feet deep, and they would have left something behind,they are messy eaters,the pond is right out side our front porch, where i would have seen any big bird,the fish were taken some time in Feb.we saw them in December.Not even a tail was left,nothing! This year, we will only have our frogs,which i also love,you should have heard them last night,tree frogs,sending out their matting call, it was beautiful.In a few more weeks, we will have toads and other frogs calling,they are so loud, you can hear them inside the house,ha ha No more fish,it is to heart breaking to lose them,but water plants and frogs are just as nice. We also have wild turkey,deer(to many) owls,several different ones,lots of birds, hawks(to many)coon,coyote,fox(on occasion)lots of wood peckers, we even had a Pleaded Wood pecker come through here last week it was SOOOOOOOOO exciting, he came through last year also. And lots of squirrels,Lots!Every thing in nature is so fun to watch,we can learn a lot,i have great stories i could share,another time perhaps. This is a great thread. Prof. I will be watching our little Miss Twiggy,named so because she carried up many twigs into her nest,i can't wait to see them babies so close, the house is just out side our front porch.What a treat. cAROL