In my opinion, the only time one should plan a "destination wedding" is if you are wealthy enough to treat your friends and relatives to the cost of their travel. Nobody should reschedule. I can understand the groom wanting to please his bride's family, but he should not feel bad if his sister cannot attend. By the way, I had a somewhat similar situation in my family. After my first husband and I were married, his brother became engaged to a girl living in England, who he met while he was in the military. They got married in England, then had a second ceremony here in New York after he was discharged. The couple came to Long Island, had a second ceremony (quite fancy,nice reception). That pleased everyone.

I would never expect anyone to come to Germany to see me get married! That's ridiculous! We can't all be Rockefellers! They can just have a party in the states when they get home. It just isn't realistic to expect people to be able to go to Germany to see someone get married! If he wants them there so bad, he'll(or parents will) just have to pay their expenses!

Never heard of a destination wedding before. They need to have a party in the states and start a new tradition. They could call it a Meet the Bride Party.

My neighbor just had a destination wedding. Just the two of them, and that was what they wanted.

They are having a big open house at their new home around Christmas for family and friends.

I have always felt that a couple who plan a destination wedding are basically saying that the location of their wedding is more important than having all their friends and family attend. With a destination wedding so far away, they have to expect many that they would love to attend will not and/or can not.

The sibling ought to continue with her plans, and the groom must understand the difficulty that has been caused by the wedding location.

My son's fiancee is planning a small destination wedding this coming year. They may be surprised who will choose not to come, but that is the way it goes when guests have to donate so much time and money in order to attend these kinds of weddings.

I imagine the sister has been planning this special occasion for probably the past 4-5 years. Whether or not she's actually booked the trip, why should she have to postpone her plans? Who has a big celebration for their 11th anniversary?

I'd say, though, there's a simple solution if younger brother is so insistant on having her there--he needs to pick up the tab for her travel and hotel expenses. Oh, wait, he's having the destination wedding to save himself $$$, hm?

I agree with those who say that when you decide on a destination wedding, you know right from the start that many may not be able to come--either for financial or scheduling reasons.

So what's your take on the situation? You haven't said.

I had a destination wedding - Niagara Falls, within driving distance of all of our family and we still made it clear that no one was expected to attend. They all did except my husband's sister who was going through a divorce and 'wasn't up to seeing anyone else get married'.

If it means that much to you to have your family at your wedding, you don't make it a financial hardship for them to attend. His sister may love him dearly but a trip to Germany is quite costly.

"The couple chose not to have their wedding here as they both have huge families and cannot afford the large reception that their relatives expect."
that is crazy! I would certainly NOT expect anything for a wedding or reception. I would be thrilled to be invited to a reception to celebrate the marraige. Serve spaghetti from crock pots... hot dogs, burgers! Or just a desert reception. Who is putting that expectation out there? The couple? or is the family really like that? Or is that an excuse.

I can't imagine that flying to a foreign country would be cheaper than having one at home... but what do I know?

I think he expects to much from his sister.

Personally, I would think it would be easy for the teacher to leave during exams! lol He's already done the teaching and a substitute could certainly handle handing out the exams! LOL

and as a sister, if I could afford it, I would probably make the decision to go to Germany for my 10 year anniversary, with apologies to the other 2 couples. I would WANT to be there or my little brother.

in conclusion, hahahahah, (yeah I know that I always "talk" too much! lol) I think he has no right to expect/demand that people attend his wedding. Too much to expect them to change their plans. Though, if I were the brother or the sister, I would do my darndest to be there. Frankly I understand the vacation plans more than I understand the exam excuse! LOL

Let's see...would I rather be in Germany or in Jamaica in December? Well that settles that.

LOL Personally, I'd rather be in Germany! lol

My stepson got married in Yokohama - not because it was a "destination" wedding, but because that's where he and his bride and her family lived.

So his mother/stepdad flew in, his sister flew in, and so did my DH. I was, of course, welcome and would have been a desired and honored guest, but we simply couldn't swing the expense of 3 tickets to Tokyo. Our 8 y-o son was in school and the wedding was also taking place during a standardized testing cycle. So we stayed home.

Everyone was disappointed, everyone also understood. The bride and groom sent special gifts to me and my son to commemorate the occasion.

