I'd rather it be the first way. It jumped out at first glance that your usable counter space is reduced in the second. The first doesn't feel extremely closed, but it seems IMHO that the area won't get used if the counter space is next to nothing and, therefore, difficult in which to work.

1 thing you've done right is to put drawers in the base cabinets.

This house needs an architect advisor. Someone who is an "interior architect". I think the problems are bigger than kitchen.

I prefer the first one. If you're making a snack, you're there for what - 10 minutes? - so it doesn't matter and when I bake I make one heck of a mess and it doesn't need to be on display.

I have a couple of concerns - (just a note - I can't read the plans very well and can't seem to expand them)

-what is the distance between the corner of the island and the wall of the baking/snack center - it looks quite narrow.

-you have a large island so I don;t think that the sink needs to be directly across from the stove - that's where the prep area should be. I'd move the sink down.

-Where is the DW? ovens? Fridge? (can't read them)

I've missed your other posts on this but this seems to be a bit of a hodge/podge to me. But, perhaps it's already been discussed and this is the best result given your needs and any constraints.

breezy, thanks. I think what happened is we enlarged the pantry a foot and lost that on the counter. I'm thinking I want the fridge/freezer separated, with less use of the freezer, it gives closer counter access to the fridge. Are you talking about the openness of the counter in the second? The theory behind that from DD1 was open counter, access for kids on three sides, therefore, better for baking. But, I can see your point, and need to consider that strongly.

davidro1 and blfenton, you are probably correct. "Problems bigger than the kitchen" and "Hodge Podge". I think that this is precisely why I am downtrodden and can't make that decision. MANY on GW have tried to help me, they really have.
Blfenton, the DW is next to the clean up sink located on the bottom in front of the window. Considering a second in snack/baking area, and I'm seeing it as most likely.
The distance between that wall and island is 42". We have a table set up there now to see how it works with traffic flow and will clip or narrow island if it seems too tight. Right now, it's working fine, but we haven't had the 20 people inside yet. And, the sink has been relocated as in the second plan.

I was thinking of having a barn door which will slide over the orphaned wall, it would enable us to close up the open counter in the second plan. But, a permanent wall may be better.
I can't get excited or fired up about this. I went to Oklahoma for a few days thinking a break would be refreshing, but all for naught. Dang it!

there is too much space. Unpurposed. An interior architect will be a good person to consult. Or, design to have two kitchens.

ah! i thought the one pantry looked different!

I think you are right about splitting the frzr/fridge

i'd keep the oven on the wall it is w/ frzr/fridge on either side of sink. you don't have to turn in to open your fridge and the oven is by the counter to set items on. use a safe counter for hot things or trivet etc.

glad you moved the prep sink down a bit

how about rounding the corners of the island counter just a bit? so no one gets stabbed? with lots of people/kids jostling around it can easily happen. I do it to myself when I'm alone!

looove the idea of a sliding barn door! I think you might want it more open also when alone w/dh and you are in/out of there baking/working. It makes sense to be more open w/the gkids there also. but sometimes closed off a bit more? - yes! the barn door is the perfect solution.

No matter what I suggest it seems to create another issue.

For example - the clean up sink and DW are really far from where the mess is being created which is on the far side of the island and at the table when you're finished eating. I would probably put the clean-up sink and DW in the baking/snack center because it is closer to the eating area and will also address the baking mess.

Perhaps the current sink/DW area (at the bottom 0f your plans) can be your snack center with a small sink, small fridge but then, see, it's too far from the pantry. That wall of the kitchen is really too far from anything to be useful to the cook. YOu could however make it into a nice buffet hutch area for good dishes or make it a drinks/bar area with a small sink and drinks fridge for the family and for entertaining.

Your kitchen is supposed to have a work triangle to it anchored by the sink, stove and fridge. You have taken the fridge out of the plan to the point where you are going to have to walk across a very wide traffic path to get to it - back and forth, back and forth. The fridge should be in the same area as the stove and island with the prep sink.

I suspect that what happened is that you got caught up in all the pretty details because they are more fun and neglected the biggest factor and that is a working kitchen plan. If your kitchen doesn't function properly no amount of pretty details is going to help and no matter how pretty it is you will hate it if it doesn't work. Put down all of your tools until you get a floorplan that produces a functional kitchen.

One thought is to move the stove down (DH will hate me) put the prep sink up in the middle of the island and then put the fridge on the range wall at the DR end. Ovens can stay in the baking area.

DON'T move anything until you have finalized plans. I gather the pantry is done and set - what else is set?

