I grow many of the plants listed above, but I love the "surprises" that show up in the garden. A couple of years ago, I harvested some California poppies .. of course, they don't transplant well, but I put them into a container and let them do their last gasp to spread seed to continue the species. Their glorious orange/yellow has shown up in places in the garden where nothing else would grow well. The funny thing was that I thought they were spring flowering only. To my surprise, if they get water throughout the season, they repeat bloom all season long with no care on my part. Feverfew is another accidental plant that is providing "sparkle" to the garden with it's white blooms. I have poor soil and when these accidental plants show up in places where other delibertly planned plantings have failed, I always find that they are a special sorce of enjoyment. Yes, I have bulbs and am learning to grow irises and the texture of the garden is always changing. For me, that's the joy of gardening. Smiles, Lyn

I enjoyed reading, but saw only mention of climate causing difference in disease-resistance. Actually a much more important problem is that there are so many different strains geographically, that BS resistance in one location can mean absolutely nothing in another. This is why the Vigorosa roses are reliably blackspot resistant--the breeding program includes testing with a variety of BS strains. It would be really helpful to organize this discussion by states, etc. Secondly, I am wondering how many have heard that organic gardening techniques actually do more for roses in resisting disease than spraying in many cases. In a truly organic bed (no chemical fertilizers or pest & disease sprays) the soil organisms that thrive and multiply tend to push out or decrease the populations of pest fungi & bacteria. I sure hope this works for me as I have just bought a new home and am in the process of preparing a large rose garden.

I'm glad that I came back to my post to report that the ARS link above is confusing and contradictory. Lori_elf is right, experience rules over what ARS dictates. My Marchesa Bocella was a tiny band this summer. When I dug it up, the roots shrank in my alkaline clay, so my pruning wasn't the problem. The only statement that makes sense from the ARS' link is: "Avoid pruning Old Garden Roses the first two years, let them get established first." Some OGRs' once-bloomers bloom on old wood, and Marchesa Bocella blooms on both old wood and new wood. The above statement of "Avoid pruning ... let them get established" applies to wimpy own-roots as well, I don't prune mini-roses and Hybrid teas, both are wimpy as own-roots in my cold zone 5a. If I prune them too hard, they become appetizers for bunnies. However, I'm ruthless in pruning aggressive octopusy Austins like Evelyn, which throw 3 feet canes as a 2-months old baby. This link for Southern CA mild coastal climates make it much clearer than ARS's link: "Gallica, Damask, Alba, Centifolia, and Moss roses are OGRs that only bloom in spring. Prune these right after they finish blooming; this is usually sometime in early summer. The Damask roses in particular resent hard pruning, so it is best to lightly prune flowering shoots back a few inches. Repeat-blooming OGRs like: Portland, Bourbon, Hybrid Perpetual, Perpetual Damask, and Perpetual Moss roses are pruned at the same time as modern roses (January to February). Treat these roses as you would Hybrid Teas. Strong growing Hybrid Perpetual, roses require hard pruning to promote flowering, so plan to remove at least one half of last year's growth to produce better flowers. Tea and China roses produce flowers on small twiggy growth and should only be lightly pruned ... We have found they respond badly to a winter pruning. We have found that pruning Tea and China roses in the hot part of summer produces quick regrowth and they don't sit around moping for years as they tend to do if you prune them in the cold part of the year... A common complaint directed at the once-flowering Gallica roses is that they often produce very few flowers in our mild coastal regions. Gallica roses in particular require winter chilling to flower; often our mild winters are just not cold enough to produce flowers. " See the link below for Mild Coastal Southern CA tips on OGR's. Here is a link that might be useful: Huntington Botanical Garden on pruning OGRs'

@portlandmysteryrose aww, thanks. There is a good bit of room where I am at presently (rural, 1.0+/- acre) and to have any more space simply means carving out new space from the dreadful lawn (I hate lawns for several reasons, hehe). It's still early in the process, but I've finally found a home that I've put an offer in on and things are moving forward: this home is rural and on over 2 acres. Sure, a lot is wooded (love my forests), but there is a bunch of great, sunny space for gardens and my roses. No lie, I'm terrified, but things will work out just fine. You know; I didn't know that Gabrielle Noyelle was a rarer moss! I do love her soft apricot blooms, and plant habit aside, I figure the blooms are as close as I'll ever get to having 'Safrano' in the garden here in the North!  Steven