But your bride and groom seem to be doing a true destination wedding, where neither family lives anywhere near the destination. They should have NO expectations that anyone would rearrange their lives and spend hundreds or more dollars to attend. Brides and grooms don't get to dictate how to spend someone else's discretionary income!

kfca... the wedding is in June, actually....

"youngest son is getting married in June in Germany"

Not sure I agree with everyone. Sister "intends" to go to Jamaica, but I don't gather that anything is written in stone yet. The wedding is in June. If it were me, I'd do everyhting I could to budget for them BOTH. There's over a year to save for the anniversary trip and half a year for the wedding. It's not like she needs to spend a week on vacation in Germany. A quick weekend should be affordable if she counts her pennies. I honestly think the brother should go also...exam week?...in our school system, the only "frowned on" absences are during standardized testing. Any competent sub can handle exam week. I am very pro-family as I guess you can see. (Yes, I also dislike destination weddings, but regardless, this is what it is.)

Yes, it is what it is.

It's someone asking siblings, and possibly their spouses, to spend ~$1500 each on plane fare, plus hotel rooms for a one day event. And who travels abroad for 1 day? This trip will cost the siblings a couple of thousand dollars each, because the bride and groom don't want to host a wedding "because it will cost too much". Nope, I don't buy into that mentality at all.

The bride and groom are already planning to make this trip for their honeymoon, so it's no skin off their noses! They were spending that money anyway. Now they're "inviting" everyone else to spend that money too. Selfish.

Throw a small intimate wedding you can afford, or don't, but no one gets to dictate that others must spend thousands of dollars to attend a destination wedding they may not be able or wish to afford.

Thank you for all your responses. Obviously the vast majority believe that my niece should not feel guilty about choosing her Jamaican vacation.

Now to answer your question, I must confess that it is my sister who is backing my niece. I love both kids equally, but I felt with more details, I might not get the same responses if it was clear who I'm siding with in this situation. However, I do wish to at least explain why I disagreed with her supporting my niece's decision.

My sister (bless her heart) is a very strong willed person and was insisting her son have a large wedding, like those of his 2 siblings. The difference is, his siblings both married partners from well-to-do families who made a huge contribution to the wedding costs. My sis feels it's embarrassing if she can't include her same guest list for her youngest son's wedding as well. But since the bride-to-be doesn't come from money, the couple would have had to pay for the reception themselves, with just a bit of help from my Sis and BIL. The wedding in Germany is to avoid the huge debt they'd incur with a local wedding, since my sister was putting up such a fuss about them having anything smaller than his siblings. The bride's late grandparents who she adored, were born in a very beautiful little town in Germany, and she has always wanted to visit.

My nephew has always been an extraodinary help to his sister, as her hubby is not the least bit handy. Anything around their house that needs fixing, from laying a new roof, major foundation repairs for a leaking basement, etc., her brother has always done for her, when she calls and says her DH can't do the job. My niece is a Pharamcist and her DH is in Architect, so they make a very good double income. But they are very frugal and will not hire out if it is anything they think my nephew can handle. My nephew is usually given a gift certificate for Red Lobster or such, which is never a fraction of the cost they save by not hiring out.

My niece is very sweet and loving, but she has always been the family Princess, and able to manipulate her parents. If her younger brother tries to beg off doing a repair job for her, she gets her mother to call him and guilt him into helping out his sister. (I know this because my niece has bragged to me how she gets my Sis to nag my nephew until he concedes.)

Although airfare from Toronto to Germany isn't as cheap as Toronto to Jamaica, the Jamaica trip will actually be MORE expensive. Those attending the wedding are staying at a pretty Bed and Breakfast, whereas my niece is planning to stay at a very expensive luxery resort in Jamaica. So in this case, the vacation she wants to go on with their friends will cost more than attending her brother's wedding.

When we had a family get together last month, my niece joked numerous times that she has no interest in Germany, and she can't believe her brother didn't pick an 'exotic' wedding destination. This made me feel that she would have been willing to forego her vacation with friends if her brother had picked a destination she liked better. It also struck me as questionable that she had never mentioned plans for an anniversary trip until AFTER her brother confirmed that his wedding destination was in Germany.

