circus, Unerectors just told me they do not do any small residential projects. My hopes were so high.

LL, it's part of an overall look I'm going for. The cabs will be relatively colorful, and I need grounding. Plus if I get the Aga Legacy, it already has a black top.

Here is my scratch test for soapstones labeled as such:

The right side clearly shows the fork tines. The left side has a few small white bits that you can see in the lower right. I tried to keep the pressure even but the barocca is way softer so not overly scientific. Neither has been oiled after the fact and neither has been treated at least 2 weeks prior to the test. The anastasia had a much smoother top finish in the sample than the barocco.

Yeah, I'm kind of wondering how some of these materials even get sold for kitchen countertops. I can only imagine how my sample or yours would look after five years in a kitchen. Perhaps hardness varies by slab.

I just got a big pile of beautiful SS samples from El Dorado, but my joy turned to sadness when I oiled them. Many turned very green, which I can't have. There was one called Indigo that seems quite hard and was beautiful unoiled. Oiled, it turned green, but only in direct sunlight! Out of direct light, it turned rather uninterestingly dark. If not for the green issue, which I'll recheck tomorrow, I'll consider it. Minas is also very attractive, but I ready it is also soft and ding-prone, though not as bad as Barocca. I may abuse and test these samples and post pix for posterity.

If I had to give an example of what I'm looking for, I'd like something that behaves like very hard wood. Yes, you can scratch and ding it, but not easily and not all the time with every move.

I'm confused. Which 'top' are you looking for, the countertops proper, the island top or the tabletop for the nook? Or am I not understanding what is going on anymore?

Didn't you want enameled or something like it for the nook table?

If you are going for a 20s thing (right?), have you considered marmoleum for the nook top? I know that can have designs inlaid. Not sure how the edge treatment would be other than the metal edging....wood maybe? They used (real) linoleum quite a lot back then, correct?

I once found a skinny little cabinet with a metal edging around the wrecked linoleum top, so we took off the linoleum, cut a piece of thin plywood to fit and I starched a beautiful little embroidered table runner and glued it to the plywood, then plexiglass and then reinstalled the metal edging. It was really cute and that plexiglass top held up perfectly for the 10 years that it was next to my fridge. There is always a way, is my point. I have no doubt that your kitchen will be a showplace, Marcolo..

What Deedles said: howzabout linoleum? It might not be completely inauthentic, can be had in black, and really cushions the crystal. Need to be creative on the edges and with the sink area of course, but it makes a really nice counter surface.

The soapstone bit is for the perimeter countertops and maybe the island.

(This is all theoretical--I get bids next month. Anyway.)

The porcelain enamel is for the tabletop, first, if I can have it. And second, and less likely, for the island top. Has a sink in it, so it might not work. But in this era, there would've been a worktable and it would've been porcelain enamel.

I can't make myself do the lino thing for countertops. For the floors, I'm considering it, if I can get the color right. But I just can't feel it for the countertop.

I just started abusing my Dorado samples. The Minas is almost as pathetic as the Barocca. The Anasazi holds up well, but mine's a Verde, and that won't work. I still like the Indigo, which is pretty robust, but I've never read any comments about it here on GW.

MArcolo,

Here is my Belvedere sample. The green or no green depends on the quarry. We have this from the San francisco M.tex.

Another option is this I really liked called black stellaris. It was very quiet in a leathered finish which was quite matte.

There is a substance that is fairly vintage authentic (OK more 40's than 20's, but still vintage), comes in several variations of black, and won't scratch like your soapstone samples. It's also relatively inexpensive, so if you tired of it, you could replace it. Of course, I'm talking about laminate. Wait---don't dismiss it out of hand! Really, it's only downside is the undermount sink thing, and if you use a large topmount sink with a drainboard, that's not really an issue either. Really think about it, because it has most of what you want in a counter.

Well, that's a shame re. the eponymous Unerectors. Sorry to lead you astray.

Hmm, in terms of porcelain shops willing to take on small jobs, there are the old standbys of Independence Enamel (to continue the risible name theme, "a subsidiary of Gaylord Industries") or Custom Ceramic Coatings. Both of whom are far away from you in the Midwest, and I know a few years back one of them was taking a long hiatus. Like most good things in my world, they're dependent on the fragile health of a rapidly aging craftsman.

