My cabinets were just installed so I don't know about the dishes, but there were no installation problems for upper and lower cabinets. I am doing under cabinet lighting. My contractor had a great idea to make the under cabinet lighting look great and hidden. He is lining the area over the cabinets and below the cabinets with an unbroken layer of contemporary trim. Below are a few pictures - if you look closely, you will notice the flat continuous line below the cabinets that look very cool and contemporary. I love the way they look!

http://www.flickr.com/photos/remodeleze/3293837636/in/set-72157618195358344/

http://www.flickr.com/photos/remodeleze/3875938714/in/set-72157618195358344/

Not sure if your kitchen is contemporary. Honestly, so many people do frameless cabinets that I doubt that there would be issues with installation and weight in upper cabinets.

Bump.... does anyone store dishes or heavy items in the uppers on frameless? Stability issues? Thanks!

I have 2 sets of dishes (12 place settings) in my upper frameless cabinets (Brookhaven) -- no less stable than any framed cabinet I've had. Installation is no significantly different that a framed full overlay as far as I can tell. The crown is attached to a strip added to the top of the cabinet and we used a light rail trim strip to conceal counter lighting underneath.

My frameless cabinets have been in for 6+ years, and they are wonderful. I have several sets of dishes and lots and lots of heavy stuff in the upper cabinets, they are very sturdy and stable, much more than the cheap framed cabinets that I replaced with good quality cabinets. I wouldn't worry.

My undercabinet lighting, Seagull, low voltage xenon strip lights, was installed under the cabinets and then a small light rail was installed in front of the lights.

lisadlu
I have been following your thread a while. it seems like you want to do modern slab framelss cabinets and you are not quite sure how that will look and function. The best place to get a feel for what that looks like and feel like are at the following places:

Ikea, lost cost, good quality for value, great function.

If you can find German or Italian cabinet dealer/showroom in your town, you should go and look. This is what expensive frameless cabinets can do for you. Go and shake the cabinets and open and shut the doors. You may or maynot want this type of look but at least you get to see one end of the spectrum.

Kraftmaid used to make Valencia line. (not sure anymore) They tried but they did not look so good. I believe all KM are frameless contruction.

Another great source for frameless slab modern look is to go your local AIA office/web site and look at the portfolio of architects. You may get/ask for referrals to custom frameless cabinet makers that the architects use in town. They may have a showroom that you can see. This is a good source for local custom cabinet makers that know how to do modern slab look.

One of the essential part of doing modern slab cabinets where the veneer is left to show wood grains starts at the veneer selection process. The cabinet maker has to have the "eye" and know how to lay out the grains to maximize what he/she has. If you hire someone that has the "technical" ability but does not have the feel for the looks, you can get well constructed cabinets that look really ugly. I have seen plenty of these cabinets. I have also seen beautifully laied out veneer cabinets that had very poor construction quality!

hope this helps.

They also have to pay extra for higher grade veneer. If you start with cheap, terrible looking grains, you are not going to get great looking cabinets. In order to do this, the cabinet maker has to charge more to be able to allow for more wastage and to use higher grade raw material......

Try to imagine making a dress/upholster using fabric that has bigger print patter that need to be matched well. You have to buy a larger quantify of fabric.

I have Brookhaven frameless now, installed in Oct 04. Lots of dishes and heavy objects in the uppers, no problems. And I had frameless previously, in this kitchen. I'm guessing that they were installed in the late 70s or early 80s based on the look. And clearly not the very best quality cabs either. I kept all my dishes and glasses and heavy objects in those as well, as did previous owners. No problem with the stability or contruction.

It's a myth, mostly perpetrated by vendors who sell framed only, that frameless are in any way inferior to framed.

you should be more concerned with the quality of your cabinet brand/manufacturer/maker for the stability of your cabinets than concerned whether they're frameless or not.
This is the advice you should follow. Whether you get framed or frameless, the quality of the work of the manufacturer you choose is paramount.

The undercab lighting's been discussed above but yes, I have undercabinet lighting. You just need a light rail to hide it. My KD recommended ordering a particular molding from Brookhaven instead of their standard light rail since it looks better. So it's very workable -- UC lighting is not a problem with frameless cabs.

Oh, and my cabs were installed by the Brookhaven rep's installer. He had no problem at all installing them. Just make sure whoever installs them is familiar with frameless. If your installer or contractor or whoever is grumbling that frameless are harder to install, get someone else!

I use my uppers as a pantry and I have many cans of food stored in them. I installed them myself and there are no stability issues.

I have had my Kraftmaid framelesss since 1989. We own six different sets of dishware along with the literal ton of numerous heavy serving dishes and casseroles. We have never had any problems. If I could take these cabs with me when I finally leave this house, I would do it. I love them - lots of extras, good quality materials, will last for decades more.

I don't have undercab lights. They didn't have them when I was doing my kitchen in 1989, LOL! I have sufficient overheads plus a ton of daylight, so for us lighting is not an issue.

The only issue with any cab, frameless or framed, is materials. Particleboard (which mine are) are much heavier than plywood cabs. It's best to have 2 people doing the install.

Properly installed there are NO issues with frameless cab strength. That's assuming, of course, the quality of cabinet material is adequate to begin with. I've seen a lot of cheap cab construction over the last ten years, that is vastly inferior material to what was used in my mid-priced cabs.