My nephew and fiancee stated that attendance at their wedding is your gift, so they are truly trying to make their wedding as accomodating as possible. I guess I just feel that with all the things my nephew has done for his sister, she could put her brother's wedding over the vacation with friends. She and her DH have already had past trips to Vegas and Mexico with the two other couples, so I can't help but feel she should not pass up her brother's wedding for a more expensive vacation with them.
I'll not saying anything more about it to my sister though, as I don't want my personal feelings to cause any rift between us. I just hope my niece doesn't regret her decision in years to come.

Hmmm... I wouldn't miss my brother's wedding for the world. But, I personally probably wouldn't be celebrating my 10 year wedding anniversary with other couples.

Different people have different priorities and different preferences. To each his own, I guess. I would think you need to decide what your priorities are and what is most important to you. Is vacationing with your friends more important to you than being at your brother's wedding? I'm sure to some people it may be.

It sounds like in this case there is money for a trip...it just needs to be decided which trip to take. Personally, I'd go see my brother get married and make it a second honeymoon of sorts for my husband and me to help us celebrate our anniversary. I'm not big into paying for destination weddings... but, to me, a sibling is different than a college friend or co-worker. But to others, close frineds are more important. It just all depends. I just know if my brother wanted to get married at the north pole, I'd be there...

So, he knew his sister was cheap, he knew she put her needs first, and yet he's surprised that she won't come to Germany for his wedding? I'm not saying she's doing the right thing but did anyone really expect anything else of her? Why would he even want her there with that attitude?

He should be happy - sounds like he sent up the perfect situation to refuse her demands for help in the future.

Ditto what Paula said..you hit it right on the nail..I feel badly for the brother that his siblings won't be there for his wedding day. If I were the Mom I know I would be heartbroken.

And if your niece regrets her decision in the future, too bad. That'll be her problem and hers alone.

The new information doesn't really change my opinion. Having the wedding elsewhere is just shifting the cost to someone besides the bride and groom. The neice may be spoiled, but that still doesn't require her to take a trip to Germany. The family pressure here from everyone would make me uncomfortable.

The new info doesn't change my mind or opinion either.

My sister (bless her heart) is a very strong willed person and was insisting her son have a large wedding, like those of his 2 siblings.
Unless she is/was prepared to pay for it herself, she shouldn't insist on such a wedding...

My nephew has always been an extraodinary help to his sister, as her hubby is not the least bit handy. Anything around their house that needs fixing, from laying a new roof, major foundation repairs for a leaking basement, etc., her brother has always done for her, when she calls and says her DH can't do the job.
Well either he enjoyed helping his sister, and the good feeling he got from it was his 'thank you' or else he was allowing himself to be used as a sort of doormat. One shouldn't do 'favor's because they expect them to be returned (imho).

When we had a family get together last month, my niece joked numerous times that she has no interest in Germany, and she can't believe her brother didn't pick an 'exotic' wedding destination.
Well, it is still her choice as to how she wants to spend thousands of dollars allocated to traveling and the expenses, besides time off from work.

My nephew and fiancee stated that attendance at their wedding is your gift, so they are truly trying to make their wedding as accomodating as possible.
Well the cost of that trip would certainly be a mighty hefty gift and something they should not assume anyone would want to or could afford to give them.

I wonder what the niece's husband thinks about it all...I'm betting he would much prefer the Jamaican vacation for their 10th anniversary.

It sounds like none of this would even be an issue if your sister had stayed out of it and had let the couple plan and pay for what THEY could afford.

They ought to elope and then throw a small party at a later date, a party of their planning and choosing.

Ditto chemocurl...

I think it is really sad anyone tried to insist that your nephew & his bride to be have a large wedding. To bad they couldn't have planned what they wanted & could afford in Toronto with a few quests and then gone to Germany for their honeymoon.

Okay, here's another approach. Why didn't the nephew contact the family with dates prior to setting the final date? Then they may have gone if the slate was clear for the family. I would think the blame lays on the engaged couple. You can't expect people to drop everything and go to a foreign country just because you want them to. They should have been taken in to consideration prior to setting the date. My niece married in Ireland and only four members of the family went. She wasn't upset but understood. That's life. Oh I did go and had a ball but hubby who is her real biological uncle didn't only because he didn't want to and that was okay with her.

Where they get married is their choice.
Whether or not those invited attend is the choice of the attendees.