My copper is actually mounted on moisture-resistant mdf, not plywood, but I see your point. I suppose I was thinking that sheet steel, being much thicker than stainless, would have inherent tensile strength that makes an underlayment unnecessary.

Possibly cheaper and more durable than porcelain, and certainly a lot more accessible, would be powder-coating. You'd retain the look you want. There are lots of metal shops who would bend you a perfectly measured countertop out of base steel -- then you'd haul it over to Mickey's Auto Body and let them have their way with it. I was thoroughly impressed with the dude that bent the copper bar for my edging and how exact the work was - he nailed the radii perfectly. With powdercoating, you wouldn't have to worry about liquefying the underlayment. I know folks who had their St.Charles metal cabinetry powdercoated and it's held up very nicely, no chips so far. Looks just like porcelain.

For the sink cutouts, do you want drop-in or undermount or what? Either way, steel can be seamlessly welded to create a 1.5" or 2" lip that functions just like the edge of a solid surface, and the whole schmear would be coated.

This is copper, but same idea, just with a lip around the cutout:

Hi Marcolo,
Have you gone to Boston Granite Exchange? We went there, without having a fabricator - just to browse, and found it very helpful. They had so many slabs of black/darker granites and soapstone. They're all labeled and maybe taking a couple of hours to see all of the slabs in person will help you narrow down which ones have green undertones, etc., Then you can get samples of the ones you definitely liked in person. I also found it helpful to see the stones on a larger scale, as opposed to the smaller samples. Just a thought and good luck!

Here is a link that might be useful: Boston Granite Exchange

I looked at Indigo, but the whole slab had more movement than I was after. It's a stone from India, and muttering among at least one fabricator was that it was tough to work with (flaking in cutting, if I remember right).

Anyway, I know that Central NE Soapstone has done at least one installation recently. If you have a fabricator in mind, I'd check with them.

I wound up going with a slab with no name that Cent. NE had on hand in around their yard -- medium hardness (3.8) with some, but not an overwhelming amount of veining. It seemed fine on the fingernail and key tests (not so much with the softer samples I had picked up.) So far so good. It's been in for about 3 weeks.

GreenDesigns, I don't think there's anything that laminate needs to be ashamed of. But it really doesn't fit the era. I'd have no problem using it in a newer house.

circus, I spoke to Custom Ceramic Coatings this morning. The guy is unbelievably nice. We're going to email pictures back and forth. Prices are not too bad. I'm more worried about the shipping back and forth, and also the difficulty of coordinating a GC, designer, enameler and sheet metal shop.

chris, thank you so much for reminding me of BGE. We're heading up to the North Shore on Saturday and that's close enough for a swing by. Perfect timing.

chesters house, interesting about the flaking. It seems to have a sort of leathered finish and does not need oiling on the finished side.

I keep finding info on the Internet that says Formica was used a lot in the 1920s. Apparently, Formica was developed around 1913, but many improvements were made throughout the 1920s. Don't know if you want to use it, but I think it would be authentic.

Also, have you looked at Buck County soapstone? I keep reading about it, but don't know how durable it is. Here's a picture... {{!gwi}}From Farmhouse plans

And what about a wood island? Teak is supposed to be especially good for countertops with sinks...I mean they use it for boats, right? :) {{!gwi}}From Farmhouse plans

Here is a link that might be useful: Formica in the 1920s

I got a sample of walnut from Craft Art. Very easy to scratch and dent. Other manufacturers offer harder woods but make samples difficult to order.

Back to the slate again. Have you considered the charcoal gray slate from the quarry in Buckingham VA? I don't know the actual name because around here it's just known as Buckingham slate & everyone knows what you're talking about. It's naturally a solid, dark gray (maybe a slight hint of a bluish cast but no green that I've ever seen) & black when oiled & I believe it's supposed to be very hard. I've had 3 hearths made of it for over 20 years & no shaling.

Here is a link that might be useful: Buckingham Slate

marcolo- do you have any local sawmills? They should have some other options as far as harder woods. Locust, osage orange (hedge), persimmon, dogwood, ash, pecan, hickory, and many more are at least twice as hard as black walnut, and grow in many areas of the US. Some have a much busier grain than others, like hickory, and some have interesting colors, like osage.

I visited the cabinet/stone place yesterday. The Belvedere looks pretty tough and not green at all. I just need to wait for samples. They also sell slate and wood countertops as well. It would be nice to get everything in one place if it's not a million bucks.

