We had the same dilemma, we decided to go with the island. We also opened up the wall into the dining room and are planning to put a nice table in there. For me, there was just a status associated with having an islnd, I never had one before and I REALLLY wanted one. However, when I asked around some people said it was way overrated, a junk collector and some people couldn't live without it. So, we just went for it and hopefully we'll love it. I don't think you can go wrong either way.

I didn't want to lose the storage of an island, and while I wish I had stuck to my guns wrt having it made two inches shorter than counter height (it arrived counter height) for ease of prepping, I don't think I'd like the table height for prep. Really just my opinion, and you get to do what works for YOU!

our old kitchen had no island and big table, our new kitchen has an island that seats 4 and no table- i much prefer the island- we get extra storage and extra prep space- which we did not have with the kitchen table.

I should have mentioned that the kitchen table is also our only table, as we are opening the kitchen up to the dining room to have one large room. So we either have just the table, or a small island/peninsula with the table still in the "dining" part of the room.

So far the list of pros/cons I have is as follorw:

PROS:
-more open
-allows for better clearances around all 4 sides of table
-fits in with the authentic French Provencal look I am going for
-less $$$
-could add the island/peninsula later (I would do a freestanding piece, that would therefore require no plumbing or electrical)
-symmetry would be near perfect! :)
-table has more emphasis as it is literally the center of the room

CONS:
-lose the storage space (some could be made up elsewhere)
-lose the prep counter (this is my biggest concern, as it would be where baking would be done)
-may look like something is missing?
-already have counter stools (not the end of the world)
-cost more $$$

Well, the list of Pros looks good and it also looks to me like you really want the table! :-) I would go for it. The cons are all things you seem to have found solutions for and the loss of prep counter for baking will not be as big a thing as you think. In my old kitchen I had a farm table in the middle and I really liked that height for baking and rolling out dough. In fact you see a lot of kitchens with a lower height baking center. I'd go for the table, if you'd really love to have it, instead of the island.

I know everyone here always says get what you want without considering resale, BUT in this crazy market, I would be very careful eliminating completely the only dining space. Just a thought.

I am a long-time lurker, but this post really came at the right time for me because we are struggling with the very same thing.Amberley, that's a pretty table. What size is it?
The table that we have is a BIG (8' x 3'6"), gorgeous and very tough Tasmanian blackwood table that i brought with me from Australia. It is a refectory table with big turned legs and a cross bar on the bottom. My husband is adamant that we have it in the kitchen/dining area but when I plan and walk through the space, it feels like it would be too squashy and closed-in feeling with both an island AND the table.

I am contemplating 2 solutions. One is to have a square island with a marble top for pastry, that the table will butt up against. Then I'd get the storage in the 4'x4' island and have a bit of separation from the kitchen, because of the height/width difference. The other solution is to make a platform for the table in the shape of its footprint, that would raise the table to island height, so we could all sit around it on bar stools.

Any further input would be just so helpful.

So, like you, I'm torn.

kimkitchy-

I think I won't have any problems with the table for baking. One of my visions for the kitchen was having a baking space where my kids (2 now, maybe a third later) could help me with cookies, etc. The table would work very well for that. Only drawback there is that the supplies would have to be stored elsewhere.

sarschlos- I hemmed and hawed about that exact thing for about 9 months, and my orginal thought was to keep them separate. However, we don't plan to move for quite some time. Additionally, my neighborhood is filled with young families, and everyone I have talked to who has a "dining room set" got it as a hand me down from a relative. No one I talked to would actually go out and buy one. We live in a traditional brick rowhouse (townhouse to most people) built in 1942. The kitchen (now) is a galley, and most people who remodel seem to open it up completely, or at least take half the wall down. I really evaluated how we live/want to live/will live down the road, and we decided that the "formal" dining room space is essentially dated.

What I am making sure of however, is that if someone who buys my house eventually, has a dining room set, they will be able to use it. The hardest part about the perimter floor plan for me has been finding a place for my grandmothers Duncan Pfyfe sideboard, which I painted/finished myself, and it had to stay. There will also be a spot for my breakfront that I plan to paint as well. I am going for a somewhat unfitted look, and if I did do an island /peninsula, it would be freestanding, so it could move (or be bought to go there to sell it if I don't end up with one).

desert gal-

The table is not actually made yet, and it will be custom, so I can have it made to whatever size I want. It will most likely be 36" wide, and 6' long (with 2 leaves at the ends, each at 20"). If we do the island, the table wouldn't have the leaves in most of the time, but if it stood alone, I would probably leave the leaves in to make it over 9'.