If the Mother of the groom wants to have a big party for them at home at HER expense, that'd be lovely.

What people forget is that it doesn't make a Tinker's Damn bit of difference as to how LARGE or SMALL or HOW MUCH Is spent on the wedding. THAT isn't what makes a marriage.

AND after all, it's the MARRIAGE that's important.

It must sound from my posts that my niece and the nephew involved aren't that close, but they do really love each other. She is 10 years older than him and has always made him very welcome to be the doting uncle in her kids' lives. He is very sweet natured and is, as someone mentioned, kind of a 'doormat' personality when it comes to his mother and sister. My Sis wears the pants in her family and his sister wears the pants in hers.

I don't think it's so much a case of enjoying the good feeling he gets from all the handyman duties he does for his sister, as much as he hates the constant guilt trip from his mother if he won't 'be a good brother and go help out his sister.'

I probably gave the wrong inference when I said that the couple stated that attendance at the wedding is their gift. Once they made the destination for overseas, the couple automatically assumed no one would attend except their parents and siblings. They just wanted their families to realize that they know their attendance in itself is a huge gift and want noting else.

I was told not to throw a shower for them as my Sis feels it's not right to expect a shower gift from people who are not receiving an invite to the wedding. I still wanted to host one, as I know they are only not inviting others because they don't want people to think they'd expect anyone other than immediate family to make such a trip. But I see my sister's point on this and wouldn't want to offend people by inviting them to a shower when I know they won't receive wedding invitations.

chemocurl made a good point when she mentioned that perhaps my niece's husband would prefer the Jamaican vacation for their 10th anniversary. He is very long time friends with the 2 other husbands and they love to go on deep sea fishing trips whenever they go to the Caribbean. The wives love to relax on the beach or shop the jewelry stores, which I can totally relate to, myself. So I can genuinely understand why a trip to a place he and my niece have no real interest in would not be the trip he wants to make for their anniversary.

I guess I just hoped they'd see it more as 'attending a brother's wedding' trip than 'celebrating our anniversary in Germany' which is how they are seeing it, and why they aren't going. Considering they go to the Caribbean about every other year, it's just bad luck that their 10 year anniversary happens to be next year when the last brother is getting married.

But the point made that a destination wedding is always risky and you can't assume even your immediate family will be willing to go, is well taken and I'll refrain from any further opinions when Sis brings it up.

Your Sis is right about the shower. It would be in very poor taste to hold a shower with no wedding invite. Never heard of that. Siblings or not, no one should expect anyone to fork out that kind of expense to go to Germany for a wedding. Sounds like your sister is running the show on where it was held.

Your sister is correct - hosting a shower for them would be in really poor taste! I know etiquette on this is changing, but showers are hosted by friends, not family members.

I also agree with your sister that your nephew has no reason to expect his sister to go to Germany for a wedding. I'm pretty sure she'd have bought them a very nice wedding gift - but really, would she have been planning on spending thousands?

Destination weddings are all about the bride and groom, and are an imposition on the guests. I'm still of the same opinion as my original posts.

I'm sorry--hearing the additional info doesn't really change my mind.

Bottom line, it seems as if the decision has been made to dump the major portion of the cost of the wedding on the attendees--to save mom and the couple $$$. I'm sorry to have to say this, but IF DD is the princess you describe, from the limited amount of info we have, it seems possible she learned that trait from Mom.

Look, it makes little difference how much money sis has--it's her choice how she wants to spend it. I, myself am extremely frugal. Having someone try to back me into a corner like that wouldn't sit well with me. Honestly? I pulled my teenage daughter out of her cousin's wedding BECAUSE of the expense involved. The bride was picking stuff out with no consideration of the finances of her attendants--we couldn't afford it. Certainly we had enough $$$, but didn't feel that a bridesmaid's dress of over $300 was a way we wanted to spend our money (and this was over 12 years ago!)
I still think it's the sister's option to make the decision whether or not to attend, and no one should criticize her or any other invitees who feel the cost is beyond them, for whatever reason.

Well, in some sense I've changed my mind.. At least the couple aren't willing to be forced into spending excessive $$ to make a mom happy. Good for them. If your sister wants them to have the kinda of wedding the others did -- then she should be willing to pay for it. Frankly, the free ride on all the handyman stuff may just come to a screeching halt with the new wife in the picture. And, in the end, I would think that he & new wife just may pickup and move else where to get away from all the female drama.