Here are some more scratch tests from the Dorado sample kit, both pre- and post-oiling. Sorry, I have to go back to the basement to check the labels, but I think these run:

On the left:
Minas
Anasazi (unfortunately for me this is Verde, too green)
Indigo

On the right:
I forget
I forget
Noir

Same order but turned sideways.

Bummer that the noir is cracked. However, I would not 100% rule it out just for that. Could be a fluke.

As you can see, most scratched pretty easily except for the Noire and the Indigo. Also, most of these are quite green so they're out for that reason, too.

I like the bottom row middle one, how does that one handle the scratch test?

It definitely scratches to white. Also the veins are green.

Re: your butcher block samples--Hardwood Lumber Co recently sent me samples of everything I wanted within a few days and with no shipping charges. I heard about them from Francoise i think. They have good reviews on Gardenweb.

marcolo,

My DIY Piracema (no longer available and green so a non starter in that regard) came in from M Tex. horribly banged up (they made it right for me) but I had no choice but to go ahead and fabricate it anyway. Here, you can see the chips - and the oiled/non-oiled view.

That said, it really failed all the soapstone trials, but made for a fabulous countertop. I never regretted for a minute having it after the initial shock of seeing the edge of the slab crumbled like dusty, dried play doh.

I had a few chips by the sink, but that's what happens when you use Le Creuset and All Clad and have a kid on clean up duty. I also cook with somewhat wild abandon and will toss things towards the sink, etc.

All I'm saying is that while accidents happen, sometimes these tests can knock out a stone that will perform just fine if you let it.

marcolo,
I had been looking through my notes for this, and finally found it. Check out madeamano.com. They seem to be an Italian alternative to pyrolave counters and from what I've read, less expensive. They also make tiles out of the stuff. Absolutely breathtaking designs.

Wow, that madeamano stuff is beautiful. I don't see any US distribution on the site.

I met someone yesterday who has pyrolave countertops, she said they're a lovely matte grey, but the problem is that they are very very porous and she has to seal them quite often. She didn't know the exact brand. So, fyi, for what that's worth.

In other random tidbits, there's a gorgeous 1900's Frigidaire on the Maine Craigslist today: http://maine.craigslist.org/atq/3141664432.html

Did we already rule out coated patina'd zinc? Or vintage lab counters?

Yeah, what about the lab counters? Who had those on here... they looked great, I thought.

I just used an online site that lets you get quick prices for metal countertops. For my island with an integrated sink, zinc comes in around 6-7K and pewter over 10K.

Yeah, what about the lab counters? Who had those on here... they looked great, I thought.

That would be mamagoose. They are beauts, indeed:

Here is a link that might be useful: more pics on the DIY Soapstone thread.

Hi Marcolo,

I may have missed this on this and other threads, but for your island top have you considered laminate with a metal band (more 1930s and 40s than 1920s?) or a tile? When we moved into our 1928 house the previously unrenovated kitchen both tile and laminate with metal band counters. I know all the arguments against tile counters in terms of hygiene and function-- but they could add a lot of style.

Not very good examples:

{{!gwi}}

{{!gwi}}

MamaGoose has beautiful countertops and if you could find something similar...that would probably be just about perfect, for your space.

If not, I know you don't like 'Formica' but I thought these were soapstone, when I first looked at this 'scullery' link. It's been posted on the forum, before...but I thought you might like a second look. The Marmoleum floors look great with these countertops, too. This may not be your style, but it might give you some ideas :)

Here is a link that might be useful: Link to Scullery and kitchen

Marcolo,

I just got a promotional email from Dorado Soapstone. The substance of it made me think of your quest. The email says:

Noire Soapstone

Black, Hard, Small White Veins

Are your customers asking for soapstone without any green in it?

For slab or bundle pricing (508) 842-5701 - email: John@DoradoSoapstone.com

[blah blah blah]

The email purported to show pix of these slabs, but they were evidently not attached. I have no connection with Dorado Soapstone (or anyone else). Just thought you may be interested.

Here is a link that might be useful: Dorado

I got the same email from the Dorado in Austin. Mine did have pictures and all the slabs were very dark with small veining.

Marcolo --> Did you ever decide on your countertop?

Howdy.