I had thought about making the table counter height and doing counter chairs. We are having the table and chairs both made, so this is an option for us. However, I am short, and I realized that since this is the only table in the house, that I probably would get fatigued (literally) by never being able to sit with my feet on the floor. I love th look too, but I have a feeling that that style is going to look dated eventually. This is literally aforever table- I will pass this on to my great-grandchildren, the quality is that good.

I know what you mean about feeling too squashy. That is my main concern. I realized that without the i/p we can pull our base perimeter cabinets out to 30" and recapture aloot of the "lost" storage from the i/p.

I have a carrara marble "dough board" that I received as a wedding gift that I will use on the table if I don't do the island. Funny that your ideas are exactly the same as mine- I would butt the one short end of the table up to the island as well! I had gotten the concept of teh long and linear island/table sort of from a "chef's table" in the kitchen of a resaturant.

Having the table in the center is also somewaht symbolic-the kitchen is the heart of the home, the table is the heart of the kitchen.

I have been working on drawings forever, and had posted some ideas awhile back, but it is only recently that I started thinking of eliminating the i/p- due to budget constraints more than anything else.

Here is a link to an artible in Cottage Living a few months back- this kitchen just about sums it up for me:

Here is a link that might be useful: Cottage Living article

We don't have a farm table in our kitchen due to size but I do seem to see that look a lot when flipping through kitchen magazines. One of my favorites I have come across has an old antique table as their island but I think you could accomplish the same look with a farm table.

Here is a link that might be useful: photo with

I love the idea of a center kitchen table. I would want a table with a very hard surface, that can take a lot of abuse. I have a nice teak dining table that is our main table and I am having a hard time keeping it nice with 2 young kids. I need to embrace the "distressed" look, I guess *shrug*.

Also, our last kitchen was "eat in" and I didn't like inviting anyone but family over for dinner. I didn't like to have company eating in a messy kitchen.

If you don't have a separate dining area, I would probably not have an eat in kitchen.

I have an old butcher block, 30" square, 31" tall, in the middle of my not-very-big kitchen. I use it for everything, prep, chopping, staging, buffet and sometimes bar. No storage, except for knives that hang on the side and a pot rack over.

If I could have my dream kitchen, I would have a big square room with perimeter cabinetry and an old-fashioned kitchen table. Nothing says "home" to me like a kitchen table. I might be the only person who loved the kitchen on "Six Feet Under" :-) Alas, my current kitchen is 11'x14', so only enough room for a small butcherblock counterheight table.

Personally I find it more comfortable to sit at a table than at a counter, plus a kitchen table might be easier for shorter folks to prep at.

I like the vintage feel GM's kitchen that had with a table in the room. At one point I was certain enough in my conceptual planning to order a table to function as an island. Budget was a big consideration. I tried all the configurations you considered. It is, however, in the room adjacent to the kitchen that will become the DR in the remodel. Why? because my plan changed. I love the table, and use it some times for food prep. (It is the Nonna table from Napa Style. Thanks, Holly!) So, just a caution to be sure before you order an expensive table. It worked out just fine for me, but not as I expected .

cotehele-

I hear you on ordering too early- I bought 2 counter stools from Ballards a few months ago when they had a good sale, and now I am talking about not doing an island/peninsula for them to sit under! But, that was not a huge cost, a table would be. But, since I am getting the table regardless, it is ust a matter of wher in the space I will put it (and whether I will use the leaves or not), I think I will be okay. I am not ordering anyway until the reno is underway and the plan is settled. Love Napa Style BTW!!

flatcoat-

That is just the feeling I am going for (although I have followed your sage and your kitchen is gorgeous!! Love the BS in particular!). Since we are combining both rooms, the space will be 15'x20', with cabs on one long, and one short side. I am short, too, so I think that the table will actaully be okay for baking, and for prep (once you factor a think chunk of butcher block on top, if I am cutting). I also find it more comfortable to sit at a table.

lightlystartched-

I have thought about the "mess" when serving folks, but honestly, the way we live is everybody is in the thick of it. One of my main goals/aspirations with this kitchen is to have friends over for cooking/wine drinking/good times, and want to have the "cooks" all enjoying each other and the space. We don't do formal entertaining, so I am not too worried about that, but it is a very good point that many people would not want to deal with.