As I said, I would do everything I could to be at my brother's wedding. Even with out DH. I'm sorry his brother (exams... I think THAT is a worse excuse. lol If you can't afford to go, just say it!) and sister can't make it. But I also don't think anyone should be expected to go, either.

His mother is a real pita. Being EMBARASSED? about your son's wedding? She's got real issues. As far as the shower goes, I am sick of tit for tat. People should go to showers because they WANT to go and wish the couple well. I hope one of her friends step up.

I'm sorry it has even happened. The mother should keep her trap shut and I hope your nephew will do only the work he wants to do for his sister.

I hope your nephew and his fiance are able to enjoy this great time and not worry about anybody else!

Sorry your niece is a such a brat. Sorry your sister is so concerned with what 'somebody' might say about a small reception -- or maybe I should be sorry her youngest son didn't snare a rich girl!

If I were your nephew I'd consider not returning from Germany, now that he really, really KNOWS where he ranks with his sister. (Last straw, I hope.)

Read Flamingo's post again. Your sister's the problem!

I don't think any of my family would fly to Germany for one of our weddings and we wouldn't expect them to. If the brides family lived in Germany I would opt for two very simple weddings family and close friends only, one in Germany, one in the states. If the family never heals this breach it will be because of the people making a fuss about family not coming.

Sounds to me there's plenty of, shall we say "issues" to go around in that family! Mom's a controller, Sis is a user, Brother might have issues standing up for himself and possibly a little spoiled too. I haven't understood the bride's position too clearly in this but sounds like she wanted to be near her folks too.

All the comments made about the expense to go, inconvenience and other have been made and are valid.

I might have considered a double wedding. One in the US and one in Germany if it's such a big deal. But that'd go back to the cost issue too.

The date of the wedding matching the Jamaican vacation is a problem that could have been avoided.

Sounds like a no-win situation. There's going to be hard feelings from this event, no doubt, but it's a JOOTT. Everyone needs to realize that and get over it. I just hope things work out so the couple will be happy.

At least it sounds like the couple is willing to take steps to avoid interference from family and that's good. Congratulations and best wishes to them.

What's a JOOTT?

Frankly, with that additional information, I suspect that your brother and his bride-to-be knew exactly what they were doing in planning their wedding in Germany. And I say good for them. Your niece sounds like a real piece of work. I know you love her, but sorry, she sounds like she's a diva. I have no time for divas.

Perhaps your youngest nephew is the one in the family who has it all together. Given that (at least according to the story we know) he didn't talk to anyone in the family about best times, etc., perhaps he knew exactly who would come and who wouldn't.

Your sister - wow. Of course you love her, too. Of course. But wow.

Just One Of Those Things
JOOTT

If I'm reading this right - they've decided to have the wedding in Germany because that's where the bride's grandparents were from (not because her family lives in Germany)and she's always wanted to see the area. Did they check with those that they wanted to attend before making plans, If not, I'm sorry but that's not good enough to me to expect others to change their anniversary plans to attend a destination wedding. The wedding could be held here conservatively and honeymoon in Germany.

the trip and the wedding are not on the same date. If that makes any difference lol. They are just in the same year.

I hope your nephew can just let it go, he can't be too suprised. I imagine he is feeling a little down because his fiance's 3 siblings are attending.

I hope every one can take a step back now and enjoy their time.

Additional information makes no difference in what I would do.
I would go to my younger brother's wedding.
I really can't see the big deal.

I would too, Monica. The only reason would be that I can't afford it. Looks to me like the sister and brother could.

Its my opinion that sister's Jamacia trip should proceed as scheduled. Apparently it was set up before the wedding plans were announced. If he wanted his sister to attend, he should have planned it with her instead of springing the date at a very inconvenient time for her. Furthermore, the wedding is half-way around the world adding much expense to any US family member who might attend. He should feel lucky if one relative can be there and should not expect any member of his immediate family. It would be nice if they could attend, but he should understand if they do not.

When you hop across a large ocean to have a wedding, you are on your own. If you want either or both parents to attend, pay their way - and do buy round trip tickets. Don't ship them to a foriegn country and then strand them there.