My favorite is from Bucks County, but I need to contact them to figure out how to get their product in Boston.

I liked a couple of the Dorados, including the Noir, but the Noir arrived cracked.

I've given up on Texeira because their MA distributor is non responsive.

I've given up on Teixeira because their MA distributor is non responsive.

That's really a shame for you. Umm, I guess I am glad I live in an area that doesn't have a distributor! How is that for a statement to make a businessperson's toes curl?

Mysteriously, I got an email from them almost immediately after posting my comment....

Wow.

That bathroom vanity Of Kevinmp is reminiscent of porcelain enamel and has many of the attributes you are looking for. It is not boring, but doesn't scream. I did not read every single post here so I don't know your initial thoughts about that stone.

Kevin has an old, old house-very nicely and thoughtfully done. Take another look, Marcolo. Sometimes a second or third look grabs you.

Still no problems. It seems bulletproof.

Most of the suggestions on this thread made it onto my list to see in person during stoneyard visits. The favorite so far is from Bucks County but I haven't settled on it yet.

Now I'm sort of hopping from project to project. Today we played with Marmoleum samples (why do the yellows all have to be so damn bright?), Saturday is a trip to look at sinks. And since the entire home industry is closed on Sunday, we get only one day a week to look for everything.

Marmoleum's non-bright yellows are listed as neutrals: Butter, Citrine, van Gogh; Carribean, Moonstone and Barbados also might go.

Bucks County's stone is really nice. I wasn't that crazy about their video selections though (they didn't have much in-person when I was there).

Back to the drawing board.

I had settled on Alberene Church Hill (I misspoke above when I said Bucks). Gave them a call to get pricing on my countertop layout, and it turns out they've stopped quarrying it. There's a slim chance they might start again over the next few months, but I can't depend on it.

Texeira is out because I will not do business with their local distributor. (Too bad because their cabinetry is very nice and the price wasn't completely insane. But if my experience is like this when you're trying to sell me, what will it be like during the reno?) So I guess that means no Belvedere, not that I was ever going to get a sample of that before the Second Coming.

I have an email in to Dorado but unfortunately a lot of their stones in the sample kit don't work for what I am looking for.

What stoneyards around here have the best soapstone selection? Garrity?

Quick update--already a reply from Dorado suggesting a dark Beleza or a quiet Noir. We'll see. I notice a lot of Dorado's samples are fiber-backed.

Emailed Bucks County a few days ago but no reply.

Marcolo- Forgive me if I'm offbase here, but we visited Alberene week before last (we live in WA state and were visiting relatives who live near Charlottesville) and you're right about them having very little Church Hill. But-they are quarrying Old Dominion, which is gray with a range of different veining possibilites (dramatic to sparse). As an aside, it was also incredibly cool to get a tour of the site and the factory. I thought you might be interested in another choice of Alberene. I wish we had known about them when we chose our soapstone.

Thanks, leela4. Old Dominion does give a good look, but it's too soft for me (although not as delicate as Barocca).

We used Bucks County for our soapstone and they were WONDERFUL to deal with FWIW. Good luck! LOVE my soapstone!!

I love my Old Dominion so much but you are right, it is not as tough as some soapstone but it has held up well for our family. I keep an eye on Alberene's Facebook page and have seen the Church Hill come and go, maybe it is worth using temporary counters until it is available again?

Bucks County has a good reputation, but the pics I've seen show a very veiny stone, which is not what I need. Plus, as I say, how 'bout returning an email?

No temporary counters here, athomeinva--this reno has to be one and done!

Marcolo, this isn't necessarily for you, but for someone who might be considering linoleum type counters in the future. When we were first married, we lived in an old farmhouse that had red lino floors, and red lino counters, perfect U shape postwar remodel, sigh. (It looked like they used the cutout of the floor to do the counters!) I don't know if the problems came with the age of the lino, or what, but every time I tried to lift something warm up off the counter, it would stick fast. So, things like a bowl of soup or a bowl of oatmeal would stick. When I'd finally pry the bowl up, a small chunk of linoleum would be stuck to the bottom of the bowl. Yuck! We were very happy when we could replace those counters with some laminate.

I hope you find that durable finish you are after. Have to wonder if hard wood countertops might be a good option. I think they'd still give you somegrounding with the colors you are considering. This kitchen is especially bright, is it grounded enough?