Maybe I can convince my DH that since we don't need the island/peninsula, we can redirect that part of teh budget to the range of my lusty dreams- a Lacanche Cluny!!

For me, I am not a kitchen island fan, but that is me. If you need the extra storage, I say go with the island and have a bar on it for an eating area.

Otherwise, I would be very hesitant to give up the only eating area in a house. I think it would be not a good thing on resale value.

So, since your heart is set on the table (my preference anyway since I am not an island fan), I say go for it. Too bad they can't make it adjustable that it could go up and down so it could be counter height if necessary and table height as necessary. Then you would have the best of both worlds. Actually, if it had a pedestal base, you could probably do just that...

I say go with the table.

(It is a beautiful table, by the way.)

I believe people relax around a table in a way they don't perched on a little stool. People put their feet up, the animals sit under it, children's heads are at the same level as their parents (when their parents are sitting) so they can interact eye to eye, you can pull in many more chairs, you can make a fort out of it on a rainy day, or pull it aside and play kitchen broom hockey. Tables are just BETTER.

I also don't understand the idea that, after thousands of years of baking at tables, that, in the last ten years, humans, or the baking arts have suddenly evolved such that people can no longer do it comfortably at a table. If you think rolling or kneading will be a problem, an area at the correct height somewhere, either as an island or on a counter, will serve that purpose, and you can lay out as many pans or sheets on the table as you want to fill and cool.

It is, also, as you say, the only way to get the true French look. Islands are really American. And I personally believe the table is a more truly "upscale" look. It would definitely not look like something was missing, as long as it's the right size for the kitchen.

As for resale, I say giving the next owners the option of deciding for themselves is not a bad thing. Particularly if the island means making holes in the floor.

So it's not a mistake to have a table. Or if it is, it leaves you the option of the island later, with a beautiful table you can use elsewhere or sell. But going for a big, built-in island means no going back.

You've got a range of good options from posters here.

I should clarify that if i go with the island/peninsula, I will still have the same table (shorter, without the leaves in though), it will just be in the same spot it is now, in the current dining room space. So we would have the table in either scenario.

I really need to scan a new drawing so you guys can see the layout- they don't come out that well bcs I work in pencil. I am having a designer do professional drawings, and I should get those soon.

We just moved into our new home in May, and we went through a similar process to yours. We had bought counter stools last summer, in preparation for an island. When it was time to design our kitchen, we decided against an island, because we are both attracted to farmstyle kitchens with big tables in the middle.

We also decided against a formal dining room, because we had one in our previous house for 17 years, and rarely used it. We converted our dining room to an office, but if anyone buys the house in the future, they could use it for its original purpose. We aren't formal entertainers, and enjoy being in the kitchen with the food and a bottle of wine while we have people over.

My Mom lives in a house built in 1849, and I grew up working and eating at a table in her kitchen (it was my grandmother's kitchen at the time!). I thought an island would be too modern, because we were trying to have an old farmstyle kitchen, like my Mom's.

We haven't used the table for prep yet, because honestly, we have plenty of counter space around the perimeter. If we were to do a big baking job, such as Christmas cookies, I'm sure we'd easily spread out to the table. We'll see how that goes in the future; we've been cooking outside a lot lately, because it's summer.

We have been considering getting a rolling butcher block cart, but haven't found the need for it yet. Now we have to do something with those stools that are in the basement....

BTW, your table is gorgeous. We bought one from Pottery Barn that extends to 12 feet, but plan to get a more authentic table in the future. We got mismatched chairs to go around it, and I find the seating very comfortable. I'll keep yours in mind, because we live in Maryland!

I have had a table in a past kitchen. I love a table for work space. Maybe because I'm short (although my mom has extra high kitchen counters and I find them comfier than standard too). I love that a table can be moved, and sat at. I don't like counter-height seating. I like my feet firmly planted on the ground...

That said, it's a big table, so I can't really compare my experience to it. Is the top easily cleaned so it can serve as a work space? Can I have it?