Just to clarify, everyone has known for about 8 months that my nephew is marrying next June. Once he announced that his wedding would be in Germany, rather than local, my niece told the family of her plans for Jamaica and said she can't afford two trips in the same year. Although she hadn't mentioned her plans to anyone until after her brother booked the church and B.&B. in Germany, it is understandable that she would plan a trip for her 10th anniversary next December, since they go to the Caribbean every few years with the same set of friends.

A few weeks ago at a family birthday, my niece showed everyone the extremely expensive luxery resort she wants to book in Jamaica. It became clear that the Bed and Breakfast wedding in Germany (including flights) is actually the less expensive trip. Since she said she can't afford 2 trips in one year, her brother asked if she would consider delaying her anniversary trip a bit, in order to attend his wedding.

She said the other couples are already looking forward to their next trip together, and joked that she couldn't believe her brother picked Germany over a 'romantic tropical destination like Jamaica' for his wedding. That made me feel she was insuating that if he had chosen to marry in December and picked Jamaica for his destination, she could have gone to his wedding and still had her luxery anniversary vacation. My nephew's choice of Germany will have them marrying in the same little church his fiancee's grandparents married in, which will be very sentimental for the bride's family.

I do recognize that my niece works extremely hard in her career and deserves to spend any money she designates for vacations, anywhere she wants. I can understand that she sees her brother's wedding in Germany as "where I'd be spending my 10th anniversary trip, and I have no desire to do it in Germany." I guess I wish she could see the trip to Germany as her brother's hopefully onetime wedding, as opposed to another of her hopefully many anniversaries to celebrate. But I can see her point if she truly can only afford one trip next year.

The ironic thing is, the whole decision for a destination wedding occured to avoid the cost of the large local wedding my Sister wanted, in order not to 'lose face' about not being able to invite all the same guests to a smaller wedding. Now, neither sibling is attending their brother's wedding, because one can't do 2 trips in the same year and the other is in his first year teaching after waiting 2 years to get in and is afraid to ask for time off in one of the busiest school weeks of the year. I wonder if my Sister realizes that the small local wedding her youngest son wanted would have avoided all this, but I'm not going to tell her "I told you so."

I don't see a problem either. Either you choose to go or you don't. No matter what the reason. Really, the only people that need to be there are the bride and groom.

Personally I'd rather go to Germany than Jamaica, but I'd rather go to Jamaica than a wedding.

Your sister precipitated the destination wedding with her demands for a local blow-out. Her son and his fiancee should have stood up to her. They didn't.

No matter how much I love (and I do) my siblings, there is no way in hell I'd pay thousands of dollars to attend a wedding that far away. When I choose to travel, it will be to a place I want to go. I am 100% on your niece's side in her decision.

Family rows sure can be fun, can't they?

When viewed from the outside.

Don't you just love the picture of that female ... laying it on rather thickly at the family gathering about that luxury resort in Jamaica ...

... and she wasn't much interested in a trip to Germany, anyway ..

... for what was that again ... oh, a relative is getting married?

ole joyful

So maybe I'm reading between the lines, but sibling sister comes across as very controlling about how her brother is getting married. She could afford both trips if she'd tone down the winter vacation in Jamiaca.. But then, maybe, she wouldn't have 'bragging rights' on the best vacation. Betting that the Jamaica is one of the ones with several swimming pools, numerous bars and restaurants on site [mostly because lots of the area isn't safe for non-locals]

Here is a link that might be useful: US Issues Travel advisory for Jamaica 5/10

Okay - I breezed through quickly and think that Mom really should find a way to pay for her daughter to attend. (DH or not)
She encouraged them to have the wedding in Germany, and now her son is paying an emotional price for not having any of his siblings present.

Now that cate52 has brought it up, I've been thinking that someone would have to pay ME to vacation in Jamaica! LOL

I hope the bride and groom are not disappointed when they get to Germany. It sounds as though they have not visited before. They seem to be relying heavily on some old family recollections about what the town, church, etc. used to be like...back WHEN?

It's not too late to change the wedding to be local.

I have sometimes regretted honeymooning in London and Paris, although I'd been abroad before. It was too much to undertake immediately after a big wedding. We would have been able to enjoy the trip more later.