You do need more help than I can give you but right now your kitchen doesn't work. You need to centralize it more and one way is to bring it up by not using that bottom wall for a cook specific activity. Don't use it as a prep zone, a cooking zone or clean-up zone. It's too far away.

These are just my thoughts and suggestions and they may not work for you and may not make sense.

Thanks Desertsteph. I LOVE Barn doors, we have already purchased a lot of reclaimed wood from an old 150 yr train depot. So, the kitchen will have a lot of rustic elements in it. Love the pantry. We are finishing up the bead-board on the walls/ceiling now, and it's looking good.
(NOW IF I COULD JUST GET HAPPY!)

blfenton, you bring up valid points. Most of them have addressed, the range/fridge location has structural issues. I have considered refrigerator drawers in the island, would that help? I'll have to think about switching the current clean up and making it the baking area but I really like a window while cleaning.
The pantry is set, range, plumbing in island, and I *think* everything else is changeable. Thanks for your suggestions.

yes, her kitchen has had issues to work around. the stove wall staying as is (and beautiful cabs there), dh / tv area and his wishes. lots of kids w/spouses & gkids coming over and helping to fix the meals etc. room for everyone...

the only other thing I can see now is to put a partial wall at the end where a cab ends now next to the sink on the lower wall. put you fridge there facing toward the other wall.

leave the window area open or put a partial/short counter there meeting up w/the corner area. A corner sink? prep under the window? it'd all be close to the stove. fridge would be close to dh and tv area. have dish drawers in that area.

or put in lots of under counter fridge drawers in that area and use the one in the snack area for extra stuff / over flow. have your big clean up sink in there w/dw.

Bigger opening to family room, but try out the view of the freezer before deciding.

1. Yellow work table up against wall fragment - more of an ok height for kids. Table and wall could be a little bit longer - like 18" for a total of about 36" x 54".

2. Green undercounter oven - possibly a speed oven. Could be separate as shown or built into the side of the island.

susie - you still with us? you didn't collapse in a corner in the fetal position did you? lol!

lol!

I've been silently following this thread.
I would love for Susie to work everything out :-)

me too!

ME TOO

Bmore, good idea. I have a mocked up 36" "cabinet" I could put where you have the worktable. I'll try that tomorrow and see how it looks.
Only problem with #2 is I had planned to have a 36x36 table there for the grandkids to sit when they are just hanging out or for me and DH when it is just us two.
OR how about switching it, 1 for oven, and 2 the worktable? hmmmmmmmmmm

Should I put seating in island instead of the original plan of a straight one?

desertsteph, that fetal position comes in handy after all that sangria. lol
Had a family reunion to attend this weekend, don't you just love those things?

You can if you want to. If its the oven, you should have a little counter next door to it for emergency landings. I'd put the oven near the family room entrance and the counter towards the kitchen - so, still about a 4 foot opening to the family room then 30" for ovens and about 24" of counter.

Kids can bake in the room, but mix at their table?

If you've got the chance to watch the general layout in use, think about the stools thing while you watch the crew cook. I believe you have enough cabinetry so you could skip a couple of base cabinets on that side just fine.

(I shouldn't say this, really, I shouldn't say anything!) but have you seen the haier ref drawers? Might be inexpensive enough to fold into the island? Comes in white...

Here is a link that might be useful: Amazon listing

bmore, I have been looking for drawers on CL and I see them often, so I'll probably go that route.

On another note, I put an arch around the counter to close it up a bit,and I think it looks ok.

We have the "cabinet" there for today, and the kids and I are going to bake cookies over there, will see how it works!
But, what do you all think of the look? It won't be an arch, but it will have a more closed look with the header and door.

Yeah, but what you're asking is how I would work vs. how you work - so I don't know if this will have any value.

In my crystal ball of how I think your kitchen works, I would do the kids table as workspace for them baking on the end of the island. I don't think it would work for ME to push them out of the main kitchen. I'm not sure its possible to carry on a conversation with anyone in the kitchen at that distance without yelling - so I don't think the opening as social works.

I would ask if the whole reason for the opening is that you're thinking something like "As long as I'm stuck back there...". That's kind of a sign for me that the kids zone is stuck in the wrong place.

I thought it worked pretty well as a closed pantry, ref enclosure and part time cleanup.

LIGHTBULB!!

Thanks bmore!! (going around house saying bmore may be our hero, bmore may be our hero)

I'm happy for you but don't worry about it if you change your mind later. cough :)