We do not have an island as I have 2 kids who bake with me often and we use our custom farm table for everything!! From baking to dinner to homework and crafts.

Black Mountain Furniture made it for us and like the one you are getting it has 2 leaves and is just Awesome I can not rave about it enough!

Here is a link that might be useful: Black Mountain Furniture Farm Table

emmag- that's some great stuff! I am going to have to go there- my cosuisin lives in Raleigh, and she got married in Black Mountain! You are in the same mode as me, using the table "from baking to dinner to homework and crafts".

BTW, a little more about the table, I just can't say how much I love this furniture from Antique Tables Made Daily in Virginia. My parents had a hutch, 6 Windsor chairs, and a HUGE farm table made 3 years ago from them. It is BEAUTIFUL, heirloom quality furniture, that I swear is bulletproof, and is, yes, cheaper than Pottery Barn, Restoration, etc. And it is so much better and you get exactly what you want.

Here is a link that might be useful: Antique Tables Made Daily site

Here is a pic of my still unfinished kitchen with a huge 8 ft table in the centre of the room. We love gathering around it to chat while people are working along the counters!
Cheryl

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canukgal-

That is about the size table I am refering to. Do you have any cabs or furniture on the other long side of the table?

We have a large buffet & hutch on the opposite wall. We have china & cookbooks displayed there. Works v. well for us!

Ballard's has islands that come in black, white and another color that I can't recall right now.
We have a place here in the south called Southeastern salvage. They sell practically the same islands for a fraction of the price.

And also you can get farm tables for a song made with old heart pine wood, my favorite. Any size, any wood.

Whatever you decide, nothing says, french country like a old farm table.

Jim just posted this beautiful kitchen in the decorating forum. Love the table.

I tried using the table but it was too big expecially trying to get from the stove to the sink. I put it off to the side and currently using my old island in the middle. There was an old thread with a lot of distressed islands that eventually I hope to replace the center island with.

sduck2- how much space do you have between the edges of the 2 counters in the middle (where the island is)? And how wide is your table that you decided was too big?

newdawn- will check them out, sounds like it is a good source!

caminnc- that is a GORGEOUS room! Definately going in my inspiration file!

I have 8' from counter to counter. The island is 23" leaving 3 ft on each side. The table is 36" which would give me 2 ft on each side.

Thanks sduck2, that gives me a good visual.

I was looking through threads on the Decor forum today, and I came across a link (I wish I could remember who or what thread!) that is FANTASTIC. It is a company that does location services for movies, etc. and has TONS of photographs of all styles and periods of English homes. I found so many pics with farm tables in the center!!! The pics below are one of my favorites. I spent 2 hours trolling around on the site!

BTW, I think I will start a new thread just to let all of GW's know about this great resource!

English kitchen pics:

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Here is a link that might be useful: Location Works

thought I would add some additional pcitures of the English kitchens I found with farm tables in the center from this great site:

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Ifound my kitchen when I moved in very difficult to function in. It is 11 x 12 with a picture window on the rear south wall so no cabinets are there, a driveway door to the side of that on the north, a 1/2 bath door on the left of the rear wall and east of that the basement door. I needed a table and workspace but I didn't want it all togther. I wanted to keep the Eat-in kitchen concept but I desparately needed counter space. We came up with (we are just starting the plans) a breakfast nook on that south wall, to sit 4 and in front of that which would face my working triangle, stove, fridge and sink a 5 foot work a area with 4 large pot drawers below and room above for hanging pots. this way my seating area is separate from working area as my DH is always cluttering up the table with magazines and his mail which I always have to clear before baking or whatever. I decided against the Island for that reason, plus I don't like sitting on bar stool height chairs and I don't like a two-level island, plus I am trying to keep it as "period" as practicable. If my kitchen were large, I would definitely go for the farm table look. Lascema

WOW! Beautiful pictures.

I love your idea of the table in the center. We wanted a large gathering place in the center of our kitchen too & so had this built for us. We opted to raise the "table" area. I love the prep area, it is counter height. I love the added storage & wouldn't know how to function without this workspace. I know my kitchen is not at all the style you are looking at(nor is it finished). Have you thought about having your table made & connecting the island at the one end. You can lower the table part below the counter height prep area & then you would have your storage & work area too and your great farm table.

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